Secular Law = Rape

[James R]

Christ said, "New wine is not poured into old skins." The New Testament is the "new skins" and the Old Testament is the "old skins."

In Matthew 5:17, Jesus says "Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them."

In Matthew 5:18, Jesus says that not the "smallest letter" of the Law will pass away until all is accomplished.

And, for good measure, in Matthew 5:19, Jesus adds that anyone who breaks even the least of the commandments or teaches others to do so will be called "least in the kingdom of heaven".

Do you wear clothes of mixed cloths, Olga? e.g. polymer-cotton blends? The law of the Old Testament forbids that. Have you ever eaten shellfish or pork? Jesus says no!, or else you'll be the least in the kingdom of heaven.

I do not support genocide, and I have never supported it.

So, to be clear, you think that God ordering Moses and the Isaelites to kill all the innocent Midianite children was an immoral act? Or not?

But I will not accuse the Israelis of defending themselves either. The one who attacked first is to blame. And this is not Israel.

So, to be clear, do you think that Israeli soldiers shooting 3 year old children in the head is justified, or is it a war crime?

As for the fact that God allegedly told someone to kill innocents... You never know what it seemed to someone. They could simply distort everything, or misinterpret it.

Are you saying that the story of in Numbers about the massacre of the Midianites is an error in the bible, then?

Is the bible full of errors, Olga, or is this an isolated example?

 

[Olga]

In Matthew 5:17, Jesus says "Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them."

In Matthew 5:18, Jesus says that not the "smallest letter" of the Law will pass away until all is accomplished.

And, for good measure, in Matthew 5:19, Jesus adds that anyone who breaks even the least of the commandments or teaches others to do so will be called "least in the kingdom of heaven".

Do you wear clothes of mixed cloths, Olga? e.g. polymer-cotton blends? The law of the Old Testament forbids that. Have you ever eaten shellfish or pork? Jesus says no!, or else you'll be the least in the kingdom of heaven.


So, to be clear, you think that God ordering Moses and the Isaelites to kill all the innocent Midianite children was an immoral act? Or not?

So, to be clear, do you think that Israeli soldiers shooting 3 year old children in the head is justified, or is it a war crime?

Are you saying that the story of in Numbers about the massacre of the Midianites is an error in the bible, then?

Is the bible full of errors, Olga, or is this an isolated example?

А о нарушении каких заповедей идёт речь? Не убий, не укради, не прелюбодействуй, и т.д.? Так не нарушайте их, они хорошие.
Христос дал нам закон: "Возлюби Господа Бога всем сердцем твоим, и всею душею твоею, и всем разумением твоим, и всею крепостию твоею", и другой, подобный ему: "Возлюби ближнего твоего, как самого себя".

Насчёт моллюсков и одежды - это какой то бред. У нас все священники и монахи едят моллюсков, и носят любую одежду, кроме развратной. Это у вас на Западе священники такой бред несут в массы? Не удивительно, что Восточная церковь решила отделиться от Западной.

Я думаю, что Бог этого не приказывал. Или Он, будучи Всезнающим, заранее знал, что из них всех вырастут террористы.

Откуда вы знаете, что это израильские солдаты стреляли? Откуда вы знаете, что это не была случайная пуля? У вас есть доказательства?

Я живу по Новому Завету, потому что я христианка. По Ветхому живут иудеи, у них и спрашивайте.

 

[Wizard of Whatever]

War became so devastating, so destructive we made rules for it. If a combatant laid his weapons down then he became a prisoner and by international law, he was expected to be treated humanely till the conflict was ended.
Rules on weapons and civilians too, I do not know every aspect of the Geneva convention.
The thing is Olga th upat our aggressive species, the apex predator on the planet had to learn these things as we became more civilised. It took humanity a while to eventually realise that slavery was not such a great idea too.
This was all completely independent of any teaching from any holy book including the Bible, which actually gives instructions on the rape of children, genocide and slavery, the absolute worst things that we can do.

