" There were many large tribal nations, before the age of exploration. Probably the best example of a large tribal nation that was prosperous and well organized is the Cherokee Confederacy. " WOW, the Cherokee Confederacy was such a vast nation that it ruled over a whole 50,000 populace and today's estimates are about 370,000. Amazing. I think we should follow that example immediately. 400,000 is close enough to 300,000,000. " And the US is a democratic republic, btw." My personal belief is the "democratic" was added by arrogant Americans that wanted to brag about our "new" form of government. In other words, bullshit. " Also, I don't share the belief that land can be owned. It is a foreign concept to me. So "leaving" the US is a simple process, and I plan on doing it on my 18th birthday. " Where are you going to go where land is not owned? Also where are you going to go where tribal government rules? Are you going to live with the Cherokee?
hey all just a quick note on what could appear to be a glazed subject> money will buy you anything in any country so therefor all are capitalist! labels are mearly that that! those who follow labels follow service to self! the capitalist way....survival of the fittest. ! when will i not be imprisoned for killing a rich weak person so i may take all their money? Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image! and the world, so turns. on vicious burns. when will we learn, to just take turns? Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image! groove on all Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!
Just keep an eye out for any action in Genoa, which is hosting the G8 summit of world leaders on Friday. Anti-globalisation protesters have already begun to mass at the Italian port. I like the way Bush has just criticized anyone wishing to protest as "no friends to the poor".. "Those who protest against free trade seek to deny them from their best chance for escaping poverty." What are the benefits of free trade?... will the rich get richer?( as perhaps the anarchists believe). Aren't governments using these 'trade tools' as bargaining power for increased rights for people who live in countries that abuse human rights, such as China. I'm not stupid, I know there is a certain amount of self interest in these meetings....so, as my original question (at the beginning of this thread) intimates.... what are these anarchists protesting about? ... antiglobalisation? what's wrong with that? Capitalism? As ripleofdeath has mentioned, were all guilty of that... trade and capitalism have existed ever since civilization began!Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!
Biggles ... Bush has got a point. The poor do benefit - though not the poor in this country - but pay for it dearly (ex. the ecological mess the Mexican border towns have become). Yes, the rich will get richer. And as for it being a tool; why aren't corporations, with a little nudge from our government, investing in places like Afghanistan, or even Peru or Ecuador, where there are known 'human rights' problems, not concocted ones? Maybe what they're protesting about is the hypocrisy of it all.
Cherokee Actually, the Cherokee nation was 200,000 strong, before it was decimated by plagues brought by european invaders. And the Cherokee had a far superior form of government, that the US Constitution is largely based on. (don't belive me? Go read about the structure of the cherokee nations political system, compare it to what is in the constitution, and then look to see how much time the founding fathers spent studying with te Cherokee). And where will I go where land is not owned? Spoken like a true American. I will stay where I an right now, physically. America is a mental state, not a physcal one.
hey all yo biggles monopolies are not capitalist in the nature of trade so there for capitalism is doomed Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image! globalisation is another form of monopoly! lots of people have only bad examples of this because of all the perverted people who have run them! we need a new model of social accountability to conform to by all corperations. try and find someone who trusts a big corperation! scratch that!-try and find someone who trusts :/ globalisation is the key to advance our world !-however the people who might run it are not the people who will serve the world! service to self is the problem of most of those leaders! oh and gutlesnes they are afraid to try to change things for the better incase it doesnt work like all the countrys economies are doing rite now Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!/) figure that!.......? anywho groove on all Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!
" Actually, the Cherokee nation was 200,000 strong, before it was decimated by plagues brought by european invaders. And the Cherokee had a far superior form of government, that the US Constitution is largely based on. (don't belive me? Go read about the structure of the cherokee nations political system, compare it to what is in the constitution, and then look to see how much time the founding fathers spent studying with te Cherokee)." It does not matter since the government has never actually controlled more than 1/100 of our current population, or less than 1%. Because the framers studied with them does not make their government superior. In fact it supports that ours is superior. It would lead to the conclusion that the framers took what was there and improved on it. I really do not care who they studied with. If you can show that the tribal system would be able to handle a population of 300million people better than a republic then I might look at it as a viable alternative. You also said earlier that you were leaving on you 18th birthday. Now you say you are not? If you stay in this country, no matter what the mindset, you are a hypocrite. While you dip your hand into all of Americas luxuries you will close your eyes and say everybody else is promoting this horrible form of government. If you truly want to know how effective this system is move to China, India, or visit one of those wonderful 3rd world countries. And don't go visit a tourist magnet either. Go live with the average commoner there. Have fun Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image! Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!
