United airlines

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birch

Valued Senior Member
This stupid ceo of united stated he was emphatically behind the employees and proud they went above and beyond to 'fly right'. How does idiots like this become ceo's? i can only guess he just is a corrupt follower of anything to get to where he is and to adapt to current policy for the almighty dollar and not a real thinker.

This could have been handled in multiple different ways or at least tried first. The process of overbooking flights is ridiculous in the first place but to bump paying customers off for employees (unless they have a dire emergency) is also ridiculous. They could have 're-accomodated' their employees on another carrier, used one of united's private jets etc. They also could have upped the compensation incentive too. There will be some who would if the price is right as not everyone is in the same situation where they can't be delayed. On top of all that, 'volunteer' means just that and being forcibly dragged off is not volunteering, is it?

Is that too much common sense that if a passenger refuses to volunteer, they can just ask another? The humane sense and sensibility was totally absent and is especially stupid since you are a business that caters to the public. But this incident, like most unfortunate incidents, are needed to be publicized for policy to be re-evaluated and changed. This was all about the greedy almighty dollar and their draconian procedure was all an indication of that. Also, if everyone complied with even unfair policy, unlike this doctor, things wouldn't change either.

United made all the mistakes and is the one that should be held responsible and even less the security/police in this case.

Even before i looked this up yesterday, someone was telling me about it and i guessed it was united airlines and sure enough it was. They are the worst airlines i have ever flown with and make sure i avoid them. i prefer american airlines and any other besides united. for some odd or nefarious reason, they have the worst customer service i have ever experienced and their service/staff is the most 'coldest' of all the airlines i've experienced. i refuse to fly with them since 2002 and even if they come up as the lowest fare in search, i choose another airline every time. that airline company does have a nazish type of way or even atmosphere about them.

I also want to add that some people hate big government but it is government that is needed to make sure private corporations and companies do not abuse the public just as well. they need to be held accountable.
 
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You are right. I was appalled when this pea-nut-size brain CEO stated that he is emphatically behind his employees, as if these employees have achieved something great by dragging a senior citizen. If I have paid for a ticket then under normal circumstances I cannot be thrown out. United must be penalized heavily financially for such disgusting act. But what was the role of security guys here? Sure they must be having some force deplaning in case volunteers do not come forward, but why security guys got themselves into this uncalled for mess? Why did they act, did they follow orders from some lowly united employee to chuck this man out for some free passes in future?
 
So, there we have assault and battery caught on video............
..................
"overbooking" = selling the same thing to 2 different people = fraud?
if so,
then assault and battery following fraud should cost United a few millions of dollars?
 
United airlines and its employees did not assault and did nothing illegal. In fact, the crew were professional and did not act “lowly”. Police officers, which are not employees of the airline, dragged the man out. Whether or not you think overbooking is right, is not the point. It is lawful, all airlines do it, and the ticket prices we pay are lower because of it. Also, from what I have read, this was not even a case of overbooking. They had to fly 4 pilots to their destinations or risk having to cancel flights which would affect hundreds or potentially thousands of people.

media sensationalism – and do anything to create outrage – This combined with sense of entitlement the 1st world masses have today. “How dare they kick me out of the seat I paid for!” Yes, we all hate airlines and flying is a bitch. How entitled we feel – to be able to sit in a tube 30K feet in the sky and safely travel across the world in hours. My rights! I am being treated unfairly! -- (after being offered $800 plus hotel stay) for stepping off the plane. Again, the narcissistic entitlement –I’m not moving from my seat! – Look! I’m being dragged off!. Also, stupid, stupid.. not obeying police (men with guns). Men with guns – Some of them could be racist, some of them could be bad, some of them could just be having a bad day. Regardless of your ”rights”, it’s generally not a good idea to fight, argue, or even run away from Men With Guns. Police tells me to jump, I’ll jump. Then I’ll get a lawyer if I believe I was mistreated.

But go on, by all means, continue being appalled, shocked in horror, on this tragic injustice -- about one idiot being dragged off a plane after he refused police instructions.
 
dsdsds said:
United airlines and its employees did not assault and did nothing illegal. In fact, the crew were professional and did not act “lowly”. Police officers, which are not employees of the airline, dragged the man out. Whether or not you think overbooking is right, is not the point. It is lawful, all airlines do it, and the ticket prices we pay are lower because of it. Also, from what I have read, this was not even a case of overbooking. They had to fly 4 pilots to their destinations or risk having to cancel flights which would affect hundreds or potentially thousands of people.

media sensationalism – and do anything to create outrage – This combined with sense of entitlement the 1st world masses have today. “How dare they kick me out of the seat I paid for!” Yes, we all hate airlines and flying is a bitch. How entitled we feel – to be able to sit in a tube 30K feet in the sky and safely travel across the world in hours. My rights! I am being treated unfairly! -- (after being offered $800 plus hotel stay) for stepping off the plane. Again, the narcissistic entitlement –I’m not moving from my seat! – Look! I’m being dragged off!. Also, stupid, stupid.. not obeying police (men with guns). Men with guns – Some of them could be racist, some of them could be bad, some of them could just be having a bad day. Regardless of your ”rights”, it’s generally not a good idea to fight, argue, or even run away from Men With Guns. Police tells me to jump, I’ll jump. Then I’ll get a lawyer if I believe I was mistreated.

