A Livable Minimum Wage

Discussion in 'Business & Economics' started by scheherazade, Jan 6, 2018.

  1. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    The display software has trouble with American dollar signs, and it looks like that. (There's a workaround, if that's the issue - something to do with italics? Forget.)
     
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  3. quantum_wave Contemplating the "as yet" unknown Valued Senior Member

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    Minimum wage here in west central Florida is about 8.25, but that is just for entry level, and people with a few good work habits get periodic raises. Gas here is 2.20 a gallon, utilities are quite reasonable;

    We have many mild months, and we use our A/C set to 78 in summer and 68 in winter.


    A “big breakfast” at McD’s is 4.79 here (eggs, hash browns, biscuit, and sausage); coffee a dollar.


    I love flea markets and garage sales, and pick up bargains all the time, often at 50% to 90% off retail.


    We cut the cable and land lines a few years ago, but have plenty of high speed internet at 90/month, and our cell phones and device data plans run us 120, and we buy Netflix $25, but we both are online a lot.
     
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  5. scheherazade Northern Horse Whisperer Valued Senior Member

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    Interesting that McD's prices are quite similar based on ad info I receive in the mail and my internet runs 67.00 for 120 Gig of data, smart phone 89.25 and Shaw satellite is 75.00.
    We have a very active buy and sell on FB and I watch the points offers on Presidents Choice Financial. With in-store discounts on fresh meat and seasonal items, I can save plenty
    and I cook most things at home from scratch.
     
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  7. parmalee peripatetic artisan Valued Senior Member

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    Yeah, I'd forgotten about the regulatory aspects. It's the same here: technically, the wood stove is our auxillary and the propane heater--which isn't even hooked up properly--is our primary heating source.

    I can well imagine. When it hits -25 C here, it's almost like a full-time job keeping the wood stove running at the highest temps--even in a relatively small space.

    Out of curiosity, how low do you allow the indoor temp to drop when you are going to be out of the house for hours?
    ------------------


    I've always been a part of what is termed the "gig economy," ofttimes at the most extreme end of it, i.e., being paid a large chunk of cash for something which hasn't even as yet come to fruition. Fortunately, I inherited a good sensibility about all matters pecuniary from my parents; otherwise, I would have found myself with no money and no income for months and months on end. Likewise, being "paid" with perks--housing, meals, etc.--has allowed me to live in places which otherwise might have proved cost prohibitive.

    It seems that with most people--both from what I have read and what I have witnessed personally--spending habits fluctuate in direct correlation with their income. To a degree this makes sense, but I've noticed that some, when their available capital increases considerably, will spend vast amounts of money on things which had never seemed important to them previously--as though they are obligated to spend the money because they have it.
     
  8. scheherazade Northern Horse Whisperer Valued Senior Member

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    I keep the thermostat set on 65F largely because I have house plants that will not thrive at temperatures lower than that. Also, the amount of energy required to bring the thermal mass of the house back up
    when kept below that becomes greater than maintaining at 65F. With the wood heat on, the temperature ranges from 67-72F, warmest upstairs in the media room.
     
  9. Baldeee Valued Senior Member

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    1,116
    In the UK the statutory national living wage is £7.50 for employees over 25.
    That equates to c.£14k p.a. with this roughly being the level at which you would start paying income tax.
    So those on the NLW would theoretically pay zero (or minimal) income tax, and fairly low national insurance.

    For comparison of costs:

    McD costs about the same in GBP as it costs in USD in the states, so a 4-dollar meal in the US would cost 4 pounds.
    Petrol/diesel is c.£1.20 a litre, so that equates to c.6 USD per US gallon.
    Television costs anything from free up to £100 or so per month if you want the full package of up to date movies and entertainment, and sports etc.
    I have an unlimited usage 70 Mb/s connection that costs me c.£35 per month.

    The biggest cost for someone earning NLW would likely be rent.
    It's doubtful they would have saved enough for the deposit on a house of their own so would be renting, which can cost anything from £50 a week for a scuzzy bed-sit in a scuzzy place, up to £1,000s per week in central London for even a small flat.
    However, with mortgage rates so low at the moment, owning your own 2+ bedroom house is almost certainly the cheapest option, especially as you can then take in a lodger that would help cover some of the costs.
    But finding the money for a desposit won't be easy on the NLW, so it's an unfortunate cycle of paying the more expensive rent because you can't afford the deposit that would help reduce your costs.


    It is certainly possible to live on the statutory NLW but you'd always likely to have minimal savings, low personal pension plan, cars on the cheaper side etc.
    It would ultimately depend on what your rent is per year.
    If you have a partner and you both earn the NLW with full-time jobs then it becomes easier.
     
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  10. scheherazade Northern Horse Whisperer Valued Senior Member

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    Thank you for providing numbers, Baldeee. That is exactly the kind of thing I was looking for. Your minimum wage to living costs ratio is fairly similar.

    The comparison between currencies is of some interest since the British pound equals $1.69 Canadian and the US dollar is presently $1.25 Canadian. My friends who travel to Britain
    find the costs of meals to be quite high when looking at the exchange rates.

    It would appear that the minimum wage in these three nations does not enable a single income household to thrive and it would be a struggle just to get by.
     
  11. birch Valued Senior Member

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    4,544
    that has always been an issue. why society is set up so that it's always in a way that causes misery in some way, i have been puzzled by honestly all my life. this is because the problems are readily knowable and viewable to everyone and therefore somewhat or totally fixable/changable. why life is unfair when it doesn't have to be. why there is such a nonsensical extreme of those who having way too much (insanely so) and those having way too little (struggling, hardship, stressful).

    why can't the world be a happier, healthier place for everyone i do not know. people think my thoughts or reasoning are of utopia or childish but current reality never made logical sense to me either.
     
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  12. scheherazade Northern Horse Whisperer Valued Senior Member

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    Interestingly, there are many among the rich who would willingly pay more taxes. There are articles on-line to be found from 2011 onwards. The following link is from March 2017.

    Eighty people including George Soros, Steven Rockefeller and Abigail Disney wrote to lawmakers and Democratic Gov. Andrew Cuomo saying they and other top earners should pay more to support schools, roads, bridges and programs to help poor and homeless residents of the state.

    "Now is the time to invest in the long-term economic viability of New York,'' the letter reads. "We need to invest in pathways out of poverty and up the economic ladder for all of our fellow citizens, including strong public education from pre-K to college. And, we need to invest in the fragile bridges, tunnels, waterlines, public buildings, and roads that we all depend on."

    Many of those signing the letter are millionaires and all make more than $650,000, making them members of the state's top 1 per cent when it comes to income.

    http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2017/03/21/rich-new-yorkers-taxes_n_15518400.html

    We have more than enough, it is just not distributed equitably.
     
  13. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    3,681
    Not having enough money to pay the power bill or rent is one thing but any country that does not have free health care needs to do something.

    And a decent social security plan.
    Capitalism needs a percentage unemployed for many reasons but most of all as the goto way to co trol inflation... So if there will always be unemployed people the dole should be available and seen as a payment not to seek work.

    A 2% turnover tax apparently is enough to fund a Government with not other tax...
    Maybe more but even if double that sounds like the way to go... And makes ine wonder how much money is being tranfered around if a turn over tax seems to hold promise.
    My advice for anyone buy some real estate even if you cant live on it yet.
    Some where there will be land you can afford.. Buy it and some day you can set up there and not pay rent.
    Alex
     

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