'Hours after the US Senate and House of Representatives passed the law, through votes taken in rapid succession, and just minutes before the law was to expire at midnight in Washington DC, Obama sent in a digital signature, finalising the renewal on Thursday. During congressional debates, legislators rejected attempts to temper the law enforcement powers to ensure that individual liberties would not be abused. While the government's actual use of the Patriot Act largely remains secret, members of the Senate Intelligence Committee are unhappy with the extension. Before Thursday's Senate vote, Oregon Democratic Senator Ron Wyden said, "I want to deliver a warning this afternoon: When the American people find out how their government has secretly interpreted the Patriot Act, they will be stunned and they will be angry." "Americans would be alarmed if they knew how this law is being carried out," added Senator Mark Udall of Colorado, also on the Senate Intelligence Committee.' http://english.aljazeera.net/news/americas/2011/05/201152715850301322.html Its extended for another four years. Yes many Democrats claimed the Republicans under Bush were turning the country into a police state spying on americans, I guess police states are okay as long as they're the ones in power. Obama as a Senator spoke out against the internal intrusiveness of the patriot act and called it 'shoddy and dangerous' and as a presidential candidate pledged to dump it. 'Obama justifies keeping nearly all of Bush's terror war provisions in place with the standard rationale that the government must have all the weapons needed to deal with the threat of terrorism, even legally and constitutionally dubious weapons. That, of course, was the Bush and Cheney stock line. The one small difference between them and Obama is that Obama has sought to put a softer casing around those illicit weapons. That's no consolation for those who took candidate Obama and later Senator Obama at his word that he'd scrap or at least radically overhaul the Act.' http://www.huffingtonpost.com/earl-ofari-hutchinson/did-obama-break-his-campa_b_288112.html
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Well yes its difficult to point out the faults of Obama's policies or continuation of Bush policies without being labeled a 'racist' or 'tea bagger' and the like. Nevertheless Obama did try to assume the position as being markedly different from the previous administration, the democrats did take up the mantel of being in opposition to a policy such as the patriot act. I question why Democrats are not outraged at the obvious lack of change in terms of policy. If they really wanted change then they should be demanding it from this president. Or is it that they only believe the patriot act is necessary if it drops from the lips from one in their own party?:shrug: But I see your point. Its like pointing out Clinton signed NAFTA only to be told its really not his fault because it originated from Reagan republican policy, yet Reagan didn't sign NAFTA Clinton did. The idea they posit is that if a democrat signs a bad policy its because they were forced to by republicans which is balderdash. Its as if they completely miss the hypocrisy. Sad.
And they were right - still are. Those "many Democrats", I mean. OK with whom? Not with the people who opposed it in the first place - those still around, anyway. Being liberal Dems, many have been defeated in the subsequent elections. In the first place, this isn't an extension of the Patriot Act - most of the Patriot Act is permanent law, and needs no extensions. This is just three of the more offensive provisions of it, which were so dubious that even under pressure from W&Co in the wake of 9/11 Congress felt obligated to make only temporary. In the second, the whole thing including these three provisions is still Republican Party law - written by a Republican administration, passed largely by Republican Party Congressmen then and now, and institutionalized in its enforcement by W&Co over several years. Obama is simply not the liberal President that Republican campaign rhetoric would have him be. He is instead a corporate based rightwing authoritarian, like Clinton, content with much of the Reagan agenda. That's what the lefties and libertarians have been trying to get through to the trogpile for years now. The only surprised people here are the ones who continue to imbibe from the corporate media koolaid fountain. {edit out: whoops, wrong bill} From a tracking site:
