Seattle
Valued Senior Member
I don't think you understand the Great Depression or the national debt.
Trump 2.0
- Thread starter James R
- Start date
Maybe look at it as % increase?.And see which Presidents ramped up the debt as a % the most. Since Reagan ramped it up nearly 200% during his 8 years, most others have been 30-40%, Clinton on the lower side.
If you then strip out packages to aid recovery from republican-led recessions/economic turmoil, or global pandemics, then as % increases the Republicans lead the way. Mostly due to tax cuts.
He could have done already. But he didn't.
And yes, he will still be an orange-faced felon, by dint of him having appalling orange make-up that he insists on using to cover up what he obviously considers unsightly pale skin... or his cancerous blemishes, or whatever other ailments might be visibly manifest... and the fact that he is a 36-time felon.
He has potentially been the cause of prolonging the war in both areas by giving the aggressor in both places no reason to stop. Heck, in Gaza he even promoted the continuation of violence with his desire to build a resort! And with Ukraine he has flip-flopped from having a love-in in with Putin to feeling personally betrayed by him, while never actually seeking to understand the issues, the politics, and hence a viable solution. He has, in all probability, lengthened the war in Ukraine, and certainly hasn't shortened any conflict in Gaza.
And throughout he's always been the orange-faced felon. And he always will be.
"His deficit" is unfortunately more in the areas of intellect, literacy, honesty, fairness, justice, equality, basic decency, humanity, etc. With regard the US national debt, he has no genuine desire to reduce it, only to increase it for self-enriching reasons. He, ultimately, is not, and never has been, a President for the people. Only for his people. And unfortunately the MAGA-crowd have been conned into thinking that they are his people because he fuels their racist, mysoginistic, and Christian nationalist tendencies, when in fact his only concern is with the wealthy and, through them, his own self-aggrandisement.
From the outside looking in, it's a dumpster fire. Just a pity it's a fire that has the risk of burning the rest of the world along with it.
I mean, look at his recent efforts to do a trade deal with Canada, as he pulls out because someone played an ad quoting Reagan and his general dislike of tariffs. Trump, the baby, throwing his toys out of the pram. Boo hoo. Wah wah. Someone stick a dummy in his mouth and for God's sake let the grown ups return to the room, not the cos-play clowns he currently has in his cabinet.
Seattle
Valued Senior Member
Sounds like he is a bad guy. You could not vote for him but you don't live here so...
Lowering taxes is generally a good thing. Reagan wasn't a fan of tariffs in general, nor am I. You aren't a fan of Reagan so it's a moot reference I guess.
The debt is largely due to FDR (the way Social Security is run).
Lowering taxes is a good thing as long as you can cover your existing obligations. Tax cuts that simply add to the debt while not having the economic upside claimed, not so much.
No, the debt is due to not raising taxes to cover the spending, whatever spending that might be. If you want spending you need taxes. If you don't want taxes, don't agree to the spending. But once you've agreed to it, raise taxes to cover it. That way the people get a good idea of what it actually costs.
The debt is due to the imbalance of spending and taxes, not specific programs, and that imbalance is due to the inability of your country to tread a bipartisan centrist economic path, instead lurching from left to right, with partisan politics screwing everything up.
As for the debt "largely" being due to SS, you know that social security is paid out of receipts, with around a $2.5-3 trillion surplus built up at present. There is now an annual deficit (payments out exceed receipts in) but it can fund itself for around 10 more years.
So is the national debt mainly due to the way SS is run? No. It may cause the national debt to rise in the future to keep it funded, unless taxes are raised to cover it, but it is not yet impacting the debt.
At the moment the SS fund is a holder of US debt, having leant the surplus to the government to spend in exchange for treasuries. In what way is it therefore the main cause of the national debt??
Seattle
Valued Senior Member
To be more accurate and precise, the bulk of the debt is SS, Medicare/Medicaid and the military budget. SS isn't structured in a sustainable way (it's even worse in the UK) technically it's a problem now in the UK and soon in the US but because it allows "bad behavior" in the US it indirectly contributes to the debt. It's something the government borrows from. Soon it won't be able to do that. Currently in the UK it's a problem.
Medicare/Medicaid and the military currently is a problem in the US. Just like NHS is a problem in the UK.