Got a problem ... Corp.Hudson, Per you: Per the Tolatsga Organization - History of the Cherokee: What goes?
lol Spoken like a true american, once again. This conversation is not worth continuing. Once you take the blinders off, then I will discuss this further. Chagur- The US took the Cherokee's political system, and basically westernized it. Made it non-tribal, and tried to make it emulate the european system of doing things. Then, when the US got tired of having the Cherokee around, they destroyed their nation, and forced the Cherokee to adopt a western system of government. I am not explaining it very well, its hard to get out. Let me think of a better way to express myself...
hhhhhhhhhmmmmmmmmmm the fact of history as i interpret it is that all western societies are ego driven and thus fear and outcast all superior knoledge in a form of "other" culture. this makes it no different from hitlers book burning party politics. and maybe an equivilant in eastern terms might be that they killed all the people (a form of knoledge base) and then read the books and tried to reverse engineer their social systems. in fear of re-establishment. i am genralising wildly to illistrate a point! the real issues are easily boxed into racist issues because of the nature of the beasts illnes-EGO>FEAR Vs PRIDE>FEAR. SO CRINGE ALL YE MORTALS for the wroth of the ignorant superior(hang on?) beings[extra terrestrial] are uppon us as we stumble across our own trail of self perpetuating greef. striding into the fire of mistrust and FEAR OF fear. THIS CREATES an ideal enviroment for the only real ANARCHY that will prevail---- global capitalisation>dictating law and social policy. Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image! groove on all
Keeping you all up to date! A ring of steel was put up around the historic city of Genoa yesterday as it braced itself for an invasion of anti-globalisation protesters. Police fear the G8 summit, which starts in the Italian port tomorrow, will trigger rioting similar to that seen at last month's European Union meeting in Gothenburg. Roads leading to the city's Ducal Palace, where summit meetings will take place, were baracaded behind 13ft iron barriers. Genoa's airport, railway stations and harbour were all closed. Anti-aircraft missiles were deployed at the airport and naval vessels patrolled the seas. Local jails have been emptied to make room for the rioters. Up to 20,000 police and soldiers are patrolling the city. Up to 3,000 protesters are already thought to be in Genoa, birthplace of Christopher Columbus. Guards at the Italian/French border have turned away 700 people headed for the summit. A train chartered to carry hundereds of British protesters from Calais to Genoa was cancelled by the French national railway company, SNCF. My thought is, since when were these protesters organised enough to warrant anti-aircraft missiles, or Naval destroyers?Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!
Let's face it, people have the democratic right to protest (peacefully!) but now somone has lost their life. The anti-capitalists are quick to call him a martyr to the cause... but what is the cause? The G8 meetings' agenda was about dicussing "world health, poverty and debt relief" So let's suppose these actions are taken by a minority with the aim of causing maximum damage... a kind of weekend punch-up.. they've been banned from Soccer games in Europe.. so they need some-where else to let off steam!! As mentioned before by other writers in this thread... maybe their anger is not specifically directed at what is being discussed at these meetings, but simply the governments now representing the majority of the world... What-ever their motives... the Canadian G8 summit will now propbably take place in a remote bunker in some mountain. What has the young Italian died for??Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!
I came late to this thread. Posters are jumping all over except the topic. I have a headache just reading this. Does anybody have any clue where these demonstrators get money to go there and protest? Why these demonstrators have so much free time? Our western society is structured such a way that you can not have a lot of free time. You have to work to feed your habit, baby, car, or shelter. Are they all living in their parents house? Why? Who organizes and funds these protestors? How these people think the same thought? 3 people gather in this forum with 6 different thoughts!
Biggles ... 1. More likely than not on a private island; 2. Because he was in the wrong place at the wrong time - reason enough.
kmguru ... Committed or just for the hell of it! Tens of thousands have been doing it for decades - remember Woodstock? 1. They don't! Apparently you've never been to one; 2. Hell, and here I thought I was the only two-headed person on this forum (though come to think of it, there is HOWARDSTERN).
the protester attacked a police vehicle with a fire extinguisher if he was shot before he threw it then good job! if he was shot after it was thrown then it should be an offence! what would have happend if the fire extinguisher had of exploded in the police vehicle? they are declaring war on the police! they should not be surprised to have bullets coming in their direction, rite or wrong! what sensable person takes a fire Extinguisher to a gun fight? if i was going to attack armed people i would not do so with a stone or fire extinguisher! the guy was looking for trouble and he found it. now the only thing we can hope for is that the officer who shot him is held to account and tried in a court. good point about where do they get there money from!...? and are the police checking the crowds for soccer hooligans? AND! they have video cameras so if they wanted they could arrest the people who were throwing stones instead of beating anyone they could grab. BUT JUST STOP AND THINK ABOUT WHAT TYPE OF PERSON JOINS THE POLICE FORCE! more so in a country that has allot of violent crime. most will be 50% of the problem! groove on all Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!
Anarchy! Is to trust yourself to run your life. As instead of the goverment. Since somebody asked...Sweden has a socialistic goverment. And the demonstrations in Gothenburg were quite unique in Swedish history. The police didn´t even have any approprate means to control the demonstration, as they have in other countries. I´m a bit confused, in which side to stand on. I don´t support the police and neither do I support those who were throwing rocks at the policehorses and destroying stores and cars. It could have been a peaceful demonstration instead, but I´ve heard that people from other countries also came to join the riots and added to the hysteria.
For heaven sake, don't stand in the middle! We have found here in the US that a lot of times when there is going to be a demonstration that outside influences, such as national groups, who have their own axes to grind, get in to the demonstration. Their agendas are not the demonstration organizers agenda. They usually come to push things and instigate what would not normally take place. Such as the rock throwing. This makes it difficult to estimate what is required to control the mob. Which leads to escalation. You should be proud that your police were not equipped to handle such. It means that normally your people are very law abiding. IMO, if it were not for those outside influences most likely nothing untoward would have happened. It would have been just a demonstration. Peaceful. Welcome to the global economy and all that comes with it.
