Love

[Xev]

Nelson:

I was talking about your first post...

"I love few, hate few, and despise many. The only principle I try to abide by when it comes to the many is never to violate their freedom unless they try to violate mine."

The undeserving are in the many.

No. Love is unconditional.

Real love isn't.

If somebody hurst you you mustn't hurt back.

No, you must not hurt. You must destroy their ability to hurt again, or you must accept them as a worthy enemy. Or both.

"WANT". What is tha? Free will? Conditions? Yes.

*Sniffles*

No, it's just something I'd like.

That's the same. You don't need to do that.

No it's not. I haven't slept in 25 hours. I'm not getting any sexual kick out of it, I just test myself.

If you do, then you won't hurt anyone.

Nonsense, I love myself, thus I don't let the undeserving prey upon me.

Nelson, c'mon, I'm teasin' you.

Happy New Year.

 

[TruthSeeker]

Xev,

The undeserving are in the many.

No. WHta exactly I'm saying here is that everyone deserves Love.

Real love isn't.

Yes, it is. Love doesn't judge. Love is above judgement. Love is unconditional.

No, you must not hurt. You must destroy their ability to hurt again, or you must accept them as a worthy enemy. Or both.

That's even worse. If someone hates you and you hate them, are you really better than them? No... you are no diferrent than them.

No, it's just something I'd like.

"I'd like" is an expression of will...

No it's not. I haven't slept in 25 hours. I'm not getting any sexual kick out of it, I just test myself.

It is not good for your health; therefore, it is not good for you, you are hurting yourself.

Nonsense, I love myself, thus I don't let the undeserving prey upon me.

You don't understand Love...

Nelson, c'mon, I'm teasin' you.

As long as you don't confuse other people... that is alright...

Happy New Year

 

[wet1]

And what? This girl hurt me for more than a whole year. She pretty much tortured me. She didn't know what she was doing. Do I hate her? NO!! I Love her! Why? Because she didn't have the intention to hurt me! And even if she had, I would still Love her because I would have almost pity of her unexperience! Hurt doesn't destroy true Love. The Love that is unconditional and impartial. I'm impressed that you would not remember those two characteristics of true Love...

So you are saying that you have all the experience to give and receive true, unconditional love an the rest of us, like that girl, don't. Pretty arrogant. Wait till you fall hard. I did not forget one characteristic of true love. Besides, hurt belongs to life. It gives experience in how to deal with all who surround us. It is a survival technique, so to say. To keep you standing and learn from it.

I'm not saying there is no hurt. People will eventually hurt you willingly or not. It is how you receive that and how you react that will make the difference. It is up to you to make the difference.

I did not say I was hurt, now did I? I can have a lot, and have had a lot. I think I make enough difference in the lives of enough people.

True Love is impersonal. It doesn't matter one's personality. My personality can be completly different then yours, but if I have unconditional, impartial and impersonal Love, how can't I Love you! It is true that there will always be people that we can relate better then others, but that doesn't mean that we are not able to Love those that are too different and too distant to us.

You missed the point completely here. I am not talking about loving people who are distant from me. And I am not saying we are not able to love peoples who are very different than us, or I, whatever you please.

True Love is not necessarily physical. Besides that, when you think about it, what is better: a world with wars or a peaceful world. In any way it will be boring. There will always be a lot to be done. We can challenge ourselves and set goals like travel to other planets or whatever. Pepper always add flavour on food, but it's not exactly healthy...

Physical love with everybody??? I am baffled! A peaceful world is only possible in your imagination. It is HUMAN NATURE to make war. It has been so since the beginning of history. Look at the holy wars. Set goals like travel to other planets? What about all the peoples on Earth who are dying from hunger or diseases for which there is still no cure? Shouldn't we not take care of that first before we try to conquer other planets. Really TruthSeeker, where is your love for the peoples from Earth. Typical capitalistic behaviour you display here. All talk and no action.

I general, you changed. I think you should go back to your country, cause the USA agenda and ideal is penetrating on your mind...

Dream on! The US agenda has nothing to do with it. Who are you to tell me to go back to my home country? Again, arrogant.

