Does God care about atheists

Seem you are mistaken it is you who bring no facts to the table but we already know that and rather than work with facts you must allude to me somehow boasting... It is hard to keep up with your made up stories.

Stating you only deal with facts, while claiming the soul is a made up concept, before admitting you have not come across this subject matte, kind of defines your whole input in this discussion.

Why wont you answer my initial questions

I explained that your initial question, regarding Christianity, and how they view the soul, had nothing to do with basically understanding what the soul is.

Try a search.. Enter history of the soul.

I have done, but all that comes up are books for sale, on the subject matter.
Do you have a link?

It may be fact you do such but few do.

So how do you refer to your arms, legs, hair, and so on? Do say "my arm", "my beard", etc?
Or don't you?

Yes I got stuck with the one body and wouldnt you know it... No soul.

Notice you said "I", got stuck, with a body. You couldnt escape the difference even if you wanted to. Let me know when you come to your senses.

Just as easy as you take an opposite positition. Believe what you will but without more than belief in body ownership you really have nothing.

Alex. Really?
So it's going g to be like that hey!

This is why the subject of atheism, is so interesting. You literally reach a blockade, then the real motive comes out.

Who does? Not me I dont get a kick out anything along lines you suggest...

I didn't say anything about getting a kick out of it. Is that a requirement for you?

Because they are human living in a society somewhat different to the animal world.

Are humans special, Alex?
If yes, why?

I tend to assume something is made up when folk fail to offer proof and avoid matters that call for facts.

So lack of proof, and facts (as you see them), means something is made up?

Atheism the only place for thinking people determined to reject ancient superstition to be.

Really?

Jan.
 
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Common sense? :? Doesn't seem like you can exactly put your finger on it.

Really? So soon into the discussion, you're already making judgements.

Sounds like when you say God "is" you could just as easily say you feel God.

It "Sounds like"?
You got that "sound" from me saying common sense is one way to relate to God? Are you clairaudient?

This may sound a bit coarse, but whatever floats your boat.

Okay.
Good talk.

Jan.
 
You got that "sound" from me saying common sense is one way to relate to God? Are you clairaudient?
Whoa! Are we at the precipice of a semantic conundrum?

Is it safe to ponder that since you say atheists are without God, hence, they are also without common sense?
 
Whoa! Are we at the precipice of a semantic conundrum?

Is it safe to ponder that since you say atheists are without God, hence, they are also without common sense?

I would have thought that the very phrase ''common sense'', gives no reason to assume anything other than what it actually says. So ponder if you must, but it was no way inspired by what was written by me.

Why have you focused on this one, obvious point?
Why not carry on, see where it leads.

jan.
 
Stating you only deal with facts, while claiming the soul is a made up concept, before admitting you have not come across this subject matte, kind of defines your whole input in this discussion.
I see what you are driving at but I now have more facts than you have it seems given as you later say you havent got anywhere with a search.

So now that I know more I say the soul is a made up concept and no evidence exists to suggest the soul is anything more than fairy tale stuff.

Various humans have referred to the soul from as far back as ancient Eygpt but a doctor has yet to observe one and a scientist has yet to establish the notion is anything more than mythology.

Unfortunately the way folk talk to themselves and about themselves offers no proof other than those who talk about ownership of their body have a peculiar approach motivated by a religious belief.

And as the soul does not exist I guess that rips the gutz out of the rest of the supporting fairy tale.

I explained that your initial question, regarding Christianity, and how they view the soul, had nothing to do with basically understanding what the soul is.

I refer to my questions earlier seeking comment upon atributes of the soul.

But having read up on the concept of the soul it is interesting my sort of questions are never asked or addressed as the soul is left as a wishy washy ghost like make it up how you like entity that one fits into whatever religion you are aflicted with...yet I ask simple yet seemingly unanswerable questions like what does a soul look like, how do they move around, where do they hang out and how many are in existence.

And of course as these questions are of a practical nature they will have no answers...
Do you have a link?