I believe the Geneva convention has made war more acceptable in this era of highly destructive weapons.

War should be a last resort, but in this case the only rule is to win.

 

[billvon]

Murders come in all shapes and sizes. Our grandfathers killed millions of fascists during WWII. But no one condemns them for it.

Lots of people condemn them for killing innocent civilians during World War II.

When the United States dropped their bombs over Japan, were they very concerned about the babies living there?

Yes, and it very nearly did not happen due to that. There were tens of millions of people opposed.

The land was a treasure at the time. Besides, the knights plundered everything they could, and that, too, was money.

Like I said, that was the only financial incentive - that the knights could end up with land afterwards. By far the biggest objective was to kill Muslims. It was a holy war.

What the Pope said doesn't interest me much. I'm Orthodox.

The Pope was the voice of God for the people in the Crusades.

Christianity teaches love, not violence.

Many Christians do that. However, a great many others use it as an excuse for cruelty, persecution and violence.

And the Old Testament simply describes the morals of that time.

Which is part of the Bible. Which is why using the Bible as a guide for morality is a terrible idea.

 

[billvon]

Christ said, "You don't put new wine into old wineskins." The New Testament is "new wineskins," and the Old Testament is "old wineskins."

Jesus literally said that he did not come to change "one jot or title" of the old law until it was 100% fulfilled.

Do you disagree with Jesus?

I don't support genocide, and I never have. But I also won't blame the Israelis for defending themselves. The one who attacked first is to blame. And that's not Israel.

That's like someone trying to murder you in cold blood because you started it by killing all the Khazars.

Would you consider that justified?

God Regarding supposedly telling someone to kill innocents... who knows what they imagined. They could have simply twisted everything or misinterpreted it.

If the entire Bible is subject to such misunderstandings - surely it would be wise to ignore what it says lest you find yourself supporting the twisted imaginings of an insane man.

I live by the New Testament because I'm a Christian.

But if that also may contain the twisted imaginings of insane people - why would you?

 

[James R]

Olga:

And what commandments are we talking about?

Jesus was referring to all of the laws in the Jewish Torah - basically everything set out in the first 5 books of the Old Testament. That includes the so-called "ten commandments", but there are many more laws that that, and those commandments are not set apart from the other laws in the text.

Christ gave us the law: "Thou shalt love the Lord God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength," and another, like it: "Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself."

The second law is not like the first law. The reason for the first law is that Jesus, like the Jews before him, knew that there were many other gods that people worshipped apart from Yahweh. It's also why three or four of the ten commandments are so fixated about worshipping the "right" god. It's religious paranoia, basically.

As for shellfish and clothes - this is some kind of nonsense.

It's part of the biblical law.

All our priests and monks eat shellfish, and wear any clothes except depraved.

So they ignore parts of the Old Testament law. I understand. Most Christians do.

It's standard practice in Christianity to cherry pick the parts of the bible you want to follow and ignore the parts you find distasteful or inconvenient.

Is it in your West that priests bring such nonsense to the masses?

No. Western priests generally ignore parts of the biblical law, too.

I don't think God commanded it.

You're saying the bible contains lies about what God did. Okay.

Or He, being the Omniscient, knew in advance that they would all grow up to be terrorists.

And, according to you, it's okay to massacre children if you magically know they will grow up to be terrorists. I see.

And you think that God knew for certain that every single one of those Midianite kids was, for sure, going to grow up to be a terrorist, without exception, because God is Mister Magic.

And what about those kid's mothers, who weren't fighting the Israelites or committing terrorist acts, but who were looking after their 3 year old kids? Did God know in advance that, for sure, all those mothers would grow up to be terrorists, too?

And if this whole terrorism excuse is the reason why it was okay for God to order the genocide, why doesn't the bible mention that, even once?

How do you know that it was the Israeli soldiers who fired?

Suppose I don't, for the sake of argument.