Why people suck? Because they are all different than you? If that's the reason, then you suck for other people. Do you like that? I hope not. If everyone would be equal, then it would suck, cause it would be pretty boring to watch everyone being the same. That's pretty much the american mentality, everyone looking the same. With no offense, that's pretty childish...

No, again you missed the point. It is nothing personal. It is just a general observation. Please, do not think you know what I think or for what reason I wrote what I wrote. You make assumptions in which you are not even close. Quit that. As a matter of fact I like it very much that people are different. Where the hell did you get the idea that it is my wish to see all people being the same. Again, don't assume too much.

If that's not the reason, why people "suck"?

Humans are always after number one in the first place and that is they themselves. Are you now going to tell me that you only live to please others? And do only what is the wish from others without ever thinking what it is you yourself want? Without reservation you always act in the benefit of others? Why do I find this hard to believe?

You can deny to yourself that you still didn't reach true Love or you can say: "I'm not there yet, but I will do my best to evolute and be there someday." It's much better to be true to yourself. You must Love yourself too. No matter how many mistakes you made in the past (unconditionally), no matter what. You must be honest to yourself or you will never reach true Love neither true Joy.

Now, where did you get the impression that I do not love myself? You make it all personal TruthSeeker which it was not to begin with. It is all a very smooth talk you display, I am curious as to know if you really achieve all you are talking. Unconditionally.

True Love IS possible. It is our nature to Love. However, with all those toys that we have, we pretty much forgot who we truly are...

It is our nature to love??? My god, TruthSeeker! Will you open your eyes and look at the peoples of Earth please? It is human nature to fight and make wars. Humans are animals and in that light no other than animals. You've got to fight for your right. ( And party... )

That is NOT human nature. Read this:
"The Mastery of Love"
by Don Miguel Ruiz

No thank you. I've read enough of that. But thanks for the offer.

Again, not our nature.

Yep, again, it IS our nature.

I don't. But as I talk here, I start finding out more and more characteristics of true Love and by becoming more aware, I walk towards it.

Exactly! As you talk here! What about actually do what you are talking. Walk the talk. Good luck. May you achieve all you wish in life.

 

[TruthSeeker]

Banshee,

So you are saying that you have all the experience to give and receive true, unconditional love an the rest of us, like that girl, don't. Pretty arrogant. Wait till you fall hard. I did not forget one characteristic of true love. Besides, hurt belongs to life. It gives experience in how to deal with all who surround us. It is a survival technique, so to say. To keep you standing and learn from it.

No, I'm saying that you are trying to understand Love with your mind. It is not much different then the "love" you see on TV. Besides that, she has a very pretty Love in her heart. She just needs more contact with her heart, that's all. She doesn't even know she hurt me and I don't blame her, I didn't know I was hurting her either. I still have long ways to go, but I look for Love in my heart, not in my mind. In this way I don't go through wrong ways.

Hurt doesn't need to blong to life. If everyone would have perfect Love, hurt wouldn't exist, cause anyone would need to learn anything through hurt at all. We don't need to experience hurt to be wise.

You missed the point completely here. I am not talking about loving people who are distant from me. And I am not saying we are not able to love peoples who are very different than us, or I, whatever you please.

Ok... then what you were talking about?

Physical love with everybody??? I am baffled! A peaceful world is only possible in your imagination. It is HUMAN NATURE to make war. It has been so since the beginning of history. Look at the holy wars. Set goals like travel to other planets? What about all the peoples on Earth who are dying from hunger or diseases for which there is still no cure? Shouldn't we not take care of that first before we try to conquer other planets. Really TruthSeeker, where is your love for the peoples from Earth. Typical capitalistic behaviour you display here. All talk and no action.

Oh my! Now, you completly misunderstood me here...
I said:

True Love is not necessarily physical.

So, no "physical love with everybody"...

Besides that, it is not human nature to make war. It became a part of our nature bacause of our own hurts.

And besides that I set those goals [AFTER taking care of ourselves. And I was extremely clear on that, what surprises me a lot...

The last thing I am is a capitalist...

Dream on! The US agenda has nothing to do with it. Who are you to tell me to go back to my home country? Again, arrogant.

Your ideals are very alike...