Try wiki if you cant find anything it will be proof the subject is so trivial that it receives no mention.

Try Jan I dont believe you cant find something on wiki...but then again wiki must be rather confrontational for you as it deals in fact and observations of custom, culture and religion from an observational view and that will never be kind to an individual belief.
So how do you refer to your arms, legs, hair, and so on? Do say "my arm", "my beard", etc?
Or don't you?

I can agree about my self talk but that does not mean you have established a soul.

What I gather is you think the voice in your head is your soul.

Fine if that is what you think but a study of the science may give you an understanding of our brain function that leaves no reasonable prospect available to suggest anything like a soul exists other than as a religious concept.

Notice you said "I", got stuck, with a body. You couldnt escape the difference even if you wanted to.

I see now that you think you are offering evidence for the soul. OK.

I get what you suggest I think but I reject your approach as it makes no sense unless you are religious and as I am not say your approach makes no sense to me...at all.

So it's going g to be like that hey!

Are you saying you find entertaining the fact another can hold a different opinion is somehow wrong.

This is why the subject of atheism, is so interesting. You literally reach a blockade, then the real motive comes out.

I try and understand how others think Jan but your approach is very interesting and every now and then I get a glimpse of how you see the world so it would be nice if you got to see the world from an atheist view point...but this comment you make about real motive has me confused.

What do you imagine the real motive to be in your words.

I didn't say anything about getting a kick out of it.

Thats how I took it...but you said some people not you.

I am not concerned I dont know what the relevance was supposed to be with your original statement.

Difference between humans and animals???


Yes there is a small difference and large differences.

Do animals have a soul?

Are humans special, Alex?
If yes, why?

Yes and no.
Yes because they are and no because they are not.

So lack of proof, and facts (as you see them), means something is made up?

Clearly you have difficulty in working out when something is made up like scriptures and various religious books.

I sometimes fail to realise how debilitating that can be but unfortunately the condition appears very real.

Why one chooses to recognise fiction when in a fairy tale yet not when presented in a religious book I still cant fathom.

There are so many things that are just so wrong and uninformed recording of natural observation in religious text I wonder why folk do not instantly reject them...yet they dont.

If you met a liar you would throw him out when you discover his first lie...but even when confronted with lie after lie in a religious text the fool we call a thesist is not convinced it is a book that can only beconsidered unreliable at best and nonsense if one is to be objective.

Facts matter, proof of existence of made up characters is absolutely necessary if that character is being presented as real.

Such approach is just as applicable to God as it is the easter bunny or santa.

If it is real the facts will support the reality..

There is an easter bunny..ok..show me one.


Yes really.

Alex
 
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I would have thought that the very phrase ''common sense'', gives no reason to assume anything other than what it actually says. So ponder if you must, but it was no way inspired by what was written by me.

Why have you focused on this one, obvious point?
Why not carry on, see where it leads.

Uh, If you know me so well could you at least say what I am pondering?

-_O
 
I do not reject your approach generally but my approach will not change.
I do not need to show them a better approach and frankly they would not notice.
Jan had to ask me if a rapist feels good about his evil deeds why would he not be a good person.
Do you think being subtle can work with someone who has such difficulty in looking at a proposition rationaly.

If someone says something exists I am not going to say well yes I will be polite and say how could I know that is not correct...no I am going to call it for what it is ... made up unsupported nonsense.
I know I could do better but why should I bother really...
Sometimes you just have to stand up to these folk and demand they get real.
Alex
^^^
Some ways work better with some & other ways work better with others.
Nothing works with Jan.

