A Gun control solution - perhaps

Quantum Quack

Quantum Quack

Life's a tease...
Valued Senior Member
There appears only one way, to me as an outsider, that the USA can, over time, manage their penchant for firearms better. After reading a few threads and noting the paranoia and passion associated with firearms the only way I see going forward is to enforce responsibility on those who seek to block or otherwise hinder reasonable gun controls and regulations.
The best way to do this is to empower the NRA with regulatory authority and thus make the NRA and it's members legally responsible for any tragedy that they have allowed due to their inability to see common sense universal nation wide regulation as an answer.
  • All Fire arm Purchases, ownership, use can only be made with paid up NRA membership. (NRA gun licence)
  • All firearms and owners being part of a nationwide data base - accessible by law enforcement etc.
  • Lobbying the government for fire arms regulation/legislation becomes the NRA's responsibility.
  • The NRA (membership) can be sued for injuries etc caused by a lack of regulation or regulations blocked by the NRA.
Example:
The recent death of 17 persons/students in Florida could bring a class action against the NRA due to it's opposition to the proper regulation of Assault rifles and methods of removing guns and preventing those with historical mental health issues from obtaining them.

It is only when the NRA suffers a significant legal, financial and moral impost that it would take it's responsibility seriously.

Over time and with much hassle the issue of gun regulation will settle down and eventually become more reasonable and sensible. IMO

Basically the fire arms owners (NRA) should pay for their passion for the second amendment. As I do not see why those who are victims should pay only.

The cost of the 2nd amendment is appalling!
This should not be paid for by victims of the 2nd amendment alone.

just thoughts....

Care to discuss?
 
Quantum Quack said:
Care to discuss?
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It's an interesting idea when arranged in a circumstantial vacuum; there is so much about liability laws, complications of exposure and protection, that nobody in their position will ever be held accountable.

I'm of the opinion we need insurance companies; it's one of the rare times I'll turn to them. One of the reasons Republicans disrupted firearm epidemiological study at the federal level is to create obstacles to assessing the statistical reality. Imagine the actuarial data if handguns were subject to mandatory insurance and all firearms were exceptions to homeowner and renter liability policies. And similar strictures and exceptions in business insurance would pretty much require the firearms marketplace to finally try to work and play well with others.

Remember how the firearms lobby and its Main Street minions always botch up their recitations of the Second Amendment; we already know that for the Movement, it's not really about the right to keep and bear arms, but the right to kill. They don't work and play well with others because, as the threat goes, if push comes to shove, they'll just shoot.
 
Quantum Quack said:
The cost of the 2nd amendment is appalling!
This should not be paid for by victims of the 2nd amendment alone.
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You are buying into NRA agitprop.
The 2nd has nothing to do with this insane situation.
Make this a 2nd Amendment fight - as the NRA has been working hard to do, because it favors them - and you lose the majority of the American electorate on the one hand, and/or put the entire Constitution up for grabs under a Republican Congress and President on the other.
Tiassa said:
One of the reasons Republicans disrupted firearm epidemiological study at the federal level is to create obstacles to assessing the statistical reality. Imagine the actuarial data if handguns were subject to mandatory insurance and all firearms were exceptions to homeowner and renter liability policies.
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More threats from the gun control crowd. Sounds like a plan.

Your imagination has led you stray. The insurance would be cheap.
And the registry required would be the central fight you already keep losing because of what you call "paranoia" about something like that being imposed.
And statistically it wouldn't make much difference. The statistical realities already cover theft, suicide, and accident, for starters, and that covers pretty much everyone who has homeowner's insurance.
 
Well we are seeing the NRA being attacked on the money side, and I'm all for that, in theory is the NRA could be stripped of enough money, they can't lobby and finance politicians and then their insane position will wither away. But sadly I don't think any legal change to the NRA is possible at this time, not with this congress.
 
iceaura said:
Make this a 2nd Amendment fight - as the NRA has been working hard to do, because it favors them - and you lose the majority of the American electorate on the one hand, and/or put the entire Constitution up for grabs under a Republican Congress and President on the other.
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and the NRA will always work at making it a 2nd Am fight and will always succeed in doing so.

So with that taken into account why not make the 2nd Am their responsibility to regulate and give them liability for the consequences.

From what I understand any issue of gun control will automatically inspire 2nd Am debate. This is unavoidable.

At the moment due to this "void of responsibility" victims are bearing the cost and not those supporting the regulatory environment that allows them to become victims.
This void of responsibility needs to be clarified for any progress to made. IMO

As far as I can tell the 17 young people in Florida died because the NRA has failed to protect them due to this void of responsibility.

The NRA needs to be offering solutions to the problem and not devote itself to stonewalling and protesting against solutions offered by others.
 
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ElectricFetus said:
Well we are seeing the NRA being attacked on the money side, and I'm all for that, in theory is the NRA could be stripped of enough money, they can't lobby and finance politicians and then their insane position will wither away. But sadly I don't think any legal change to the NRA is possible at this time, not with this congress.
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It's actually called escalation.
Increase the NRA power and therefore responsibility and a solution will be found. IMO

Essentially ... give 'em what they want as along as the legal, financial and moral responsibility comes with it.
Give the NRA responsibility for nation wide gun control....
 