If evidence were to come to light that clearly shows that Israeli soldiers shot innocent children in cold blooded murder, would you say they were justified in doing that, or would you say they committed a war crime?

Why is this question so hard for you?

How do you know it wasn't a random bullet? Do you have proof?

Yes. I have good evidence. There are, in fact, many examples of children being deliberately shot in the head by Israeli soldiers in Gaza, without provocation.

The United Nations has resolved that the Israeli government set out to carry out a genocide in Gaza. Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu is an accused war criminal wanted by the International Criminal Court.

I live the New Testament because I'm a Christian.

Is the bible in error when it reports Jesus as saying that his followers should keep all the Jewish laws of the Old Testament?

 

[James R]

I believe the Geneva convention has made war more acceptable in this era of highly destructive weapons.

Under the charter of the United Nations, going to war is only justified in one circumstance: self defence when a nation is attacked.

So, for example, Ukraine going to war with Russia is justifiable self-defence, since Russia started an illegal war of aggression against Ukraine.

 

[Olga]

Jesus literally said that he did not come to change "one jot or title" of the old law until it was 100% fulfilled.

Do you disagree with Jesus?



That's like someone trying to murder you in cold blood because you started it by killing all the Khazars.

Would you consider that justified?



If the entire Bible is subject to such misunderstandings - surely it would be wise to ignore what it says lest you find yourself supporting the twisted imaginings of an insane man.



But if that also may contain the twisted imaginings of insane people - why would you?

Что за закон? В чём его суть?

Если бы кто то так издевался над кем то из моих близких, как это сделали террористы с израильтянами - я бы истребила не только всех этих террористов, но и всю их родню до седьмого колена. Можете считать меня монстром. Я такая, как есть, и не стараюсь выглядеть святее Папы Римского.

Сектанты очень любят толковать Ветхий Завет. Хорошо, что секты у нас запретили. Ибо не фиг людям мозги засерать.

В Новом Завете нет ничего плохого. Если бы все люди жили по Христовым заповедям, то на Земле уже давно бы Рай установился.

 

[Olga]

Olga:

Jesus was referring to all of the laws in the Jewish Torah - basically everything set out in the first 5 books of the Old Testament. That includes the so-called "ten commandments", but there are many more laws that that, and those commandments are not set apart from the other laws in the text.

The second law is not like the first law. The reason for the first law is that Jesus, like the Jews before him, knew that there were many other gods that people worshipped apart from Yahweh. It's also why three or four of the ten commandments are so fixated about worshipping the "right" god. It's religious paranoia, basically.

It's part of the biblical law.

So they ignore parts of the Old Testament law. I understand. Most Christians do.

It's standard practice in Christianity to cherry pick the parts of the bible you want to follow and ignore the parts you find distasteful or inconvenient.

No. Western priests generally ignore parts of the biblical law, too.

You're saying the bible contains lies about what God did. Okay.

And, according to you, it's okay to massacre children if you magically know they will grow up to be terrorists. I see.

And you think that God knew for certain that every single one of those Midianite kids was, for sure, going to grow up to be a terrorist, without exception, because God is Mister Magic.

And what about those kid's mothers, who weren't fighting the Israelites or committing terrorist acts, but who were looking after their 3 year old kids? Did God know in advance that, for sure, all those mothers would grow up to be terrorists, too?

And if this whole terrorism excuse is the reason why it was okay for God to order the genocide, why doesn't the bible mention that, even once?


Suppose I don't, for the sake of argument.

If evidence were to come to light that clearly shows that Israeli soldiers shot innocent children in cold blooded murder, would you say they were justified in doing that, or would you say they committed a war crime?

Why is this question so hard for you?

Yes. I have good evidence. There are, in fact, many examples of children being deliberately shot in the head by Israeli soldiers in Gaza, without provocation.

The United Nations has resolved that the Israeli government set out to carry out a genocide in Gaza. Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu is an accused war criminal wanted by the International Criminal Court.