We are taxed, the UK taxes even higher but they still can't fund the debt since they are at 100% debt to GDP so spending is the problem and not taxing. The UK can't tax enough to balance the budget and pay down the debt. Neither can the US for similar reasons. The UK is just a little further than the high tax road and that's not working either. Productivity is very poor. That's the effect of debt and high taxes on the economy.
We don't need to go further down the high tax route. The UK shows that the result is just low productivity. That's not the right direction to go.
TheVat
Valued Senior Member
Thanks, I was going to point all that out. A lot of the debt has grown when either cold war or hot war ramps up military allocations, but politicians (seeking always to curry favor with the electorate) don't raise taxes to cover it. Playing World Cop has been expensive for the US. For that, we can thank Woodrow Wilson, who laid out the basic framework for World Cops of Democacy.
Wizard of Whatever
Registered Senior Member
You put the blame on the right president. He should have kept us out of WW1.
Trump, still smarting from the Nobel Peace committee not bending over backwards and awarding him something he didn't deserve, despite his incessant pleasing, has decided that the US needs to resume it's nuclear weapons testing. Joy.
There's a nuclear test ban drafted from late 1990s, but never put in place as a few countries, notably Pakistan and India, and presumably N.Korea - not a nuclear power back then - never signed it. Since then really only n.korea have tested their warheads. China haven't. Russia haven't. Europe hasn't. Not for 30+ years.
But Trump seems to think the first two have, especially China, as he has said that the US needs to match other countries' testing. Okay, so that means no testing, right? If only. Or is it really just wanting the US to keep up with N.Korea???
Naturally Russia have said that if the US restart nuclear testing then so will they, and no doubt China actually will. And the world will once again reap the "benefits" of the testing, that most countries had worked hard to minimise. Maybe they'll start stockpiling again.
Trump once again taking a wrecking-ball to what should be common sense.
There's a nuclear test ban drafted from late 1990s, but never put in place as a few countries, notably Pakistan and India, and presumably N.Korea - not a nuclear power back then - never signed it. Since then really only n.korea have tested their warheads. China haven't. Russia haven't. Europe hasn't. Not for 30+ years.
But Trump seems to think the first two have, especially China, as he has said that the US needs to match other countries' testing. Okay, so that means no testing, right? If only. Or is it really just wanting the US to keep up with N.Korea???
Naturally Russia have said that if the US restart nuclear testing then so will they, and no doubt China actually will. And the world will once again reap the "benefits" of the testing, that most countries had worked hard to minimise. Maybe they'll start stockpiling again.
Trump once again taking a wrecking-ball to what should be common sense.
TheVat
Valued Senior Member
From the AP report I saw, it seemed unclear that Trump even understands what nuclear testing is - some had the impression he was confusing nuke testing with warhead delivery system testing, e.g. of missiles, bombers, etc. He kept claiming several other countries were now testing, but referenced ones which are only testing delivery, not actually detonating weapons. He remains a gibbering idiot.
We should note, though, failures to comprehend such differences are pretty much what the GOP lives on, these days.
A social media allegory: Once upon a time, some people thought, hey, maybe it would be a good idea if we expected people to support their arguments, and as long as they were demanding religious people prove God exists, it seemed like a great idea. Then, one day, one of the questions they sought to answer strayed too close to something someone liked, and facing the prospect that supporting their argument meant this argument was wrong, it was then resolved that expecting people to support their arguments unfairly silenced political views, and once that was finally resolved, everybody lived happily ever after.
Except, of course, for the people who still wanted the correct answer, but they don't count, so everybody lived happily ever after.
Except, of course, for the people hurt by the false answer, but they don't count, so everybody lived happily ever after.
Except, of course, for the people who hurt themselves for the sake of a false answer, but they can always blame it on liberals, who don't count, so everybody lives happily ever after.
You know, after they've sent armed agents to jail or kill everyone who doesn't count.
Oh, I guess we slipped out of allegory, there, didn't we?
[#WhatTheyVotedFor]
Well, as NYT editorial columnist Brett Stephens once explained↗, "Maybe it's time to think a little more deeply about the enduring sources of [Trump's] appeal."
In other news...
The "peace President" Trump has told the Pentagon to prepare for military action... not in Venezuela but in Nigeria!