@Iceaura And your excuse for Obama signing on a for another four years is what? That he's a republican? 67 Democrats authorized its extension. 67!!! How does that stack up to the handful of tea party folk you list? Considering that the Senate voted 79-18 in favor. The 67 Democrats who voted tonight to reauthorize the Patriot Act are: Rep. Gary Ackerman (Democrat-NY, District 5) — Yea Rep. Jason Altmire (Democrat-PA, District 4) — Yea Rep. Joe Baca (Democrat-CA, District 43) — Yea Rep. John Barrow (Democrat-GA, District 12) — Yea Rep. Shelley Berkley (Democrat-NV, District 1) — Yea Rep. Sanford Bishop (Democrat-GA, District 2) — Yea Rep. Timothy Bishop (Democrat-NY, District 1) — Yea Rep. Dan Boren (Democrat-OK, District 2) — Yea Rep. Leonard Boswell (Democrat-IA, District 3) — Yea Rep. Dennis Cardoza (Democrat-CA, District 18) — Yea Rep. Russ Carnahan (Democrat-MO, District 3) — Yea Rep. John Carney (Democrat-DE, District 0) — Yea Rep. Kathy Castor (Democrat-FL, District 11) — Yea Rep. Ben Chandler (Democrat-KY, District 6) — Yea Rep. Gerald Connolly (Democrat-VA, District 11) — Yea Rep. Jim Cooper (Democrat-TN, District 5) — Yea Rep. Jim Costa (Democrat-CA, District 20) — Yea Rep. Joe Courtney (Democrat-CT, District 2) — Yea Rep. Mark Critz (Democrat-PA, District 12) — Yea Rep. Henry Cuellar (Democrat-TX, District 28) — Yea Rep. Susan Davis (Democrat-CA, District 53) — Yea Rep. Norman Dicks (Democrat-WA, District 6) — Yea Rep. Joe Donnelly (Democrat-IN, District 2) — Yea Rep. Jane Harman (Democrat-CA, District 36) — Yea Rep. Alcee Hastings (Democrat-FL, District 23) — Yea Rep. Martin Heinrich (Democrat-NM, District 1) — Yea Rep. Brian Higgins (Democrat-NY, District 27) — Yea Rep. Rubén Hinojosa (Democrat-TX, District 15) — Yea Rep. Tim Holden (Democrat-PA, District 17) — Yea Rep. Steny Hoyer (Democrat-MD, District 5) — Yea Rep. Jay Inslee (Democrat-WA, District 1) — Yea Rep. Steve Israel (Democrat-NY, District 2) — Yea Rep. William Keating (Democrat-MA, District 10) — Yea Rep. Ronald Kind (Democrat-WI, District 3) — Yea Rep. Larry Kissell (Democrat-NC, District 8 ) — Yea Rep. James Langevin (Democrat-RI, District 2) — Yea Rep. Rick Larsen (Democrat-WA, District 2) — Yea Rep. Sander Levin (Democrat-MI, District 12) — Yea Rep. Daniel Lipinski (Democrat-IL, District 3) — Yea Rep. Nita Lowey (Democrat-NY, District 18) — Yea Rep. Stephen Lynch (Democrat-MA, District 9) — Yea Rep. Jim Matheson (Democrat-UT, District 2) — Yea Rep. Carolyn McCarthy (Democrat-NY, District 4) — Yea Rep. Mike McIntyre (Democrat-NC, District 7) — Yea Rep. Jerry McNerney (Democrat-CA, District 11) — Yea Rep. Brad Miller (Democrat-NC, District 13) — Yea Rep. Christopher Murphy (Democrat-CT, District 5) — Yea Rep. William Pascrell (Democrat-NJ, District 8 ) — Yea Rep. Ed Perlmutter (Democrat-CO, District 7) — Yea Rep. Gary Peters (Democrat-MI, District 9) — Yea Rep. Collin Peterson (Democrat-MN, District 7) — Yea Rep. Mike Quigley (Democrat-IL, District 5) — Yea Rep. Nick Rahall (Democrat-WV, District 3) — Yea Rep. Silvestre Reyes (Democrat-TX, District 16) — Yea Rep. Mike Ross (Democrat-AR, District 4) — Yea Rep. Steven Rothman (Democrat-NJ, District 9) — Yea Rep. C.A. Ruppersberger (Democrat-MD, District 2) — Yea Rep. Adam Schiff (Democrat-CA, District 29) — Yea Rep. Allyson Schwartz (Democrat-PA, District 13) — Yea Rep. David Scott (Democrat-GA, District 13) — Yea Rep. Terri Sewell (Democrat-AL, District 7) — Yea Rep. Heath Shuler (Democrat-NC, District 11) — Yea Rep. Albio Sires (Democrat-NJ, District 13) — Yea Rep. Adam Smith (Democrat-WA, District 9) — Yea Rep. Niki Tsongas (Democrat-MA, District 5) — Yea Rep. Christopher Van Hollen (Democrat-MD, District 8 ) — Yea Rep. John Yarmuth (Democrat-KY, District 3) — Yea
I' m not excusing him for anything. I'm simply pointing out that the lefty libs are once again being proven right about something. Obama is not a left libertarian politician. He is a right wing authoritarian politician. He always has been. No. The Patriot Act is almost entirely permanent law as passed years ago, and will never come up for reauthorization. It stacks up as a much smaller percentage than the Reps featured. But the whole thing is a Republican Party initiative and contribution, so maybe partisan stuff rather than principles of governance were the main contributing factors to the less than overwhelming Dem support - is that what you are saying?