Is the bible in error when it reports Jesus as saying that his followers should keep all the Jewish laws of the Old Testament?

Откуда вы знаете, что Он имел ввиду? Вы с ним разговаривали? Христос сам учил думать головой прежде всего, а не просто исполнять законы. Его в этом и обвиняли фарисеи, в том, что он субботу, например, не соблюдает. И пьёт с грешниками. И лечит не только иудеев.

Не увидела здесь паранойи.

Какого закона? Что за бред? У вас в голове всё смешалось, и иудаизм, и ислам, и христианство. Вы ещё скажите, что христианам обрезание положено делать...

Потому что это христианство, а не иудаизм. Вы не видите разницу?

Уже хорошо.

Я этого не говорила. Речь шла о неверной интерпретации.

Что не упоминается? Терроризм? Он там всегда был. И об этом даже Давид сокрушался: "сколько раз я приходил к ним с миром, но только я к миру - они к войне".

Если бы у бабушки был член, она была бы дедушкой.

Так намеревалось совершить, или совершило? Вы уж определитесь.

Он этого не говорил. И сам их нарушал.

 

[Olga]

Under the charter of the United Nations, going to war is only justified in one circumstance: self defence when a nation is attacked.

So, for example, Ukraine going to war with Russia is justifiable self-defence, since Russia started an illegal war of aggression against Ukraine.

А что Палестина сделала против Израиля 7 октября?

 

[James R]

Olga:

Why can't you use the quote tags in your posts to show what parts of a post you are reply to? Without them, it is very difficult to follow what you are referring to.

How do you know what He meant?

By paying attention to the context of his statements in the bible. Also, this is the scholarly consensus on the matter, from experts on the bible.

Christ Himself taught to think with one's head first of all, and not just to obey the laws.

He said his followers should obey the laws. It's right there in the bible.

I didn't see paranoia here.

Look harder. Why is the bible so repetitive about warning the Israelites of dire consequences if they worship other gods? It's because there were other gods available for them to worship, and they had a habit of straying from Yahweh worship, according to the bible.

That's the reason for Commandment number 1.

If there weren't any other gods vying for the Israelites' worship, that commandment would be unnecessary and irrelevant.

What law?

The Torah. I told you before. Don't you know how the bible is organised, Olga? Don't you know why the Old Testament is included in your Christian bible?

What kind of nonsense?

I don't know what you're referring to.

Everything is mixed up in your head, Judaism, Islam, and Christianity.

No. You seem to be unaware of the laws of Moses, other than the ten commandments. Jesus said his followers should obey those laws.

You will also say that Christians are supposed to be circumcised...

God commands it in Genesis chapter 17.

Because this is Christianity, not Judaism. Don't you see the difference?

Does Jesus say in the bible "Forget circumcision, guys! That law no longer applies,"?

Where is that in the bible?

Jesus does say that he has not come to change "a jot or a tittle" of the law. (see Matthew 5:17) (Probably that doesn't translate very well into Russian. Paraphrasing, he says, in the bible, that he has not come to change the laws of Moses, set out in the Torah (e.g. Genesis chapter 17)

It's already good.

What are you referring to?

I didn't say that. It was a misinterpretation.

What are you referring to?

What is not mentioned? Terrorism?

Yes. The bible does not report God saying to Moses "It's okay to kill all the Midianite infants, because if you don't I know they they will all grow up to be terrorists."

That's not in the bible. Not mentioned anywhere.

He has always been there.

Who has always been where?

And even David lamented this: "How many times have I come to them in peace, but only I to peace, they to war."

If grandma had a dick, she would be a grandfather.

I don't know what you're talking about.

Did you intend to do so, or did you do it? You have to decide.

What are you talking about? Do I intend to do what?

He didn't say that. And he himself violated them.

Who didn't say what? Who violated what/whom? What are you talking about?

And what did Palestine do against Israel on October 7?

