What do you need for a patent?

Lets say you have an Internet idea that you like and you want to turn into your job. Suppose it was a language software and you had a new method of learning French. How would you go about patenting it? What do you need to bring to the Lawyer? Is it possible to fill out the forms and file a patent yourself? Is there a "Patenting for Dummies" out there???

 

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Although I own one patent and have a few others, they were obtained with the help of my employer's pattent office staff so not able to answer your questions; however, The USPTO does have a one year, $10 (last time I used it) service you might find useful. You can fully describe you invention, put it in a sealed envelope with ID on it etc. and send it to the USPTO inside another envelope. They will not open the inner sealed envelope, but only store it for a year, and then destroy it still unopened IF no patent is filed making reference to the number they will assign to your sealed envelope. It is a cheap 100% effective way to put an early irrrefutable date on your invention. (Also gives opportunity to forget all about it if you later understand it is nonsense, impractable or not of any commercial interest, with no embarassment.)

Second tip I can give is that you can do the search easily yourself (at least could years ago) I think now, you do not even need to live near Washington, DC, but that is where I did mine. It is really interesting to do this.

For example, the patent I own myself (US patent 4033118, mass flow solar absorber) which has expired now teaches an efficient way to thermally convert solar energy. (I solved a very fundamental conflict in the related physics: You need a high temp for good Carnot efficiency, but if absorber is very hot, the re-radiation losses normally kill you go up as they go as the fourth power of the temp.) The analysis of how it works is the subject of two papers I published in Applied Optics, (separately to avoid disclosure of the application prior to patent issue.)

I lived near DC and did the patent search myself before spending the money to proceed.* (In the joint "optics and solar energy" area.) I still remember well one patent I found. Some guy invented an airplane with cylinderical lenses as the wings. He was hoping to use it on sunny days to fly over battlefield trenches, killing, (or at least blinding) enemy soldiers. (It was granted shortly after WW1 - people tend to think the next war will be like the last.)

For me, patent searching is more fun than going to a movie and free! I hope it can now be done by the internet - If you learn how, please PM me.
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* I never made a dime on it, althought Shell Oil's technical people were very interested and wanted to own it. Unfortunately for me, the business depatment did not think it worth while back in that cheap oil era. and the legal department told the engineers to stop even comunicating with me -as they might invent someting related and I could cause Shell problems. That is a common problem with what may be a very important basics idea invented outside of a big company like Shell - It is called the "Not Invented Here" syndrom. I still have hope that, I may have contributed an idea that will be important for mankind in the long term solution to his energy needs.

 

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Patent applications, and I also have one, are a cpmplicated intersection between techbnical description of the invention and legalese acceptable to the patent office. I initially was trying to get one without a lawyer, but in retrospect that would not likely have worked out.

All you really need to take to the lawyer, though, is an ability to describe your invention or busienss model, prefereably one that is written down and that he can use as the basis of the patent description.

One thing you should do before blowing your money though is make sure there is no obvious "prior art" sittying out there publically available. If there are any ideas taht are vaguely similar to your, look for those patents. Patents are often worded vaguely enough to cover both the idea the company intends to marker and related ideas that they may not ever use commercially.

If an exwting patent covers it, or looks like it might cover it, you can't patent it.

 

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Perhaps, but not necessarily so. The heart of all patents is the "claims."

A good patent lawer with start with a very broad one, almost as general as:

I claim:

(1) "A useful solid (or liquid or gas in some other presure and temperature ranges) placed in a gravity field, such as the Earth's or that of another planet."

(2) "A useful solid (or liquid or gas in some other presure and temperature ranges) placed in a gravity field, such as the Earth's."

(3) "A solid (or liquid or gas in some other presure and temperature ranges) useful on or in the Earth."
...
(10) "An internally divided useful solid container with multiple compartments as illustrated in Figs. 3. and 4."
...
(57) A box, as illustrated in Fig.12, made of 42% lead 21 % silver ... with dimensions .... and oval in shape which is divided along its mid plane that can be opened from either side exposing two different powders and / or creams for treatment of the skin.

The majority of your claims will not be allowed, but usually some of the detailed ones will be. (The lawyer will not be quite as silly as the above, but nearly so.)

NO "working model" is required - In fact I think they no longer will even accept one.

As OP was mainly interested in software for language instuction, I failed to mention one very difficult requirement for physical object claims: The patent office has very detailed requirements on all drawings. For example, different line widths for different parts of the object illustrations etc. are USPTO specified. - The professionally made drawings were the major cost for me in the one I paid for and named in post 2. I seem to recall they had to be in "India ink" back then also.

 

I'm pretty certain there is a cost effective way to patent something, yourself. You can get all the correct forms with instructions of how and where to submit them at a fraction of the cost of using a specialised lawyer; just do a search on 'how to create patent'

 

Anyone have the site you can use to search US patents? I wouldn't mind taking a look this weekend. And thanks for all the advice so far

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You must be even worse than me when it comes to searching! I have not been there recently but the patent office has a site, where all the patents can be viewed (and some ability, I think, to search for ones related to potential applications.) Google for it if you need to.

