Fear God? Which God?.....

davewhite04

davewhite04

Valued Senior Member
Okay, I'm not stretching the catchment area of how many God/god(s) you should fear, if they were all real we wouldn't be able to move. Just the Jewish/Christian God of the old testament, sometimes referred to as Yahweh.

I'm going down the Gnostic rabbit hole first just a little. They believe in a demiurge who is basically the God of the old testament, The G-d to Jews and Father to Christians. This demiurge otherwise known as Yahweh, a potentially warrior(maybe fire too) god from the Sumerian pantheon. No matter which way you slice it he is bad news according to the gnostics. Some call him a fool, others think he knows exactly what he's doing. Keeping us locked down on this planet, reincarnation etc. that's a bit of their blurb and a slice of mine.

Would you fear this God if he had the power to do anything he liked to you without restrain if he homed in on you? This is the God from the garden, this God/Demiurge created everything we see, all powerful. Exactly how the bible describes him, a psychopath, and remember all powerful. Maybe that's why we needed Jesus because the demiurge would of blew up the planet by now!

Not everything we don't see like the divine spark in all life that is connected to the Holy God, or source. This God is Love, and I believe it is the one Paul talked about.

The Sumerians gods/beings, okay gods, Enki and Enhil were talking in private and when a Holy Angel from the Holy God appeared they knew their place in the grand scheme of things.

The other God, Jesus(no talk of divinity claim, human existance etc. let's assume for point of staying on topic)

What did he do exactly? Think about it... you're in a religion forum so maybe you've read a bit about Jesus? He did everything and nothing.

Do/Would you fear Jesus if you knew he existed? Why?
Would you fear Yahweh if you knew he existed? Why?
Would you fear the Holy God if it existed? Why?

EDIT: Just to say, I expect this to go slightly off topic.
 
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davewhite04 said:
Do/Would you fear Jesus if you knew he existed? Why?
Would you fear Yahweh if you knew he existed? Why?
Would you fear the Holy God if it existed? Why?
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No, no and no. If God is about love and peace, then there is no reason to fear God. That's why it's clear the God of the old and new testament are not real.
 
(Q) said:
No, no and no. If God is about love and peace, then there is no reason to fear God. That's why it's clear the God of the old and new testament are not real.
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For all intents and purposes, the demiurge is God. Would you fear him?
 
davewhite04 said:
For all intents and purposes, the demiurge is God. Would you fear him?
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Never. With good reason. God would favor courage over cowardice and might even respect me a little if I showed no fear. If He was a sadistic God, He would want me to fear Him.
 
(Q) said:
Never. With good reason. God would favor courage over cowardice and might even respect me a little if I showed no fear. If He was a sadistic God, He would want me to fear Him.
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I hear what you say. Yahweh doesn't mind cowards or heros, everyone is the same to him. He doesn't mind if you fear him or not. He doesn't really care. But he is all powerful and a psycho.

I won't throw bible verses around liberally, but this one is good.

Proverbs 1:7
 
davewhite04 said:
I hear what you say. Yahweh doesn't mind cowards or heros, everyone is the same to him. He doesn't mind if you fear him or not. He doesn't really care. But he is all powerful and a psycho.

I won't throw bible verses around liberally, but this one is good.

Proverbs 1:7
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"The fear of the Lord is the beginning of knowledge, but fools despise wisdom and instruction".

Sorry Dave, but fear is not the beginning of knowledge, that is totally wrong. Why should we fear wisdom and instruction, makes no sense.
 
(Q) said:
"The fear of the Lord is the beginning of knowledge, but fools despise wisdom and instruction".

Sorry Dave, but fear is not the beginning of knowledge, that is totally wrong. Why should we fear wisdom and instruction, makes no sense.
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No, wisdom and instruction is good, fearing God(Yahweh) will get you this. You won't just get wisdom in the understanding from the bible, from everything, nature, space/time, evolution, design etc. and maybe you'll view the world through a different lense. But, if you haven't made it past "Did Jesus exist", I'm afraid I'm not going back to that discussion.
 
I would hope not.

Fear would mean I think I'm doing something wrong. That is my own conscience, nothing to do with God's wrath.

Let me 'splain.

Say my best friend Bob - whom I trust - comes to me one day and says "I just talked to God and he says for sure he is on his way."

So I start second-guessing whether I'm going to get punished when God gets here, and I review my morals, ethics and actions, wondering of they need improvement.

Well, here's the thing: I don't (or shouldn't) actually need the threat of the former in order to enact the latter.

Every day I ask myself if my morals, ethics and actions are appropriate to who I want to be.

Whether or not God exists - and whether or not he's 'on his way' - does not (should not) change the actions I know I need to be doing myself anyway.
 
davewhite04 said:
No, wisdom and instruction is good, fearing God(Yahweh) will get you this.
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And yet, I gain a great deal of wisdom and instruction without Yahweh. If you mean, should I read the Bible to get my instruction and wisdom, then that too would be useless as there are so many errors. Unless you can get Yahweh to sit down and provide me some of that good ole instruction and wisdom, He'll know where to find me. Until then, I have many other sources for that sort of thing
davewhite04 said:
You won't just get wisdom in the understanding from the bible, from everything, nature, space/time, evolution, design etc. and maybe you'll view the world through a different lense. But, if you haven't made it past "Did Jesus exist", I'm afraid I'm not going back to that discussion.
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That's fine, you believe Jesus exists and I don't. Other than that, we are both equal in our capacity to get wisdom and instruction.
 