Palestine did nothing. Hamas terrorists killed a whole lot of innocent people and kidnapped a whole bunch of hostages.
---

You still didn't answer many of the questions I asked you, Olga. Why not? Here is one of them again:

If evidence were to come to light that clearly shows that Israeli soldiers shot innocent children in cold blooded murder, would you say they were justified in doing that, or would you say they committed a war crime?

Why is this question so hard for you? Why are you avoiding answering it? This is the third time I have asked you. Do you approve of the murder of innocent children, or disapprove? Or does it depend on whether they are Palestinian or Israeli children, for you?

 

[Olga]

Olga:

Why can't you use the quote tags in your posts to show what parts of a post you are reply to? Without them, it is very difficult to follow what you are referring to.

By paying attention to the context of his statements in the bible. Also, this is the scholarly consensus on the matter, from experts on the bible.

He said his followers should obey the laws. It's right there in the bible.

Look harder. Why is the bible so repetitive about warning the Israelites of dire consequences if they worship other gods? It's because there were other gods available for them to worship, and they had a habit of straying from Yahweh worship, according to the bible.

That's the reason for Commandment number 1.

If there weren't any other gods vying for the Israelites' worship, that commandment would be unnecessary and irrelevant.

The Torah. I told you before. Don't you know how the bible is organised, Olga? Don't you know why the Old Testament is included in your Christian bible?

I don't know what you're referring to.

No. You seem to be unaware of the laws of Moses, other than the ten commandments. Jesus said his followers should obey those laws.

God commands it in Genesis chapter 17.

Does Jesus say in the bible "Forget circumcision, guys! That law no longer applies,"?

Where is that in the bible?

Jesus does say that he has not come to change "a jot or a tittle" of the law. (see Matthew 5:17) (Probably that doesn't translate very well into Russian. Paraphrasing, he says, in the bible, that he has not come to change the laws of Moses, set out in the Torah (e.g. Genesis chapter 17)


What are you referring to?

What are you referring to?

Yes. The bible does not report God saying to Moses "It's okay to kill all the Midianite infants, because if you don't I know they they will all grow up to be terrorists."

That's not in the bible. Not mentioned anywhere.

Who has always been where?

I don't know what you're talking about.

What are you talking about? Do I intend to do what?

Who didn't say what? Who violated what/whom? What are you talking about?

Palestine did nothing. Hamas terrorists killed a whole lot of innocent people and kidnapped a whole bunch of hostages.
---

You still didn't answer many of the questions I asked you, Olga. Why not? Here is one of them again:

If evidence were to come to light that clearly shows that Israeli soldiers shot innocent children in cold blooded murder, would you say they were justified in doing that, or would you say they committed a war crime?

Why is this question so hard for you? Why are you avoiding answering it? This is the third time I have asked you. Do you approve of the murder of innocent children, or disapprove? Or does it depend on whether they are Palestinian or Israeli children, for you?

Джеймс, у меня не получается выделить текст на этом сайте. Поэтому я и отвечаю вам по пунктам на каждый ваш вопрос, просто отделяя их как абзац. Посмотрите на свой предыдущий пост, и сопоставьте мои ответы, чтобы вы могли понять на какой ваш вопрос я отвечаю. Я предлагала вам нумеровать ваши вопросы, чтобы вам не приходилось гадать, но вы сами не захотели. У меня также не получается ставить здесь смайлики, и прикреплять фото и видео. Это только здесь, на российских сайтах всё нормально. Возможно, Яндекс не позволяет сделать это здесь.

Убивать мирное население - это военное преступление. Но если бы эти дети были обмотаны взрывчаткой, и намеревались напасть на солдат, то в этом случае это была бы самооборона.

Я не уклоняюсь от ответов. Я вам ответила в прошлый раз, просто вы не поняли. Мирных жителей убивать нельзя, независимо от того, дети это, или взрослые люди.

 

[James R]

James, I can't highlight the text on this site.