But go on, by all means, continue being appalled, shocked in horror, on this tragic injustice -- about one idiot being dragged off a plane after he refused police instructions.
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Ummmm

I sort of agree with most of what you have outlined

However what seems to be missing in your outline is WHY he was traveling home as the passenger called out

I DO NOT KNOW the reason and as far as I know it has not come out in the news

BUT it has come out the passenger is a doctor

NOW THIS on my part is pure SPECULATION

IT might have turned out he was on way to perform a operation for which he was best qualified to perform

Due to his inability to communicate this his deplaneing happened

Having said all that it has been well and truly covered the myriad of other ways the situation could have been handled from the get go

I have a totally different problem with AirAsia for which I am sueing them for $90

I have been offered $88-35 cents

Go figure

:)
 
In the interest of objective discussion, consider this article:

https://thepilotwifelife.wordpress....thoughts-from-a-pilot-wife-about-flight-3411/

I don't defend it - the incident was still unacceptable, but it does inform the other side of the story.


By example, here's a point you probably won't see in the media:

"In layman terms, it means that a crew must be flown to an airport to man a flight in order to avoid cancellation of said flight due to crew unavailability. This is a federal DOT regulation, not an airline one. The airlines are required to do so to avoid disruption of air traffic."
 
Michael 345 said:
However what seems to be missing in your outline is WHY he was traveling home as the passenger called out
Click to expand...

"WHY" is irrelevant. Everyone is expendable and everyone has a good reason to get to their destination. Shit happens. When you fly, you accept the risk of shit happening. If the guy really was a doctor, UA actually did the patient a favor by making him miss the flight. My God, can anyone imagine have such a dumb-ass doctor?

I do agree with the thepilotwifelife article linked above.
 
Meanwhile..in the real world:

"Chief Executive Officer Oscar Munoz said the company would not use law enforcement officers to remove overbooked passengers from aircraft. Munoz told ABC News that the problem resulted from a “system failure” that prevented employees from using “common sense” in the situation. He said he had no plans to resign over the incident that has drawn condemnation around the world. Munoz profusely apologized to the passenger, his family, passengers, the airline’s customers. “This can never, will never happen again,” he said.

Lawyers for the passenger, Dr. David Dao, issued a statement late on Tuesday confirming his identity and saying that he and his family were “focused only on Dr. Dao’s medical care and treatment” in a Chicago hospital.

The U.S. Department of Transportation launched an inquiry into the incident, and New Jersey Governor Chris Christie called for new rules to curb the airline practice of overbooking flights."---http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/united-airlines-changes-removal-policy-in-face-of-global-backlash_us_58ee18f6e4b0df7e2046df89

For the "pilot wife" and any other corporate bootlickers out there, the doctor had a concussion and doesn't even remember running back on the plane. That's one of the unfortunate effects of having your face slammed into an armrest.
 
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dsdsds said:
"WHY" is irrelevant. Everyone is expendable and everyone has a good reason to get to their destination. Shit happens. When you fly, you accept the risk of shit happening. If the guy really was a doctor, UA actually did the patient a favor by making him miss the flight. My God, can anyone imagine have such a dumb-ass doctor?

I do agree with the thepilotwifelife article linked above.
Click to expand...

I agree with the pilot wife life

However if the doctor who was best to operate on my dieing child didn't make it and another doctor steped in and child died the WHY becomes very relevant to me

Again it is NOT the regulations at fault

It's the stupid double stupid way they were implemented

AND the passenger is at no way responsible

I understand perhaps the POLICE who carried out the removal were acting with in the law and didn't have the luxury of explaining the intricacies of the law

Again BUT it should have never gone as far as to involve police

It a seating requirement not a hostage emergency

Stupid all round

:)
 
A family friend always volunteers to negotiate to be bumped from an overbooked flight. She has negotiated well, getting multiple free flights, hotel stays, and cash. As part of her last negotiation, she and her husband will be flown to and from Sicily for free with vouchers for 2 nights in local hotels.

With the airlines willing to negotiate, one would think that they could hold a reverse seat auction at the front of the plane and get enough volunteers to exit of their own free will.

......................................
Yeh, stupid all around.
 
Please do not insult other members.
dsdsds said:
Whether or not you think overbooking is right, is not the point.
Click to expand...

No, it is one of the points. Are you clueless?

It is lawful, all airlines do it, and the ticket prices we pay are lower because of it.
Click to expand...

you don't need to remind anyone that airlines do it nor that it's lawful (as if that make it good policy). it's stretching it to condone overbooking to say that is the only way to lower prices. you can just book the fuking seats you have. i've been on flights where it was half empty just as much as it was full. more dense flights vs less is just part of the terrain.

the major issue is around how you handle overbooking when that happens because it is unfair to those who paid or eliminate it.

