Do we have freewill ? is it biblical ?

Do you believe you have freewill

  • yes

    Votes: 5 45.5%

  • no

    Votes: 6 54.5%
  • Total voters
    11
DaveC426913 said:
This is even more bizarre. What if Bob waits five minutes before "reversing" Alice's action by removing the ball from the box? Did that negate Alice's free will? What if Bob waits six days? What if he waits until Alice is dead?
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Did that negate Alice's free will?

Depends on Alice intention at the moment she placed the ball in the box

If she intended it there forever then yes

If she had no interest in the ball once in the box then no

What if Bob waits six days?

Same as above

What if he waits until Alice is dead?

Same as above

DaveC426913 said:
That's not fee will; that's unlimited power.
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And since we understand unlimited power is impossible eventually all sentient beings loose free will on death, or prior to death

:)
 
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Lets all calm down that we can converse and live freedom we all enjoy to choose what we write and respect each other we have the right to opinion like one famous saying does !

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We are all brillaint geniuses here we can talk freewill and find it's secret in life ;D.
 
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Even in wonderland there is freewill there and in dreamland, too just don't add Disneyland because it's all bought ;D.

Freedom can't be bought.

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cluelusshusbund said:
The fact that no one can refute is that dreams are a perfect example of us usin our free will... i.e... Free Will does exist
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That may seem to be true, but dreams do not exist in reality. They are the product of the brain's information processing functions and any willed actions in the dream are not really physical in nature.

Even then there seems to be a form of control present.
Example, in the dream you are trying to run, but you are stuck in your place. No matter how hard you try to run, you're not getting anywhere. Which is physically correct, as you are in bed, maybe kicking your feet.
 
Write4U said:
That may seem to be true, but dreams do not exist in reality. They are the product of the brain's information processing functions and any willed actions in the dream are not really physical in nature.

Even then there seems to be a form of control present.
Example, in the dream you are trying to run, but you are stuck in your place. No matter how hard you try to run, you're not getting anywhere. Which is physically correct, as you are in bed, maybe kicking your feet.
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Like my thouts... my dreams bein private... i.e... not bein subject to influence from others puts me in the position to actuate my free will... no.???
 
cluelusshusbund said:
Like my thouts... my dreams bein private... i.e... not bein subject to influence from others puts me in the position to actuate my free will... no.???
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Not physically. Dreams are not causal to physical action (maybe sleepwalking?). When awake we can also dream of going to the stars, but at this time it is physically impossible, so IMO it all adds up to "wishful thinking" and that is not exercising free will in physical reality.

I have been accused of being unconventional and that may sound as if I am exercising free will, but I know that whatever I decide is still a product of my brain's physical data processing based on my subjective sensory perceptions.

Is being able to resist someone other's will itself an exercise of free will?
 
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Michael 345 said:
Did that negate Alice's free will?

Depends on Alice intention at the moment she placed the ball in the box
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No. She had a desire (to put the ball in the box). She acted to fulfill that desire.

That, in-and-of-itself, is sufficient to demonstrate free will. Full stop.

It doesn't even matter if she was unable to put the ball in the box.

The simple fact is, she acted on her desire. That's free will.
 
Write4U said:
Not physically. Dreams are not causal to physical action (maybe sleepwalking?).
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For sure sleepwalkin.!!!

When i was about 10… i was sleepin on the floor cause it was cooler than the bed… but a few hours later i woke up cold so of course i went outside an climbed over a fence to go to a nabors house to borrow a blanket… an after knockin an knockin on her door she finally she flipped on the kitchen light an i instently woke up… realizin i was only in my underware an ran back home.

About 37 years ago i dreamed that i had lost my credit card an was tryin to figer out who to call about it… an even after i woke up i was still concerned about it even tho i knew it was just a dream… an it still kinda bugged me even after i had been at work for a few hours.!!!

I kinda have the feelin that dreams are causal to physical an mental actions… its just that some of those actions are less noticeable than others which gives the misconception that dreams ant part of a causal chain.!!!

When awake we can also dream of going to the stars, but at this time it is physically impossible, so IMO it all adds up to "wishful thinking" and that is not exercising free will in physical reality.
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My idea of free will is simply the ability to do otherwize.!!!
Even dreams are determined by the unique causal circumstances of each individual dreamer… so not free.!!!

I have been accused of being unconventional and that may sound as if I am exercising free will, but I know that whatever I decide is still a product of my brain's physical data processing based on my subjective sensory perceptions.
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Ah Oh... Now you’e got me thankin agan.!!!

Is being able to resist someone other's will itself an exercise of free will?
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Hmmm… it woud seem that conflictin wills is nuthin more than links in a chain of events… i.e… wit the illusion of free… but not free :-(


DaveC426913 said:
What? Connect those dots. How do dreams demonstrate free will?
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Ive changed my mind:oops: ... i take back what i said:redface:

The fact that no one can refute is that dreams are a perfect example of us usin our free will... i.e... Free Will does exist
 
DaveC426913 said:
No. She had a desire (to put the ball in the box). She acted to fulfill that desire.

That, in-and-of-itself, is sufficient to demonstrate free will. Full stop.
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You are looking at snippets of free will - start - stop - start - stop - stuttering free will

I don't fancy that model

More the platted threads of Alice thoughts as they move they entwine with other

:)
 
I think Ian Brady (the Moors murderer) may have been fixated on free will** and that his idea may have been to kill those victims in a dispassionate a way as possible (just like any mundane action but to somehow break the fabric of conventional thought)

If you wanted to " prove" your idea of free will a practical test might be to kill yourself for no reason at all , but even then it could be said that you are a prisoner of the attempt to prove your idea.

I have an idea(perhaps the general consensus?) that we have no choice than to believe that we have an individual "clearing " of "free will" buried in a thicket of constraints.

Some people with a strong character have a larger "clearing" and others just go with the flow and are surprised to learn that their actions are almost entirely predictable.

It would not be an either/or scenario.

** as per the little I have read about him.
 
geordief said:
I think Ian Brady (the Moors murderer) may have been fixated on free will** and that his idea may have been to kill those victims in a dispassionate a way as possible (just like any mundane action but to somehow break the fabric of conventional thought)

If you wanted to " prove" your idea of free will a practical test might be to kill yourself for no reason at all , but even then it could be said that you are a prisoner of the attempt to prove your idea.

I have an idea(perhaps the general consensus?) that we have no choice than to believe that we have an individual "clearing " of "free will" buried in a thicket of constraints.

Some people with a strong character have a larger "clearing" and others just go with the flow and are surprised to learn that their actions are almost entirely predictable.

It would not be an either/or scenario.

** as per the little I have read about him.
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He sounds NuTs-_O
 
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