overpopulation?

[madanthonywayne]

I'd love to see how you arrived at that conclusion.

Ok, I put these two statements together:

Our species is determined to live stupid and to commit slow suicide anyway. I see trends in our civilisation, embraced by the majority, which are leading us straight down the toilet.

I'm actually hoping for some catastrophic changes which will wipe out most of humanity

You clearly said that the majority embraces ideas that you believe to be stupid, so you are hoping for a catastrophy that will "wipe out" most of humanity.

You see, it's one thing to say that you believe mankind is making poor choices that may well lead to a disaster that wipes out most of the population and that you hope that, should it happen, we at least learn our lesson and emerge the better for it. It's another to say you don't approve of trends embraced by the majority so you hope the majority is wiped out by some catastrophy.

Do you see the difference? I'd hope that what you meant was the former, as the later is (IMHO) pure evil.

 

[iceaura]

I see trends in our civilisation, embraced by the majority, which are leading us straight down the toilet.
”
Since the majority doesn't agree with you, you wish for their death.

This is classic magical thinking:

To predict or envision something is to help bring it about, to be responsible for it - to envision a disaster is to support it, encourage it, influence the universe toward its occurrence.

Those who deny the possibility of an incoming disaster are, by the same token, the most innocent of it. They bear no responsibility for it - they didn't even think it was going to happen, and none of their thoughts encouraged its occurrence.

 

[madanthonywayne]

This is classic magical thinking:

To predict or envision something is to help bring it about, to be responsible for it - to envision a disaster is to support it, encourage it, influence the universe toward its occurrence.

Those who deny the possibility of an incoming disaster are, by the same token, the most innocent of it. They bear no responsibility for it - they didn't even think it was going to happen, and none of their thoughts encouraged its occurrence.

You are unbelievable. I'm not complaining about what he envisions, but rather about what he wants to happen. What he desires. What he hopes will happen. To quote:
Originally Posted by Scaramouche
I'm actually hoping for some catastrophic changes which will wipe out most of humanity

My concern is that when someone states a desire that the human race be wiped out this may lead to action such as that discussed in the eco-terrorism thread. Or his statements about the desirability of human extinction (or near extinction) may encourage some other nutjob to do something to make it happen.

Please keep your magic and your theories based on magic to yourself.

 

[spidergoat]

I often wish the human race were wiped out, except me of course, and my hareem. I don't believe in making that happen though, that would be immoral.

 

[Baron Max]

I often wish the human race were wiped out, except me of course, and my hareem. I don't believe in making that happen though, that would be immoral.

Humans have harmed and/or destroyed lots of things and people ...wishing something like them being all wiped out would be nothing more than justice.

We'd kill any other animal that did anything like the damage that humans have done ...and we'd feel satisfied and justified.

Baron Max

 

[Baron Max]

My concern is that when someone states a desire that the human race be wiped out this may lead to action such as that discussed in the eco-terrorism thread. ...

This thread, and several others here, have been discussing global climate change and vast global pollution, all or most of it y'all attribute to the human race. And yet, Madant, with all of that destruction and damage to the Earth, you're worried about a little bit more from eco-terrorists who are enticed to do a little burning of some building? ...LOL!

Geez, Madant, you act like those eco-terrorist could do more damage than the "nice guys" of the human race? ..LOL!

Baron Max

 

[Scaramouche]

Ok, I put these two statements together:

You clearly said that the majority embraces ideas that you believe to be stupid, so you are hoping for a catastrophy that will "wipe out" most of humanity.

As opposed to slow death with no change. The deaths are going to happen. There's no getting around it, and there's no point blaming it on me. That's just retarded. However, if the options are: 1, people dying as always and no positive changes and our civilisation keeps going down the tubes; 2, we suffer massive, catastrophic changes and people die as always and things might change for the better. Then I go with 2. As I explained earlier:

1. Are we all going to die? Yes.

2. Given 1, is it better if we all die and there are no positive changes, or we all die and there are positive changes? The latter.

3. Does 2 means I want to murder anyone? No. It's just recognizing the facts and hoping for the more beneficial outcome.

 

[madanthonywayne]

As opposed to slow death with no change. The deaths are going to happen. There's no getting around it, and there's no point blaming it on me. That's just retarded. However, if the options are: 1, people dying as always and no positive changes and our civilisation keeps going down the tubes; 2, we suffer massive, catastrophic changes and people die as always and things might change for the better. Then I go with 2. As I explained earlier:

1. Are we all going to die? Yes.

2. Given 1, is it better if we all die and there are no positive changes, or we all die and there are positive changes? The latter.

3. Does 2 means I want to murder anyone? No. It's just recognizing the facts and hoping for the more beneficial outcome.

Stop with this "we're all going to die" crap. Of course we are. But the human race lives on. That is, unless you get your wish. And why does your only idea for positive change involve the near extinction of the human species? If I take you at your word, that seems like a pretty crappy plan.

Here's the plan:

• First, 99.9% of us die.
  
• Then, we experience positive change!!!!!

 

[Scaramouche]

Stop with this "we're all going to die" crap. Of course we are. But the human race lives on. That is, unless you get your wish. And why does your only idea for positive change involve the near extinction of the human species? If I take you at your word, that seems like a pretty crappy plan.

Here's the plan:

• First, 99.9% of us die.
  
• Then, we experience positive change!!!!!

Well, it depends what happens. The odds are stacked against us from the start.

If it's something causing rapid and extreme sea level increase, well, a third of our species lives within ten vertical metres of sea level; along with our ports and much of our industry, logistics capability, and just plain old cities. So a large sea level increase would obviously have a powerful effect.