BTW, it is you who is the idiot, not the ones you accuse of being entitled. wow, you are just all up inside the corporate asshole. with united's billions in revenue every year, they more than could have gotten their employees to their destination on another flight or used one of their goddamn private smaller planes etc or even gotten them a rental car. jesus christ, they were even further delayed by a few hours by this situation so evidently it wasn't that crucial their employees needed to be at their destination stat!!! and that isn't even the point if it was, it was still united's fault and they should have taken better measures.

people like you who just follow and uphold anything currently in place are not the ones who have anything to do with better change. it is the ones like that doctor who stood his ground that he was not going to be delayed since he had to get to work monday urgently besides the fact he paid for the ticket, and already checked his baggage and in his seat. no sirree bob, his actions and justification were legitimate.
 
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DaveC426913 said:
In the interest of objective discussion, consider this article:

https://thepilotwifelife.wordpress....thoughts-from-a-pilot-wife-about-flight-3411/

I don't defend it - the incident was still unacceptable, but it does inform the other side of the story.


By example, here's a point you probably won't see in the media:

"In layman terms, it means that a crew must be flown to an airport to man a flight in order to avoid cancellation of said flight due to crew unavailability. This is a federal DOT regulation, not an airline one. The airlines are required to do so to avoid disruption of air traffic."
Click to expand...
i would be loathe to trust that person given the dishonesty in description of the events where he cam back on the plan. attacking some who has just been illegally assualted and essentially mock their head reauma aren't good view points
 
DaveC426913 said:
By example, here's a point you probably won't see in the media:

"In layman terms, it means that a crew must be flown to an airport to man a flight in order to avoid cancellation of said flight due to crew unavailability. This is a federal DOT regulation, not an airline one. The airlines are required to do so to avoid disruption of air traffic."
Click to expand...
Even if other airlines were not a good option, if I had to bet I would put money on there having been more than one private jet, or small rental, available at that same or a nearby airport at that very time - including a couple owned or controlled by United Airlines management.
 
birch said:
wow, you are just all up inside the corporate asshole. with united's billions in revenue every year,
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I haven't posted much in a long while, but those who know me consider me to be very progressive and I consider myself an activist against corporate greed and corruption. At the same time I detest unlawfulness, disobedience, and failure to cooperate with the law. This incident is not so much about corporate greed than it is about one IDIOT who failed to comply to police orders AND THE LAW. Amazing how quickly social media consumers jumped on this. We can all relate to this "poor" man and instinctively vilify the evil billion dollar corp. Usually, the citizen is the victim, but not this time. The billion dollar corporations we should hate right now are the popular media who are manufacturing outrage from this incident -- and the sheep are drinking the Kool-aid.
pjdude1219 said:
as just been illegally assualted
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He wasn't illegally assaulted. He was force-ably removed from the plane after he failed to comply to police. Big difference. But he WILL get his millions after an out of court settlement because UA can't afford the bad publicity
 
dsdsds said:
WILL get his millions after an out of court settlement because UA can't afford the bad publicity
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And this is unfortunate in my view as it would appear if any case exists it would be limited to the possible excess of force by the police.
And it isn't the company or their insurer who pays as finally the cost is met by the customers.
Alex
 
dsdsds said:
I haven't posted much in a long while, but those who know me consider me to be very progressive and I consider myself an activist against corporate greed and corruption. At the same time I detest unlawfulness, disobedience, and failure to cooperate with the law. This incident is not so much about corporate greed than it is about one IDIOT who failed to comply to police orders AND THE LAW. Amazing how quickly social media consumers jumped on this. We can all relate to this "poor" man and instinctively vilify the evil billion dollar corp. Usually, the citizen is the victim, but not this time. The billion dollar corporations we should hate right now are the popular media who are manufacturing outrage from this incident -- and the sheep are drinking the Kool-aid.

He wasn't illegally assaulted. He was force-ably removed from the plane after he failed to comply to police. Big difference. But he WILL get his millions after an out of court settlement because UA can't afford the bad publicity
Click to expand...
no he was illegally assaulted. even if we accept your premise that it was ok to remove him which it wasn't. even if we accept the use of force justified here which has not been shown. they still used disproportionate force. they knocked him unconscious, knocked out some of his teeth, and generally damaged his face to the point he needs reconstructive surgery by any stretch of the imagination this is assault. or do you think the police are allowed to beat people? your just a corporate shill at this point justifying brutality
 
Even the United pilots are deploring this incident. I guess they're just sheep drinking the media koolaide too..

"On Thursday, United Airlines' pilots broke their silence on the violent removal of David Dao from Flight 3411.

"The safety and well-being of our passengers is the highest priority for United pilots, and this should not have escalated into a violent encounter," United Master Executive Council, the union representing the airline's 12,500 pilots, wrote in a letter.

"United pilots are infuriated by this event."

At the same time, the pilots sought to clarify their view of the situation.

"This occurred on one of our contracted Express carriers, separately owned and operated by Republic Airline, and was ultimately caused by the grossly inappropriate response by the Chicago Department of Aviation," the pilots wrote."

http://www.businessinsider.com/united-airlines-pilots-letter-2017-4
 
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