There's no need for that, as you must know. When you hit "Reply" on a post, it puts the text of that quote in a box. It is easy to insert carriage returns in the middle of that text and put your responses between the pieces of broken-up quotes.

You must just be lazy - too lazy to translate your posts. Too lazy to use the quote function. Too lazy to think. etc. And, now, more regularly dishonest as well.

I suggested that you number your questions so that you don't have to guess, but you didn't want to.

Ever since you arrived here you have been reluctant to show the people here any courtesy. You do things your way and you don't care how that affects other people who interact with you.

It's surprising to me that people here still want to interact with you at all.

Another problem is that you keep injecting irrelevant comments and topic changes into discussion threads. That has become tiresome. If you keep doing it, I will start asking you, officially, to stop it.

I also can't put emoticons here, and attach photos and videos. It's only here, on Russian sites, everything is fine. Yandex may not allow you to do this here.

I wouldn't be at all surprised to learn that your government restricts your ability to post freely on internet sites hosted outside of Russia. It's what happens when you live under an autocratic regime.

Killing civilians is a war crime. But if these children were wrapped in explosives, and they intended to attack the soldiers, then in this case it would be self-defense.

Okay, So there were three times when you refused to answer the question, and this time around you are still making excuses for shooting little children.

I think we're done.

I do not shy away from answers.

Don't tell lies, Olga. That has become very tiresome.

Civilians should not be killed, regardless of whether they are children or adults.

What if God knows they will grow up to be terrorists? What if you suspect that God knows that?

 

[billvon]

What is this law? What is its essence?

It is the law of the Bible.

If someone were to torture one of my loved ones the way the terrorists did to the Israelis, I would exterminate not only all of those terrorists, but also their entire family down to the seventh generation. Call me a monster. I am who I am, and I don't try to look holier than the Pope.

OK. Then the terrorists would be justified in killing you and all of your family. An eye for an eye and all that.

And since you (Russia) did exactly that to the Khazars, then you are the one who 'deserves' death per your morality.

Sectarians love to interpret the Old Testament. It's a good thing they banned sects here. Because it's no good messing with people's minds.

That they do, that they do. Indeed it is fortunate that (almost) no one takes either part of the Bible literally.

There's nothing wrong with the New Testament. If all people lived by Christ's commandments, Paradise would have been established on Earth long ago.

Do you hate your mother and father as the New Testament demands of Christ's most devoted followers? "If anyone comes to me and does not hate his own father and mother and wife and children and brothers and sisters, yes, and even his own life, he cannot be my disciple."

Would you support killing everyone in a country that does not support the leader (religious or secular) of that country? "But as for those enemies of mine who did not want me for their king, bring them here and slaughter them in my presence."

Do you think the fearful deserve eternal suffering, the same way liars do? "But the fearful . . .and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone."

Now, your next reply will be "but I support everything in the New Testament except X Y and Z." And there's no problem with that; all Christians do it. But it also means there is no Biblical morality; just a menu for you to pick and choose from.

 

[Olga]

There's no need for that, as you must know. When you hit "Reply" on a post, it puts the text of that quote in a box. It is easy to insert carriage returns in the middle of that text and put your responses between the pieces of broken-up quotes.

You must just be lazy - too lazy to translate your posts. Too lazy to use the quote function. Too lazy to think. etc. And, now, more regularly dishonest as well.

Ever since you arrived here you have been reluctant to show the people here any courtesy. You do things your way and you don't care how that affects other people who interact with you.

It's surprising to me that people here still want to interact with you at all.

Another problem is that you keep injecting irrelevant comments and topic changes into discussion threads. That has become tiresome. If you keep doing it, I will start asking you, officially, to stop it.

I wouldn't be at all surprised to learn that your government restricts your ability to post freely on internet sites hosted outside of Russia. It's what happens when you live under an autocratic regime.

Okay, So there were three times when you refused to answer the question, and this time around you are still making excuses for shooting little children.

