Ancient weapons thread(torture devices and surgical utensils also welcome)

Discussion in 'History' started by Dr Lou Natic, Apr 4, 2004.

  1. A Canadian Why talk? When you can listen? Registered Senior Member

    not to sound like a mass murder, but old wepons where cool, so innovative in their time

    hand to hand combat was more sofisticated than guns...

    if you had a beef withsomeone youd fight them with how well you could use our wepon

    2 poeple of equal wieght and age and stength, one carrys light wight armor able to withstand certain blows from a sword, is a amuture swords men, and carrys a shield which he is poorly trained at and has a Light sword, easyer to use, the other has a heavyer/longer sword, is a professional swordman, and only wears leather armor to stop only certain nicks and straches on the skin but wont protect from a fatal blow, but it is easyer to move in

    who would win, depending on your skills and your choice of gear, it could be anyones game, but only the true warrior would survive, you would prove yourself

    it sure beats holding up a liquor store with a sawed off shot gun and get away car
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  3. A Canadian Why talk? When you can listen? Registered Senior Member

    we should bring back hand to hand combat (excluding wreslting, unless you thing you could beat someone that way when they where holding a wepon)

    the earths population is booming as it is, why let let poeple kill each other for fun if they know may just die
    if no one is killed within the 90 second time slot, the fight will end and both men will fight, if using a wepon you must avoid blows to the head or vital organs if possible. thoes are just a few rules i tought of

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!

    i know id watch such a show... or am i sounding demented
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  5. certified psycho Beware of the Shockie Monkey Registered Senior Member

    It it also be used as a torture device. Non-stop poking of the victim
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  7. Fenris Wolf Banned Banned

    Well, yes.... but nearly anything can be used as a torture device. I have on my computer desk a couple of empty beer bottles, a cigarette lighter, a candelabra, a coffee mug (ceramic), an electronic alarm clock, a joystick, a pair of nail clippers and a leatherman knife among other bits and peices. I imagine I could keep someone screaming for days with that lot and a certain amount of ... imagination. Would you like to volunteer?
  8. certified psycho Beware of the Shockie Monkey Registered Senior Member

    No I wouldn't want to be a volunter to sick games. And from what it sounds like you have a desk that is waiting to hurt somebody or kill.........
  9. Fenris Wolf Banned Banned

    Yes, I have to keep it in chains. It's very vocal about the whole thing, and can be annoying at times, particularly when I am trying to write something. Concentrating on images of 17th century English manor homes is rather difficult when your desk is screaming for blood.

    And you have absolutely no idea what it's like when the mormons show up at my door... I have to gag it by tying the drawers shut.
  10. guthrie paradox generator Registered Senior Member

    Ahh, certified phsycho, im not an expert, but know a few. On second thoughts, the spear thingies look more Indian. They had some interesting and different weapons as well. I am sure the net has all you could want to know about them.

    And Fenris wolf, the Naginata was originally an infantry weapon, but ended up being used in a somewhat stylised fashion by said ladies. I'd like to know how it came that they kept up practise with it, rather than men. As far as I know, the weapon women were more intended to be able to use was a wee knife, tanto or similar.
    There were one or two cannon in medieval europe that consisted of many barrels all stuck together in one unit, of course the problem was that it took a long time to reload. More modern case shot and stuff is far better for close in work.
    That pic above of a big crossbow thing, there were even funkier weapons called springalds, that worked by a pair of twisted ropes, like in an onager, but theres two of them, set up parralell and vertical, such that they were then used to fire arrows, heavy arrows, a long way. they were used to pick of besiegers from teh walls of a castle.
  11. Fenris Wolf Banned Banned

    Yes, "developed from an earlier battlefield weapon" as I said.
    I've done some research, the martial art practised by the Japanese noblewomen was Kata - stylised "forms" in which they developed strength and concentration. Apparently some of the better practicioners were able to compete with a Samurai swordsman on equal terms (although this is true of many polearms). I've no idea how or why the Naginata came to be a household defence weapon in the Edo period, haven't been able to find anything on that.

