No what? What's with all the caps? We're supposed to believe this because Bush said so?
No Lucy, the part in bold caps is in QUOTES.
It's from the actual LEGISLATION.
Arthur
No what? What's with all the caps? We're supposed to believe this because Bush said so?
YEAH LUCY, CMON, It's perfectly ok for the authorities to wipe their asses with the bill of rights just as long as it's a test case pffff don't you know anything.
My goodness gracious! These president guys are powerful beings! It rests on their very word to determine if a person, organization or even a whole nation assisted in terrorism!
And how does a president go about making that determination? Must be piece of cake for such divine beings... they must come with psychic powers! Huge dicks too!
What about the kid? http://www.wral.com/news/local/video...2/#/vid5050332.
Why do you refuse to comment on that situation.
The lack of due process is what is allowed by the patriot act. Same same.
Yes. And that his the price he pays for election and governance - one hopes with at least some personal approval and willingness, for the sake of his soul, but pays nevertheless if he wants to be President.michael said:Once Obama was elected POTUS he could have set up a commission to look into the legality of what these crooks did and were still doing. He certainly didn't need to hire a single one of them. That was his choice. He hasn't looked into ANYTHING. Not the war crimes. Not the banking crimes. Nothing. He surrendered our sovereignty to the Banks and I feel he is in their pocket.
A distinction without a difference - very few Americans have no contact with any non-Americans who might be linked to potential terrorist activity - especially since merely arguing a case against US "anti-terrorism" efforts of any kind is officially and legally interpretable as support for terrorism.adoucette said:Actually the problem is the actual FISA Act differs in one important way from what you quoted:
Lots of people did, adn still do. Do you take them seriously? Do they stand any chance of election to national office - getting big corporate donations, favorable media?leopold said:and again i ask, if these provisions were so nasty and ugly and violated americans rights why didn't this senator raise more than just an eyebrow?
They have violated almost every provision of the Bill of Rights.leopold said:the U.S. government has been grappling with the gray areas of the constitution for years.
And we have no confidence in your obviously ignorant and naive opinions in this matter, neither do we think our Constitutional rights are subject to the opinions of anonymous agents of the Executive Branch -leopold said:yes, it is my opinion that government ( U.S. ) agencies do not carry out warrentless surveillance of U.S. citizens without a just cause.
Not everyone. Plenty of people in recent US administrations have deicded otherwise, and acted accordingly.adoucette said:Because the logs are only what numbers were called and when and where, and not the content of the call, which everyone agrees is covered by the 4th and 1st.
That misses the point. The phone companies will naturally cooperate, unless they are under obligation not to.leopold said:the phone companies are under no obligations to surrender anything without a warrant or a national security letter.
They have been subjected to a generation of coordinated and lavishly funded propaganda, informed and designed by the most sophisticated marketing and propaganda industry the world has ever seen.lucy said:So then why don't they see this? Why are they so comfortable with the idea of the patriot act? I find it bemusing to say the least. Why don't they see the long term danger?
It's worse than that - Americans are prepared and ready to react with virulence in opposition if Obama shows the slightest sign of exercising such powers. It would cost him any hope of Congressional, industrial, financial, or corporate media support - including getting re-elected.lucy said:Please don't get me started on the posing Obama.
Yes the executives job is to uphold the constitution and they are not doing that. What I don't understand is why americans are so comfortable with that
That's obviously not true - they are seriously out of line, and they have your support, Congress's support, the corporate media's support, and the support of the authoritarian Right in general.adoucette said:The Govt doesn't stand a chance if they get seriously out of line.
But it helps a lot - gets your support, and the rest of your kind. Allows the pretense of governing under a rule of law to continue. Confuses many who would otherwise revolt.leopold said:trust me, the government does not need the patriot act to turn on its citizens
Citizens are not being detained (for more then the allowed amount of time) without charges, the rule of Habeus Corpus is still in effect.
- - - - -
It took a while because like I pointed out, they gov tried originally to deal with him as an Enemy Combatant.
There is no defense against what amounts to an inculcated mental defect.There are no "blanket wire taps occuring" that I'm aware of, nor have you shown that they are being done.
That's obviously not true - they are seriously out of line, and they have your support, Congress's support, the corporate media's support, and the support of the authoritarian Right in general.
Well if enough people actually agreed with you then they would do something about it.
But clearly the majority of people don't agree with you.
I know, we're all Sheeple.
LOL
Arthur
Nobody is insignificant.
Nobody is insignificant.
Hi, I'm Nobody, nice to meet you
Nobody is insignificant.
holy shit on a stick, have you lost your mind arthur?To the government they absolutely are.
holy shit on a stick, have you lost your mind arthur?
the peoples innocence and protecting it is definitely on the U.S. governments agenda.
I'm willing to bet that both of us are just about as insignificant as it is possible to be to the FBI, CIA or NSA.
In my case...you lose.
I went out and heckled Slick Willie in person when he was here once. While he was out for a morning jog with the SS guys.![]()
Accomplishing nothing besides, I'm sure, a very little blurb in the Secret Service files for me, to go along with the very little blurbs I have from the FBI for hanging out around the unterroristic end of local terrorist orgs like Earth First and Animal Liberation Front.
Meh, I really hope they aren't wasting money watching me, I'm highly unlikely to cause mayhem these days. Just because I could does not mean I will...I could do lots of things.
Yeah, we'll go with highly unlikely. I don't have lawyer money, therefore it behooves me to behave.
one word, transparency.Please explain what you mean by this.
one word, transparency.
if the government didn't give a crappola about you then why the transparency?