No, again you missed the point. It is nothing personal. It is just a general observation. Please, do not think you know what I think or for what reason I wrote what I wrote. You make assumptions in which you are not even close. Quit that. As a matter of fact I like it very much that people are different. Where the hell did you get the idea that it is my wish to see all people being the same. Again, don't assume too much.

No. You assumed a lot of things about me. That I'm arrogant to begin with... that I'm capitalist. That I don't care about the people of this planet. All assumptions based on your perception of reality. I made myself clear that I wasn't sure about what you said and I even asked:

If that's not the reason, why people "suck"?

Humans are always after number one in the first place and that is they themselves. Are you now going to tell me that you only live to please others? And do only what is the wish from others without ever thinking what it is you yourself want? Without reservation you always act in the benefit of others? Why do I find this hard to believe?

No I don't. But I want to get to this point. That makes a big difference.

Now, where did you get the impression that I do not love myself? You make it all personal TruthSeeker which it was not to begin with. It is all a very smooth talk you display, I am curious as to know if you really achieve all you are talking. Unconditionally.

I was being general. I wasn't talking about you, I was talking about a "you". Unfortunatly, language sucks. It is so easy to misunderstand people. I don't blame you... I myself misunderstood you a couple of times too. But I tried to make clear that I wasn't sure about what you were talking about.

It is our nature to love??? My god, TruthSeeker! Will you open your eyes and look at the peoples of Earth please? It is human nature to fight and make wars. Humans are animals and in that light no other than animals. You've got to fight for your right. ( And party... )

I live by faith, not by sight. This world is the product of fear, illusions and hurt. I believe that everyone does love, mainly in the childhood. However, as they grow up, they start to become like evryone in the planet. Do babies shot each other? Do they hate? I don't think so. You can see our TRUE nature in a baby. After that, you see only the product of this world's illusions.

I would advise you to read the thread about Anarchism in the forums "World Events and Politics"...

No thank you. I've read enough of that. But thanks for the offer.

If you read it, how come you don't see that it is not human nature to make war and kill?

Yep, again, it IS our nature.

Read above.

Exactly! As you talk here! What about actually do what you are talking. Walk the talk. Good luck. May you achieve all you wish in life.

I'm already doing. I'm trying to encourage people to Love...

Happy New Year

 

[wet1]

No, I'm saying that you are trying to understand Love with your mind. It is not much different then the "love" you see on TV.

Oh, is that so? I am trying to understand love with my mind? You make assumptions again which are not true! Love on TV? What has television "love" to do with the real world?

Hurt doesn't need to blong to life. If everyone would have perfect Love, hurt wouldn't exist, cause anyone would need to learn anything through hurt at all. We don't need to experience hurt to be wise.

That is just it. Not everyone has true love. Hurt does excist and it always has. Nothing but plain reality. And yes, we need to experience hurt to get wise.

Your ideals are very alike...

Again, an assumption. You don't know nothing about me and/or my ideals. Please, stop making comparisons about me and the US government.

I live by faith, not by sight. This world is the product of fear, illusions and hurt. I believe that everyone does love, mainly in the childhood. However, as they grow up, they start to become like evryone in the planet. Do babies shot each other? Do they hate? I don't think so. You can see our TRUE nature in a baby. After that, you see only the product of this world's illusions.

I was not talking sight as in seeing only with your eyes TruthSeeker. I meant see as with your heart and perception. Of course everybody does love. The statement from the threadstarter was to love EVERYBODY TRUELY, on this Earth. Not everybody is able to love everybody else, truely. Is what I mean. You say it yourself: "As humans grow up, they start to become like everyone on the planet."

If you read it, how come you don't see that it is not human nature to make war and kill?

Living between humans for instance? Having experienced all this first hand? It is very hard to achieve to have love for everybody in this world. There are only a few who actually accomplish this. I have a deep respect for those who do. The thread was about truely love everybody by everybody. That, is not possible. In that perspective, it is human nature to make war and kill. Unfortunately.

I'm already doing. I'm trying to encourage people to Love...

Good for you. May you be all you are wishing to be. Keep on going. Keep up the good Spirits.


Happy New Year!