(Q) said:
And yet, I gain a great deal of wisdom and instruction without Yahweh. If you mean, should I read the Bible to get my instruction and wisdom, then that too would be useless as there are so many errors. Unless you can get Yahweh to sit down and provide me some of that good ole instruction and wisdom, He'll know where to find me. Until then, I have many other sources for that sort of thing
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Slow down. Fear in a God that burst into life by Himself and He created us for a science experiment and can squash you, your family your anscestors out of existence. If He existed in your mind and you feared that fictional character you love so much. Not surprised you would find Him detestable, but you aren't Him, He is a fully grown God, who worked His way up the ranks and didn't change a bit.

(Q) said:
Other than that, we are both equal in our capacity to get wisdom and instruction.
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I beg to differ. No argument wanted, just my subjective view. You probably think the opposite! Am I reading your mind?
 
(Q) said:
And yet, I gain a great deal of wisdom and instruction without Yahweh. If you mean, should I read the Bible to get my instruction and wisdom, then that too would be useless as there are so many errors. Unless you can get Yahweh to sit down and provide me some of that good ole instruction and wisdom, He'll know where to find me. Until then, I have many other sources for that sort of thing

That's fine, you believe Jesus exists and I don't. Other than that, we are both equal in our capacity to get wisdom and instruction.
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Бог везде, Мартин. Найди себя.
 
davewhite04 said:
Slow down. Fear in a God that burst into life by Himself and He created us for a science experiment and can squash you, your family your anscestors out of existence.
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Yes, actually there is a queue forming outside my door of the hundreds of gods throughout history who want to squash me because I don't believe in them. What was the name again? Yahweh? Ok, that's a the back of the line just in front of Zeus.
davewhite04 said:
If He existed in your mind and you feared that fictional character you love so much. Not surprised you would find Him detestable, but you aren't Him, He is a fully grown God, who worked His way up the ranks and didn't change a bit.
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Yet, there are gods that were around long before Yahweh, long forgotten, just like Yahweh, Thor, Zeus.

Wait a minute, based on the current MCU, maybe Yahweh could be a Hollywood superhero.
davewhite04 said:
I beg to differ. No argument wanted, just my subjective view. You probably think the opposite! Am I reading your mind?
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Not much to differ, Dave. If you can show me what information and wisdom you have access to that I don't, let me know.
 
ольга said:
God is everywhere, Martin. Find yourself.
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As usual, you make no sense whatsoever. What does finding myself have to do with God being everywhere?

Garden fairies are everywhere, Olga. Find your Adderall.
 
(Q) said:
As usual, you make no sense whatsoever. What does finding myself have to do with God being everywhere?

Garden fairies are everywhere, Olga. Find your Adderall.
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I went to a Christian hospital group...

The leader who was passionate but nearly as mad as me! He was waving his hands above his head and around saying Jesus something... I brought a kid up from the ward with me and he was watching, I had to but in, "here, what if Jesus is IN us all and everytime you look into someones eyes you are looking at Jesus" aren't EVERYONE a reflection of God." No joy, he was in a trance like state, mad if you ask me.
 
(Q) said:
As usual, you make no sense whatsoever. What does finding myself have to do with God being everywhere?

Garden fairies are everywhere, Olga. Find your Adderall.
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Потому что Бог ни "где то там", Он в тебе. Ты - Бог, Мартин. "Вы - Боги, и сыновья Вышняго есть".
 
davewhite04 said:
Psalm 82:6

sons of the most High(God). gods in their own right, we are immortal and love can move mountains. Q is not God, he doesn't pretend to be, in fact he doesn't believe in God.
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Дэйв, он просто неправильно представляет себе Бога. Он отделяет Бога от Божьего творения. Здесь находится логическая ошибка. Из чего Бог создал Мартина и остальные свои творения в этом случае? У Мартина получается Бог отдельно, Творение отдельно. И где в этом случае Абсолют? У Мартина вообще проблемы с логикой и анализом. Я это не в осуждение ему говорю, просто констатирую как факт.
 
ольга said:
Дэйв, он просто неправильно представляет себе Бога. Он отделяет Бога от Божьего творения. Здесь находится логическая ошибка. Из чего Бог создал Мартина и остальные свои творения в этом случае? У Мартина получается Бог отдельно, Творение отдельно. И где в этом случае Абсолют? У Мартина вообще проблемы с логикой и анализом. Я это не в осуждение ему говорю, просто констатирую как факт.
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I don't know you. Let me clear this up and wait for your next response.

Can you show everyone at sciforums a bit of respect by translating your post before posting it, you've got anyone who is interested translating your post, you could do it once. No love.

I'm glad I'm not Q having to pick my way through your nonsense. What is your inspiration for whatever belief you've got?
 
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