    Modern Japanese still practise the "atarashi naginata", basically a combat martial art using this weapon, and the Kata survives to this day.
  12. Blazin_billy Registered Senior Member

    Back on topic, I was reading two book:

    "The most evil people in history"
    "The age of Gladiators"

    And there are some pretty gruesome methods of torture:
    -Smear honey on a person and drop bee nests around them.
    -In anceint Rome, a group of noxii (people condemmed to death) were thrown into the arena and only one had a knife and was to kill them all.
    -Another Roman way is to bring in two noxii, one with a knife. The man with the knife would kill the other and a guard would take it and give it to the next man in line to kill the ex-killer and this continued till everyone died.
    -The "Bitch of Bulwanda" climbed on a tower adn flashed the oncoming jew prisoners. Anyone who looked up would be shot be a gaurd.
    -Vlad the impaler boiled peoples heads alive.
    -He also nailed Turikish emissaries hats to their head after they refused to take them off.
    -Ivan the terrible through cats and dogs of high buildings just to watch them die a pianful death.
  13. Dr Lou Natic Unnecessary Surgeon Registered Senior Member

    In ancient greek mythology Dirce was tied to a raging bull by her hair and set to be dragged untill dead.
    Now thats a cool way to kill someone.
    Thats just mythology but the ancient greeks would re-enact punishments from mythology to criminals for entertainment so you just know heaps of people were dragged to death by bulls.
  14. Arkon Shazbot. Registered Senior Member

  15. Addicted Archer Registered Member

    some of those are halberds. they are like kind of like spears, but more of an extended axe. i think they were used in asian cultures for first attack weapons.
  16. Roman Banned Banned

    Scissors katar

    These Indian punch daggers were pretty cool. You could catch an an enemy's blade with your katar (note the scissors action), then punch him in the face with another dagger. Royalty also used them for performing killing blows on tigers.

    They got pretty fancy, some had multiple blades, or were as long as swords.

    Some assorted katars. Number 15 has a blade that's more than 3 feet long.

    Bagh-nakh, or tiger claws.

    I'd rather fight with a short sword with a sharp point, a shield, and a javelin. With a couple buddy's it wouldn't be too hard to take out an equal number of barbarians armed with bastard swords.
  17. Addicted Archer Registered Member

  18. guthrie paradox generator Registered Senior Member

    What, with them all in your hand at once? Put it this way, against someone with a bastard sword who was of equal ability to you, you would probably win with sword and shield. If they were dressed authentically for using a hand and a half, youd probably use, since use of plate armour tends to make it hard to kill people.
  19. Roman Banned Banned

    Nah nah, traditional Greek style. I throw the counterweighted javelin into your guts, then draw the sword and finish you off.

    Hard to kill someone weraing plate armor, or hard to be killed while wearing plate armor? If I had to face down plate armor, I'd want a phalanx of spears at my back, and probably a crossbow.
  20. guthrie paradox generator Registered Senior Member

    WEll, lets see, the javelin could be fielded by the shield. Then, once thats out the way, your left with sword and shild against sword and shield. Or your sword and shiled versus my shield and spear, which gives me a reach advantage.

    Indeed, you would want a bunch of spears behind you facing lots of people in plate. Or as you say, a good crossbow, though they are expensive.
  21. idiot Registered Member

  22. invert_nexus Ze do caixao Valued Senior Member

    Well, I'd just break out my vorpal sword of sharpness +4 and roll a perfect 20 decapitating blow and voila no more Guthrie.
    Unless you made your saving throw, that is. And the DM were feeling lenient.

    Sorry, couldn't resist.
    This whole "Well, I'd do this and you'd do that" thing just totally reminds me of so many D&D conversations I've been privy to in my time.

    There is no perfect weapon or defense.
    Plate armor is bulky and might make you drop from heat prostration.
    The mace and other weapons were specifically designed to crack open armor like an egg shell.
    A cross-bow is one of the weapons meant to penetrate armor, but it's also slow and so you'd better hope you hit with the first hit.
  23. guthrie paradox generator Registered Senior Member

    Invert, you have seen the thread on why did muskets supersede bows? We went through much of the multifacetedness of warfare in it.

    Suffice to say my naked singularity trumps your sword any day.

    As for that heap of junk called the scorpion, how are you going to weild it and avoid cutting yourself?

    Anyway, as for plate making you drop form heat exhaustion, sometimes that did happen. Then there was the great siege of Malta in 1555 I think, where one or two did die of heat exhaustion, and the rest just killed jannissaries like they were children.

    Maces were designed to crack armour, but it wasnt always that easy to crack, but, if you hit the breastplate in the right place, you could restrict someones breathing enough taht they couldnt fight. et voila, one live and embarrased captive. There is a reason swords became less common on the battlefield in the 15th century, its because polearms were deadlier.

    Its also another reason you had mixed troops, of archers, cavalry, cheap pole armed levies and well armoured tinnies and various troops in between. The trick is in getting them in the right place at the right time.

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