I think we're done.

Don't tell lies, Olga. That has become very tiresome.

What if God knows they will grow up to be terrorists? What if you suspect that God knows that?

Джеймс, просто воспользуйтесь кнопкой "игнорировать". После вашего письма мне, я больше не собираюсь с вами общаться. До свидания.

 

[Olga]

It is the law of the Bible.



OK. Then the terrorists would be justified in killing you and all of your family. An eye for an eye and all that.

And since you (Russia) did exactly that to the Khazars, then you are the one who 'deserves' death per your morality.



That they do, that they do. Indeed it is fortunate that (almost) no one takes either part of the Bible literally.



Do you hate your mother and father as the New Testament demands of Christ's most devoted followers? "If anyone comes to me and does not hate his own father and mother and wife and children and brothers and sisters, yes, and even his own life, he cannot be my disciple."

Would you support killing everyone in a country that does not support the leader (religious or secular) of that country? "But as for those enemies of mine who did not want me for their king, bring them here and slaughter them in my presence."

Do you think the fearful deserve eternal suffering, the same way liars do? "But the fearful . . .and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone."

Now, your next reply will be "but I support everything in the New Testament except X Y and Z." And there's no problem with that; all Christians do it. But it also means there is no Biblical morality; just a menu for you to pick and choose from.

Билл, я сейчас получила личное письмо от Джеймса, в котором он пишет, что мои посты раздражают некоего пользователя, и этот пользователь угрожает покинуть сайт, если я не прекращу писать. Поэтому Джеймс настоятельно рекомендует мне воздержаться от написания постов, потому что этот пользователь ему очень дорог. Так что, Билл, я воздержусь от написания здесь чего либо, и побуду зрителем. Люблю наблюдать за закатом...

 

[James R]

James, just use the "ignore" button.

I can't do that. I need to see posts in case there are issues that require moderation.

After your letter to me, I am not going to communicate with you anymore. Good bye.

To other readers: here, Olga is referring to a personal message I sent to her today. The content of my message was just to tell her than I will be keeping a closer eye on off-topic posting. The purpose was to inform her about this in advance, because in her time on this forum she has tried to change the topic in many threads. It was a courtesy heads-up.

It's fine to chat a bit, but Olga's habit of rambling from one topic to another in threads has become disruptive, to the point where long-term members of the forum are jumping ship.

I am not targeting Olga specifically, by the way. I will be looking more carefully at off-topic posting across the board.

Just remember, Olga: my inner biorobot made me do it!

 

[Pinball1970]

For the record I think Jesus existed (scholarly consensus) his messages were mainly of peace, kindness and humanity when he was not obsessed with the new kingdom.

 

[Pinball1970]

W.r.t. the thread title however, we have not had a good argument for the claim that Atheism or secularism leads to rape.

kx000 made the claim.

We have cited passages from Samuel, Joshua, Numbers, Deuteronomy that have orders from Yhwh ordering acts of rape violence and murder towards women and children.

So we could say Biblical Theism = rape (violence, war, murder, genocide, misogyny, homophobia)

Atheism does not = moral behaviour, I do not make that claim.
Neither does, socialism, communism, capitalism or liberalism, why would they?

Speaking for my people however, secularists, atheists and anti theists, we do not have instructions to commit crimes documented anywhere. If there is a book out there by Russell, Pol Pot, Stalin, i reject it utterly.
We ditched god not our humanity.

 

[DaveC426913]

W.r.t. the thread title however, we have not had a good argument for the claim that Atheism or secularism leads to rape.

Nor, I suspect, will we. kx000 is notoriously flaky.


In fact, I would argue, since the opening question is poorly formed, the thread should be locked, Otherwise we are all erecting strawmwn.

No, not poorly-rmed. Simplistic.


"If you atheists are inherently unmoral, then..."


OK, well, athiests are not "inherenlty unmoral", so I guess we're done here?