 

[TruthSeeker]

Banshee,

Oh, is that so? I am trying to understand love with my mind? You make assumptions again which are not true! Love on TV? What has television "love" to do with the real world?

If you look to the world and judge Love in that way, then you are using your mind to judge Love. If you see Love with your heart, then you will even ignore this world's conception of love. But the fact is that you are actually subjecting love to the world. You also seem to have the idea of subject and object of love, which is untrue to Love.

That is just it. Not everyone has true love. Hurt does excist and it always has. Nothing but plain reality. And yes, we need to experience hurt to get wise.

ANYONE has true Love. That's exactly the problem. Of course, when we get to Love, then we will become perfect. It's not easy to get to perfection. Hurt does exist, but it doesn't need to, in a world where everyone Love one another.

We don't need to experience hurt to be wise. We need to experience hurt to attain knowledge, but we don't need to experience it to attain wisdom. This is easy to see with an example.

knowledge:
Imagine that you put your hand in the fire. You experience the hurt and now you know that it hurts, so you learn by experience and don't do it again.

Wisdom:
You know in your heart that if you put your hand in the fire you will get hurt. You don't need to experience it to learn, you know it naturally.

Again, an assumption. You don't know nothing about me and/or my ideals. Please, stop making comparisons about me and the US government.

Ok... but please have a carefull look in your definitions of Love and Wisdom.

I was not talking sight as in seeing only with your eyes TruthSeeker. I meant see as with your heart and perception. Of course everybody does love. The statement from the threadstarter was to love EVERYBODY TRUELY, on this Earth. Not everybody is able to love everybody else, truely. Is what I mean. You say it yourself: "As humans grow up, they start to become like everyone on the planet."

You said:

Will you open your eyes and look at the peoples of Earth please?

This is walk in sight. Walk in faith is to look into your heart and see that people are in war because they don't understand each other. Walk in faith is to use your heart to look to the world. It is not to look to things and use your own understanding and your own perception but be completly impartial and not use your mind to judge this world. Your mind is based in your OWN definitions, perceptions and past experiences. That's why everyone has a distorted perception of the Truth. This distorted perception I call reality. There are many realities and they differ from person to person, but there is only one Truth. Look into your heart, and you will simply know it, you won't need to experience neither to judge anything at all.

Love is impersonal. There is actually no subject and object of Love. It doesn't happen from person to person. It just is. You Love in your heart, simply Love. When you project the Love that comes from your own heart, then you are "loving people". This is possible, cause this kind of Love that is impersonal "don't see face neither heart" as we, brazilians, say...

Living between humans for instance? Having experienced all this first hand? It is very hard to achieve to have love for everybody in this world. There are only a few who actually accomplish this. I have a deep respect for those who do. The thread was about truely love everybody by everybody. That, is not possible. In that perspective, it is human nature to make war and kill. Unfortunately.

Read my Anarchist thread. You will see there that if we educate our children to Love, and if we give them true Love, they will give true Love away. We can just give what we have. If we have hurt, we will give hurt. If we have fear, we will give fear. If we have Love, we will give Love. The secret is to work in the next generation, to give them Love, so that they can give away Love. We first need to change ourselves, then we can help to change this world.

Good for you. May you be all you are wishing to be. Keep on going. Keep up the good Spirits.

 

[(Q)]

Truthseeker

You know in your heart that if you put your hand in the fire you will get hurt. You don't need to experience it to learn, you know it naturally.

Nonsense. Explain that to the parents of children who have big hearts and have burned themselves on stoves, or drowned in swimming pools, or hit by cars...

 

[TruthSeeker]

(Q),

Nonsense. Explain that to the parents of children who have big hearts and have burned themselves on stoves, or drowned in swimming pools, or hit by cars...

It takes a great awareness to be able to use your heart. It is not everyone that is sensitive enough with their hearts to use them. Besides that, the heart you are talking about is not the same I'm talking about. They are two different hearts, but they are both right.

 

[(Q)]

Truthseeker

It takes a great awareness to be able to use your heart.

More nonsense. Awareness is a function of the mind and not the heart. And although the heart is considered the locus of feelings and intuition as a metaphor, its prime function is to pump blood.