The older patents, like mine, are available, if you know the number. As I gave the number, I did not explain why it may be an important contribution to man's long range hope (requirement actually) TO LIVE ON THE ENERGY CURRENTLY AVAILABLE FROM THE SUN. (Not "fossilized sunshine" as we currently do.)

 

Check it out: Google Patent Search

VERY quick, in goes the number and pow 0.025sec later -
Mass flow solar energy receiver



I think just looking through the patents helps understand patents a little

 

A little late to chime in, but...

There is a book, written by David Pressman, named "Patent it Yourself." It is generally considered a must read for anyone seeking to file their own patent.

You can certainly file your own patent, the question is whether or not you want to. Patent law - especially as it relates to claim language, gets complicated and a seemingly small detail can at times mean the difference between a meaningful and a meaningless patent.

One option is to write your own patent and then see if you can contract an attorney on an hourly basis to write the claims for you and/or simply proofread whatever you have constructed.

This service was actually abandoned by the USPTO recently, based on a widespread notion that it didn't accomplish much of anything for inventors and led to the misconception that it did put an irrefutable date on your invention. Here's a good link on the subject....actually I'm not allowed to post links so anyone can PM me if they care.

Wow! I get a good laugh from this. It not only can be done from the internet now, but it is far better off done on the internet than in old-school libraries and what not. I'm not simply talking Google Patents either. Feel free to get in touch with me if you want more. I can follow with a post on the subject if there's real interest.

Two realities many inventors face today as well....talk is cheap, as everyone likes to keep their options open....and companies are reluctant to deal with you under certain circumstances as legal problems can certainly arise on their end. Even when risk isn't high, its not good for piece of mind.

True. Though, while a good patent lawyer will start with a very broad one, and/or make the claims as broad as possible - the idea is to make the claims as broad as possible within what in anticipated to be potentially allowable by the USPTO. Some attorneys/agents might use the "broad" excuse in situations where they shouldn't necessarily be writing such a broad claim...if an office action results because a claim requires modification - the attorney might benefit from getting more work in his door - but the client doesn't benefit because the funding comes out of his pocket, and to a lesser extent because it delays patent allowance.

 

an idea

having an idea is great but is not enough for a patent.

You would have to have a new program written or an in depth system with different educational aspects to it. Even with a patent if your idea is of a educational type it would be a small thing to change 1 or 2 things and then they would have somthing different enough to patent also. This happens often enough even with items where an invention only needs a new part added or a different part that does the same thing. then boom a look alike is born.

The best means to ensure your project is to start a business and get your product having sales. you can corner a market and make money or even be seen as a future problem for a company that does the same thing so they will offer to buy you out.

Either way the best bet is to get out there and make things happen.

For example the under water view scope was made by an 8th grader she and her mother tried to sale the girls idea to toys R us and other companies who all said " NO THANKS " the mom got a 15$ business license and made 500$ worth of products that they sold on ebay. Within 30 days toys R us baught the little girls company for over 2,000,000.$

So just do it, and good luck!

 

Thanks for the post, do you work with the USPTO?

 

Thanks - I actually just started work on it last weekend. At least starting. I'm going to do it

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One more question about patent type stuff. I think I read somewhere that what we type on the Internet is under some sort of copy write protection (perhaps as a blog or something like this?) Is this true?

 

yes, for the most part, as long as it is sufficiently original/creative/etc. Of course "fair use" laws apply (Google ' copyright "fair use" ' ....I can't post links). And enforcing relevant copyright protection in a court of law can be complicated, particularly if nothing has been filed with the Copyright office. But copyright protection is generally automatic.

It is important to differentiate what copyright law protects versus patent law. Copyright law protects works/expressions of art and such, written work, drawings, songs, etcetera. It does not at all protect any ideas or such expressed within a protected work. For example, if you described an invention, copyright law could protect against someone copying your description of your invention, but it wouldn't actually protect your invention from being practiced, copied, or sold.

I do not work for the USPTO. I do own a company called Criterion Dynamics. I don't have any problems answering basic questions, and will try and check back with this thread every so often.

 

Thanks for that.

What's Criterion Dynamics?

 

To get a patent you'll need a very good product!

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LOL - >95% of all patents never earned a dime as no one wanted to use idea.

What is essential to understand about patents is that they give you the right to STOP OTHERS from making money on your invention, not aid you to make money on it. No matter how worthless is your idea, you can patent it, if original.

 

The cost of the patenting process is more than the vast majority of patent-holders will ever recover from their invention.

 

First thing is don't discuss your idea with others, it can actually undermine your patent.

Secondly you'd properly want to check out one of the website available for patenting, they tell you about what is patentable and even can allow searches (The first thing that has to be done) to see if the idea has already been patented.

You then basically need you idea written up properly, Diagrams, Mathematics etc. As just claiming an idea isn't enough (Unless your idea happens to be within a Mnemonic Repository).

 

wrong,
you can not patent an idea!