Asteroid maybe? That could be even worse. What about a plague of some sort? Or what about using GM crops for 90% of the world's food for a couple of generations, then discovering it's fucking us over so badly that it'll reduce fertility to such an extent that we might as well have been hit by an asteroid?

Even just considering rocks from space, the odds are against us. It doesn't take any planning on my part or anyone else's. But there are so many more ways to go down. Eventually, it's entirely possible one or more such things may happen. And I'm a glass half full kind of guy.

 

[Blindman]

Population growth is good. More workers, more demand, more money, more smart people.

There is plenty of room for growth. There should be a global tax so that we can help the many underdeveloped nations of the world to grow and become self sustaining as many western nations (highly populated) are. 20 BILLION should be our goal by the end of the century.

The only thing that kills us on mass prematurity is poverty. Wealth is made by people, nothing else. Even China realizes that to better the lives of their people requires continued growth and the only way to do this is via population growth.

 

[Scaramouche]

We live in finite space with finite resources, for the moment at least.

 

[Baron Max]

Population growth is good. More workers, more demand, more money, more smart people.

The first does not necessarily lead to the latter. In fact, it could be just the opposite ...less workers (people are lazy), less deman(they don't work, so they don't have money, thus there's no demand), less money(they don't work), less smart people (they're lazy, they don't learn).

It seems so logical and rational to me ....population simply can't keep growing. How is that not logical and rational to others? If population keeps growing, how is it that they'll not cover the Earth with their feet? ...crowded shoulder-to-shoulder with no room to move. And how can that be good?

Baron Max

 

[Blindman]

.less workers (people are lazy), less deman(they don't work, so they don't have money, thus there's no demand),

People need money they will work, People want homes and food they create demand.

less money(they don't work)

Only very small minority of people don't want to work. They are considered mentaly ill and progressive societies look after them with social security programs.

less smart people (they're lazy, they don't learn).

IQ is not a factor contributed to by education. Give me 10000 humans and Ill show you two geniuses, give me a billion and ill show you many many more.

If population keeps growing, how is it that they'll not cover the Earth with their feet?

what 10 trillion imagine the power we would have then to develop space...

 

[Baron Max]

People need money they will work, People want homes and food they create demand.

So there's no such thing as homeless and/or unemployed people? There's no such thing as gov or charity handouts?

Only very small minority of people don't want to work.

That depends on what they can get for free ...by NOT working. If the liberals have their way, and the wealth is equally distributed, why should anyone work if they get the same money by NOT working?

... what 10 trillion imagine the power we would have then to develop space...

Where do you put 'em all? How do you feed 'em? What do you feed 'em? Who does the farming and harvesting and distribution? How much money to they get for doing that hard work? ..while trillions of "smart people" are "imagining" things?

Baron Max

 

[Blindman]

So there's no such thing as homeless and/or unemployed people? There's no such thing as gov or charity handouts?

That depends on what they can get for free ...by NOT working. If the liberals have their way, and the wealth is equally distributed, why should anyone work if they get the same money by NOT working?

Well no one gets anything if we all slack off. The power of hunger motivates our society. Land is not and issue we have plenty and via modern building we can turn 1 hectare into a hundred in less then a year by building up.

The real limiting factor on human growth is power (electrical) and that is a resource far from exhaustion.

 

[Baron Max]

Well no one gets anything if we all slack off. The power of hunger motivates our society. Land is not and issue we have plenty and via modern building we can turn 1 hectare into a hundred in less then a year by building up.

The real limiting factor on human growth is power (electrical) and that is a resource far from exhaustion.

You, sir, are being completely illogical and irrational and, if I might add, completely unscientific.

Baron Max

 

[Blindman]

You, sir, are being completely illogical and irrational and, if I might add, completely unscientific.

Why because i don't agree with you. What part is illogical or even irrational. Being a scientist I am dismayed at being called unscientific.

Come now i accept peer review as long as it is associated with provable data.

There are enough uranium deposits to power humanity for at least 200 years

 

[Baron Max]

Why because i don't agree with you?

Nope, I've now changed my mind and think you're right. Humans should just keep on reproducing until they cover the Earth. When we run out of room, we can just fly off to another planet and do it all over again on that planet. then when that planet is full of humans, we can just fly off to another planet and do it all over again.

Blindman, you're a genius! Thank you for opening my eyes to the wonders and beauty and powers of the human race. We can just ignore the crime, terrorism, wars, conflicts, racism, genocides, natural disasters, disease, starvation, hatred, bigotry, murder, robbery,........

Baron Max

 

[Blindman]

Blindman, you're a genius! Thank you for opening my eyes to the wonders and beauty and powers of the human race. We can just ignore the crime, terrorism, wars, conflicts, racism, genocides, natural disasters, disease, starvation, hatred, bigotry, murder, robbery,........

We are but human. Love, laughter, family, friends, creativity, sex, awe and wonderment.

Nope, I've now changed my mind and think you're right. Humans should just keep on reproducing until they cover the Earth. When we run out of room, we can just fly off to another planet and do it all over again on that planet. then when that planet is full of humans, we can just fly off to another planet and do it all over again.

What??? we should just give up now, welcome old age and accept humanities death. No way dude, you cant stop us. We will breed and breed and fight till we can fight no more. There are thousands if not hundreds of thousands of years left in man

 

[Baron Max]

We are but human.

And humans are just another animal in a long, long string of animals that evolved from a long, long string of other animals. Or don't you believe in evolution?

What's so special about humans? I'll bet the apes sat around discussing what made the apes such wonderous animals .....until man came along and began to kill all of the apes!

Humans are just the latest in a long string of animals. Nothing more, nothing less. Don't worship them, Blindman, they are worthy of that worship. Quite the contrary, in fact.

Baron Max