@Iceaura By the way why did they bother to go through with an extension if its 'permanent law'? Iceaura: I' m not excusing him for anything. I'm simply pointing out that the lefty libs are once again being proven right about something. Obama is not a left libertarian politician. He is a right wing authoritarian politician. He always has been. And the democrats who voted for it are what?
They didn't. The only matter at issue was three temporary provisions, small but notable provisions of the much larger and more comprehensive bill. I don't know many of them. I know Colin Peterson from MN - he is a right wing authoritarian from the conservative center west region of the State.
And anyway you are wrong about 'reauthorizations': Reauthorizations The USA PATRIOT Act was reauthorized by two bills. The first, the USA PATRIOT and Terrorism Prevention Reauthorization Act of 2005, was passed by both houses of Congress in July 2005. This bill reauthorized provisions of the USA PATRIOT Act and the Intelligence Reform and Terrorism Prevention Act of 2004. It created new provisions relating to the death penalty for terrorists, enhancing security at seaports, new measures to combat the financing of terrorism, new powers for the Secret Service, anti-Methamphetamine initiatives and a number of other miscellaneous provisions. The second reauthorization act, the USA PATRIOT Act Additional Reauthorizing Amendments Act of 2006, amended the first and was passed in February 2006. The first act reauthorized all but two of the provisions of Title II that would have expired. Two sections were changed to sunset on December 31, 2009: section 206 — the roving wiretap provision — and section 215, which allowed access to business records under FISA. Section 215 was amended further regardless so as to give greater judicial oversight and review. Such orders were also restricted to be authorized by only the FBI Director, the FBI Deputy Director, or the Executive Assistant Director for National Security, and minimization procedures were specified to limit the dissemination and collection of such information. Section 215 also had a "gag" provision, which was changed to allow the defendant to contact their Attorney. However, the change also meant that the defendant was also made to tell the FBI who he (or she) was disclosing the order to — this requirement was removed by the USA PATRIOT Act Additional Reauthorizing Amendments Act. President Barack Obama, on Saturday, February 27, 2010, signed into law legislation that would temporarily extend for one year, three controversial provisions of the Patriot Act that had been set to expire. The three sections that Obama extended: -Authorize court-approved roving wiretaps that permit surveillance on multiple phones. -Allow court-approved seizure of records and property in anti-terrorism operations. -Permit surveillance against a so-called lone wolf, a non-U.S. citizen engaged in terrorism who may not be part of a recognized terrorist group. In a vote on February 8, 2011, the House of Representatives considered a further extension of the Act through the end of 2011. House leadership moved the extension bill under suspension of the rules, which is intended for noncontroversial legislation and requires two-thirds majority to pass.] After the vote, the extension bill did not pass; 277 members voted in favor, which was less than the 290 votes needed to pass the bill under suspension of the rules. Without an extension, the Act is set to expire on February 28, 2011. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USA_PATRIOT_Act Permanent laws do not need extensions nor reauthorizations.
No, I'm not. Info re Patriot Act: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USA_PATRIOT_Act specifically to the sunset and reauthorization issue: http://www.leftandrightnews.com/2011/01/17/patriot-act-faces-renewal-in-2011/ And once again, comparing Dems and Reps: That was in February. The recent vote was generally similar. Three points: only a few relatively small - although notable and important - parts of the larger Bill need or ever have needed "reauthorization". The reauthorization votes as well as the political realities show the primary influence of the more extreme rightwing authoritarian factions of US politics in passing and supporting this legislation. In consequence this has been and is largely a Republican Party contribution to US governance. In addition to his obvious core support, connections, and governing approach, Obama has already signed extensions of provisions of the Act, last year: this latest signing of further extensions is not a surprise, or news.