It is not everyone that is sensitive enough with their hearts to use them

And of course, you are.

 

[Xev]

Nelson:

No. WHta exactly I'm saying here is that everyone deserves Love.

Bull. I love as intensely as I hate, and I don't dilute either my love or my hate by feeling it for everyone.

Most people are mindless slaves who want what they've been trained to want and believe what they've been trained to believe. They do not provoke either love or hate in me - save an occasional affection or sense of nausea, depending on my mood.

Some deserve love. Some deserve hate. I respect the people who fall in both these categories.

Yes, it is. Love doesn't judge. Love is above judgement. Love is unconditional.

What you're describing does not exist.

That's even worse. If someone hates you and you hate them, are you really better than them?

Sometimes you are. Generally, I don't hate my inferiours. However, your definition of "better" is likely not the same as mine.

I respect most anyone who is truely aware of the nature of the world around them. I respect anyone who is able to attract and hold power.

No... you are no diferrent than them.

False.

"I'd like" is an expression of will...

No, simply a request.

GAH! Nelson, for the love of fuck, I'm joking.

It is not good for your health; therefore, it is not good for you, you are hurting yourself.

Blah, I'm too bloody hungover to explain this right, so I'll let Nietzsche do it for me:

"What is good? -- All that heightens the feeling of power, the will to power, power itself in man."

Why is this relevent?

"I assess the power of a will by how much resistance, pain, torture it endures and knows how to turn to its advantage."

You don't understand Love...

No, I simply don't agree with your theory.

As long as you don't confuse other people... that is alright...

Nelson luv, I EXIST to confuse people.

 

[Zero]

*dressed up as witch doctor*
Hmm...Xevvie is suffering from some deep internal lack of self esteem...she is beating herself up...must find the natural forces and demons at work...

 

[TruthSeeker]

(Q),

More nonsense. Awareness is a function of the mind and not the heart. And although the heart is considered the locus of feelings and intuition as a metaphor, its prime function is to pump blood.

To be aware of your heart is basically to have conscience of it, to be able to use it consciently. Although it is conscient, it doesn't mean that you have to really think about it, since it becomes natural. For example, when you have to lift your hand, you do it automatically, you don't need to think about it, you don't need to say "now I'll lift my hand"...

And of course, you are.

Who said that? I said I have conscience of if, not that I know how to use it. If I knew how to use it, I would never make a single mistake.


Xev,

Some deserve love. Some deserve hate. I respect the people who fall in both these categories.

You have no idea what is Love, do you?

What you're describing does not exist.

It does. The Love that simply IS is the Love I'm talking about.This Love knows no subject or object. It simply is. You don't Love something, or someone. You simply have Love coming through your heart and this Love is felt by other people around you. This Love doesn't judge, because it knows the Truth, it IS the Truth. Love sees no color. Love sees no ugliness. Love is pure.

Sometimes you are. Generally, I don't hate my inferiours. However, your definition of "better" is likely not the same as mine.

If you hate someone because they hate, how different you are from them??
My definition of "better" is exactly when you conscider yourself superior in relation to others. This kind of comparison is pretty much oposite of Love.

I respect most anyone who is truely aware of the nature of the world around them. I respect anyone who is able to attract and hold power.

I respect everyone.
I admire those who can overcome themselves.
I admire even more those who can keep their faith in themselves and in their hearts despite everyone around them bringing them down. Those are true strenghts.

False.

If you hate someone and hurt someone because this person hates you and hurt you, how can you be different then this person? You are doing exactly the same thing!!!:bugeye:

No, simply a request.

A request is an expression of will. You say "I'd like" because you want it. If you said "I'd not like" then you wouldn't want it. In either way, it is an expression of will.

GAH! Nelson, for the love of fuck, I'm joking.

If you keep joking I won't take you seriously anymore.

Blah, I'm too bloody hungover to explain this right, so I'll let Nietzsche do it for me:

Nietzsche says that evil is good. I don't believe in anything this guy says. Better do better than that...

No, I simply don't agree with your theory.

You have no idea what I'm talking about, do you?

Nelson luv, I EXIST to confuse people.

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