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Quantum Quack said:
It's actually called escalation.
Increase the NRA power and therefore responsibility and a solution will be found. IMO

Essentially ... give 'em what they want as along as the legal, financial and moral responsibility comes with it.
Give the NRA responsibility for nation wide gun control....
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I don't have a problem with this idea other then it would require legal and policy changes which I don't see happening in this political climate.
 
ElectricFetus said:
I don't have a problem with this idea other then it would require legal and policy changes which I don't see happening in this political climate.
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uhm yes.... well ...right... with the current administration gun control is the school teacher's responsibility. (sarc)

Not much is possible other than the negative in the current political climate.

With the right leadership it could be enacted within 12 months I reckon..
 
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Another spin off benefit would be the reduction in NRA sponsorship/donations/corruption to congressmen
 
Quantum Quack said:
uhm yes.... well ...right... with the current administration gun control is the school teacher's responsibility. (sarc)
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Yeah about that: https://www.nytimes.com/2018/02/28/us/georgia-teacher-gun-shooting.html

Considering the little shitstains teacher have to deal with imagine if armed how many over the years would lose it and kill those little bastards?

Anyways, here is a more realistic idea for how to deal with the NRA: http://www.sun-sentinel.com/opinion/fl-op-nra-divestment-gun-control-20180305-story.html

One of the things the NRA has done successfully is use its inflammatory rhetoric to keep the heat on itself and away from the gun companies. Investors can't do anything about the NRA, but so what? There is plenty they can do to put pressure on gun companies — so long as they don't let the NRA distract them.

For years, gun control advocates have tried to make the country safer primarily by trying to get laws passed. Sometimes they've had success, but more often they haven't, which is why mass shootings remain such a common scourge.

The time has come to try something new: to try to force change by pressuring the companies that make the guns that mass shooters use. It might just work.
 
ElectricFetus said:
Yeah about that: https://www.nytimes.com/2018/02/28/us/georgia-teacher-gun-shooting.html

Considering the little shitstains teacher have to deal with imagine if armed how many over the years would lose it and kill those little bastards?

Anyways, here is a more realistic idea for how to deal with the NRA: http://www.sun-sentinel.com/opinion/fl-op-nra-divestment-gun-control-20180305-story.html

One of the things the NRA has done successfully is use its inflammatory rhetoric to keep the heat on itself and away from the gun companies. Investors can't do anything about the NRA, but so what? There is plenty they can do to put pressure on gun companies — so long as they don't let the NRA distract them.

For years, gun control advocates have tried to make the country safer primarily by trying to get laws passed. Sometimes they've had success, but more often they haven't, which is why mass shootings remain such a common scourge.

The time has come to try something new: to try to force change by pressuring the companies that make the guns that mass shooters use. It might just work.
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some good points ...
however the strategy suggested only deals with new weapons sold and not weapons already in circulation.
It certainly would be a start in clarifying the responsibility issue....and perhaps over time....progress may be made..
 
and now this just hit my news feed:
One student was killed and another was in critical condition after an accidental shooting during dismissal time at a high school in Birmingham, Alabama, police said.
At least two gunshots were fired, killing a 17-year-old female student and injuring a 17-year-old male student at Huffman High School, said Birmingham police Chief Orlando Wilson. He said police considered the shooting accidental, but did not elaborate.
src: https://edition.cnn.com/2018/03/07/us/birmingham-alabama-school-shooting/index.html​
 
Quantum Quack said:
and the NRA will always work at making it a 2nd Am fight and will always succeed in doing so.
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Cause they have superpowers that turn all their opponents into mental midgets unable to avoid the simplest of political traps?
Quantum Quack said:
From what I understand any issue of gun control will automatically inspire 2nd Am debate. This is unavoidable.
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The gun control promoters are gullible and incompetent and don't know what they are doing, and nothing can be done about that - but we should give them whatever they want, for the good of the country, including a rewrite of the Constitution supervised by Donald Trump. Got it.
 
Why is it that people not of this country are so intent on trying to effect changes in our core documents?

..............................
control freaks without a cause?
 
sculptor said:
Why is it that people not of this country are so intent on trying to effect changes in our core documents?
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I'm from this country, first it is called an "amendment" for a reason and second simply nationalizing the NRA would not require a constitutional change, and third it is all hypothetical anyways.
 
sculptor said:
Why is it that people not of this country are so intent on trying to effect changes in our core documents?

..............................
control freaks without a cause?
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classic case of paranoid deflection.
you make it a constitutional issue when what I am suggesting supports the constitution instead.

I got at least 17 dead solid reasons for giving my 2 cents worth.
..and if it happened even in Russia I would do the same...
 
iceaura said:
It's not much of a reason - the US was never governed without them, and ratification of the Constitution depended explicitly on their inclusion.
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Yeah so? we can change amendments, we have before, we added an amendment for abolishing slavery, we added an amendment to ban alcohol, then we added an amendment to repeal the one that ban alcohol.
 
ElectricFetus said:
Yeah so? we can change amendments, we have before, we added an amendment for abolishing slavery, we added an amendment to ban alcohol, then we added an amendment to repeal the one that ban alcohol.
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That's nice.
Especially the choice of Prohibition as your example of a recommended approach to guns.
 
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