<>
 
I note there has been some discussion going on about souls

Thought I would chip in

This wiki link is a good starting point I feel

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soul

220px-Rosarium_philosphorum_Soul.jpg

Couple of points

I did skim through link so I might have missed it, but I did not see any reference to a physical aspect to the soul and even in the most ancient medical text I have read never seen any anatomical aspect of a soul described, nor any drawings

When I first heard of a soul in Sunday school (don't laugh I did go) I put the location of the soul inside the heel part of the foot. I had no idea why until some years later it twigged I might have been confused with Achilles heel

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Achilles'_heel

There is reference to the soul being incorporeal mean without physical body but incorporeal also can refer to air and fire which do have a physicality, abet a very thin one

Also debate about - do animals have souls - are souls mortal or immortal but these are side issues

The modern con-man uses words like spirit or life force

The closest I come to considering, as being the best candidate for the position of soul, is concessness

Concessness ticks all the characteristics of the soul

Problem is none of the characteristics survive death as characteristics are a process

Giving the process of life a name, “soul”, would allow for the concept of some sort of existence after death

The body dies, the soul looks around, packs up all your memories, hopes, dreams, loves and looses - in essence the essence of you - and heads off to heaven / hell (thought bubble - who gives directions to the soul? And is there any appeal system if the soul feels like something is not fair?)

I'm done for now. Coffee time

:)
 
I note there has been some discussion going on about souls

Thought I would chip in

This wiki link is a good starting point I feel

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soul

View attachment 1757

Couple of points

I did skim through link so I might have missed it, but I did not see any reference to a physical aspect to the soul and even in the most ancient medical text I have read never seen any anatomical aspect of a soul described, nor any drawings

When I first heard of a soul in Sunday school (don't laugh I did go) I put the location of the soul inside the heel part of the foot. I had no idea why until some years later it twigged I might have been confused with Achilles heel

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Achilles'_heel

There is reference to the soul being incorporeal mean without physical body but incorporeal also can refer to air and fire which do have a physicality, abet a very thin one

Also debate about - do animals have souls - are souls mortal or immortal but these are side issues

The modern con-man uses words like spirit or life force

The closest I come to considering, as being the best candidate for the position of soul, is concessness

Concessness ticks all the characteristics of the soul

Problem is none of the characteristics survive death as characteristics are a process

Giving the process of life a name, “soul”, would allow for the concept of some sort of existence after death

The body dies, the soul looks around, packs up all your memories, hopes, dreams, loves and looses - in essence the essence of you - and heads off to heaven / hell (thought bubble - who gives directions to the soul? And is there any appeal system if the soul feels like something is not fair?)

I'm done for now. Coffee t

:)
^^^
I never read or even heard anyone claim it necessarily retains ALL your memories, hopes, dreams, loves and looses. I would think it must retain X amount or it would not be you but if I get amnesia, will I no longer be me?

<>
 
^^^
I never read or even heard anyone claim it necessarily retains ALL your memories, hopes, dreams, loves and looses. I would think it must retain X amount or it would not be you but if I get, will I no longer be me?

<>
Very good question

Making it up as I go along thinking of a answer

You would still be you as you have always been you as your memories accumulated so I can see no problem with the reverse occuring

You remain you if you loose your memories suddenly, amnesia - or slowly, Alzheimer's

Interestingly does (or has the soul) the soul retain the memories you have lost (or in the process of loosing)?

How would it be if you get to heaven

Peter - Who are you?

You - no idea

:)
 
Interestingly does (or has the soul) the soul retain the memories you have lost (or in the process of loosing)?
Yes if you want it to..
The good thing is because its all made up you can set it up as you want.
I think the soul is how you were when 25 years and it can fly at 1000 miles an hour and you can travel in space and you dont get hungry or sleepy.
And if you dont think thats correct prove me wrong..it cant be wrong because I just told myself that and that was my soul talking not my body so it must be right.

Alex
 
Yes if you want it to..
The good thing is because its all made up you can set it up as you want.
I think the soul is how you were when 25 years and it can fly at 1000 miles an hour and you can travel in space and you dont get hungry or sleepy.
And if you dont think thats correct prove me wrong..it cant be wrong because I just told myself that and that was my soul talking not my body so it must be right.

Alex

OMIMG

You have caught ...itis (he whoes name I cannot say)

:)
 
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