Patriot Act There is no difference between the GOP and DEM parties. This is where Joe chimes in to bash the GOP and lavish praise on Obama for doing the right thing and maintaining the Love America Act. Thank the Gods we got Obama in there. Heaven only knows what would happen if someone like Ron Paul were elected. Here's a little secret: Vote for whomever MSNBC, CNN, ABC or FOX are against regardless of party affiliation. Also of note: Senator Rand Paul made an elegant speech in favor of repealing the act. I seem to remember the Talking Heads warning us of Rand Paul - my Gods, he was a closet rapist Nazi pinko Commie.
You miss the point, it doesn't matter if it were back in February since you claim "The Patriot Act is almost entirely permanent law as passed years ago, and will never come up for reauthorization." I'm pointing out that there have been reauthorizations. Why else would it say " Without an extension, the Act is set to expire on February 28, 2011."
It's misleading you. Only a part of the Patriot Act is burdened with sunset provisions, and the part due to expire last February was not even all of that. The three provisions recently "reauthorized" by Obama certainly are not accurately described by the title of this thread. "Obama extends the Patriot Act" is wildly wrong. You are getting into Madanthony territory here, in the thread title. And your attempt to spread Obama's characteristic maneuvering over "the Democrats" - as if those individuals who opposed the Act under W now favored it under Obama, hypocritically - is setting up camp in that territory.
So that's what "This Must Be the Place" was about! Joe is not too quick on the draw, or your powers of prophecy have gotten rusty.
Oh so you don't believe the patriot act should be repealed? Obama did state as much himself when he was a candidate. How is pointing out that a majority of democrats before as well as now and obama supporting the patriot act insinuating that Obama held sway over them? I'm pointing out the failures of democrats. If you cannot isolate the fact that democrats were swayed both under bush and obama then you don't see what's wrong with your own party. @Giambattista Its that they really don't care. There's a lot of presences over these issues. They are comfortable with the wars and the patriot act as long as their party is in power. Its that simple.
? Definitely Madanthony territory, with that kind of bs. You were the one claiming some people - you called them "the Democrats" - first opposed the Patriot Act and now support it, you claim simply because W was a Republican and Obama is a Democrat, and are therefore hypocrites. I'm just not seeing any evidence that there are very many such people, let alone enough of the current Democratic Congress to warrant calling them "the Democrats". The only thing you've posted is a list of some Dems who voted in favor of the latest sunset extension of three provisions of the 300 or so of the Act - you don't even bother to contrast their current votes with their original ones on the entire and much larger Act itself, which would be at least oblique evidence of hypocrisy for them as individuals. Maybe if you named a few of them, I could do some of that research for you (as I did for Colin Peterson, who has voted in favor of the Patriot Act and every provision of it every chance he got since it was first proposed). And maybe if you fixed the thread title so it wasn't so goofy exaggerated in the Fox/Madanthony fashion? Here's a start for you: http://irregulartimes.com/index.php/archives/2011/05/26/senate-democrats-for-the-patriot-act-may-26/
I shouldn't pick on Joe, I similarly voted for Obama. He should have oversaw the break up of mega institutions like GoldmanSux - in the same way that the Standard Oil Company was carved up. But, instead he hired more Goldies than any previous POTUS and these institutions are bigger and more toxic than ever before.
You think you should have voted for McCain - who had Phil Gramm on board as financial guru and lined up as Treasury Secretary? To be fair to Obama, despite his (long predicted, by lefties) collusion with the forces of banking evil, he is not responsible for the recent takeover by Goldman Sachs and imprudently consolidated state of the US financial system. That happened under W - most of the recent crash bad banking stuff happened under W and by the agency of W's administration.
Obama chooses his own cabinet. He has more crooks from GoldmanSux and BJ Morgans than ANY previous POTUS.