Nigeria are currently experiencing issues with terrorists attacking the population, but without even asking the Nigerian government he has threatened that the US "may very well go into that now disgraced country, ‘guns-a-blazing,’ to completely wipe out the Islamic Terrorists who are committing these horrible atrocities.”
Why the sudden interest in Nigeria's problems? Ostensibly it's because Trump thinks the attacks are against Christians, while they're actually against those of all faiths and none, including Muslims.
Or is this really just another effort to refocus people's attention away from, say, the Epstein files, the government shutdown, and all the other fuck ups he's perpetrating?
The "peace President" Trump has told the Pentagon to prepare for military action... not in Venezuela but in Nigeria!
Nigeria are currently experiencing issues with terrorists attacking the population, but without even asking the Nigerian government he has threatened that the US "may very well go into that now disgraced country, ‘guns-a-blazing,’ to completely wipe out the Islamic Terrorists who are committing these horrible atrocities.”
Why the sudden interest in Nigeria's problems? Ostensibly it's because Trump thinks the attacks are against Christians, while they're actually against those of all faiths and none, including Muslims.
Or is this really just another effort to refocus people's attention away from, say, the Epstein files, the government shutdown, and all the other fuck ups he's perpetrating?
The Crusades worked out so well the first time!
So, next on the conveyor-belt of Trump's unethical (and illegal?) behaviour is his threats and coercion around the New York mayoral election. He has threatened to withhold all but the legally required minimum federal funding to the city should the "communist" Mamdani prevail over Cuomo (who is running as an independent after Mamdani won the Democratic nomination).
Should Mamdani win, "It is highly unlikely that I will be contributing Federal Funds, other than the very minimum as required" Trump announced.
Now, my question is how many violations of the Constitution does this threat break? He has already started defunding, or trying to refund, primarily Democratic programs in Democratic states, but the Constitution seems clear that criteria for funding (or to remove funding) can not be coercive.
It is, as with much of Trump's administrative efforts, an abuse of power. When, if ever, will this catch up with him? Or will the SCOTUS change the interpretation of the Constitution again so as to support his actions?
www.bbc.co.uk
And elsewhere, I saw a YT clip of someone going through the "IQ", or aptitude, test that Trump repeatedly claims he takes and "aces". (And remember, not many people out there will ace it, he says, but he did!). The clip was of a medical doctor administering the test to the host. But, as everyone is probably aware, it's nothing but a dementia screening test - and used to see how far it is progressing - and most people with dementia still score highly. So keeping bragging, Donald.
Should Mamdani win, "It is highly unlikely that I will be contributing Federal Funds, other than the very minimum as required" Trump announced.
Now, my question is how many violations of the Constitution does this threat break? He has already started defunding, or trying to refund, primarily Democratic programs in Democratic states, but the Constitution seems clear that criteria for funding (or to remove funding) can not be coercive.
It is, as with much of Trump's administrative efforts, an abuse of power. When, if ever, will this catch up with him? Or will the SCOTUS change the interpretation of the Constitution again so as to support his actions?
Trump backs Cuomo for New York City mayor and threatens to cut funding if Mamdani wins
Opinion polls indicate left-wing candidate Zohran Mamdani is ahead of former state governor Andrew Cuomo for Tuesday’s race.
www.bbc.co.uk
And elsewhere, I saw a YT clip of someone going through the "IQ", or aptitude, test that Trump repeatedly claims he takes and "aces". (And remember, not many people out there will ace it, he says, but he did!). The clip was of a medical doctor administering the test to the host. But, as everyone is probably aware, it's nothing but a dementia screening test - and used to see how far it is progressing - and most people with dementia still score highly. So keeping bragging, Donald.
exchemist
Valued Senior Member
Flood the zone with shit.
It's what happens when bigotry is just that important.
exchemist
Valued Senior Member
Oh yes, I should have said: "Flood the zone with shit, while garnering some cost-free creep points with the Religious Right and the Islamophobes."
He won't do anything in Nigeria: it's all the usual piss and wind.
True, just like the years of Republican talk about domestic pogrom, all just piss and wind.
Cheer up, man. They're bangin' away on transgender. That, at least, should help you sleep a little easier↑.
exchemist
Valued Senior Member
