DC protest-01/06/2021
- Thread starter sculptor
- Start date
Because Trump, Trump Jr, McConnell, Hannity, Limbaugh et al incited them to violence over the past two months or so. It doesn't take much with people like that.
Giuliani (to protesters): "Let's have trial by combat!"
Trump Jr: "The best thing for America’s future is for @realDonaldTrump to go to total war over this election to expose all of the fraud, cheating, dead/no longer in state voters, that has been going on for far too long."
Ivanka: rioters are "American Patriots"
Trump (as the riot began): "Mike Pence didn't have the courage to do what should have been done to protect our Country and our Constitution!"
sculptor
Valued Senior Member
and then, we had
the riots during Trump's inauguration day
https://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/i...re-anti-trump-protests-after-day-rage-n709946
and
https://www.cnn.com/2017/01/19/politics/trump-inauguration-protests-womens-march/index.html
and
https://www.wusa9.com/article/news/...ests-in-dc-inauguration-protests/65-388634528
What did those anti Trump rioters hope to accomplish?
.....................................
Is this a trend?
Jan 20 2021?
4 years hence?
the riots during Trump's inauguration day
https://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/i...re-anti-trump-protests-after-day-rage-n709946
and
https://www.cnn.com/2017/01/19/politics/trump-inauguration-protests-womens-march/index.html
and
https://www.wusa9.com/article/news/...ests-in-dc-inauguration-protests/65-388634528
What did those anti Trump rioters hope to accomplish?
.....................................
Is this a trend?
Jan 20 2021?
4 years hence?
And whatabout the riots during Nixon's presidency? And whatabout the race riots in the 1960's? And whatabout the riots in Portland? And whatabout the Rodney King riots? And whatabout this and whatabout that? Answer THAT if you can!
sculptor
Valued Senior Member
Please avoid any tendency to obfuscatory nonsense.
Focus was on presidential transitions
Stick to that please.
OK. Then let's focus on today's riots, and avoid said obfuscations. That is, after all, the title of the thread.
sculptor
Valued Senior Member
Yeh, and............................
???!!!
Right. Because you've given us so much to work with (as regards whateverthefuck the topic here is supposed to be):
DC protest. Why?
Seriously, what the fuck is wrong with you?
Regardless, I'll have a go:
There's a significant difference between those protests you mention and the one today--well, actually there are a number of critical of differences, but here's two:
At those protests, at which there was no attempted coup and which were largely peaceful, quite a number of arrests were made. Today, amidst a violent, attempted coup (sedition, treason, whatever you wish to call it), hardly any arrests were made.
There's a significant difference between those protests you mention and the one today--well, actually there are a number of critical of differences, but here's two:
At those protests, at which there was no attempted coup and which were largely peaceful, quite a number of arrests were made. Today, amidst a violent, attempted coup (sedition, treason, whatever you wish to call it), hardly any arrests were made.
Now that is a good question, but honestly, I don't think that any of us are really equipped to answer it. It's easy to say that these guys are a bunch of moronic lugheads, fueled mostly by adrenalin, and probably accurate, but it still doesn't fully account for such a futile endeavor.
?? Pretty simple. They sought to disrupt the counting of the electoral votes in the belief that if they interfered with it, and it could not conclude, that Trump would remain president - which is their goal.
sculptor
Valued Senior Member
Yeh but
That ain't the way it works.
May I refer you to article 2 section 1 para 3 &4 of the us constitution.
Even if the crazies managed to disrupt the mandated procedures, the ultimate decision would come from the house----------pretty much guaranteeing a democrat victory.
What in hell were/are they thinking?
..................................
ok circa 1966-67 I went to a couple protest-(in Oklahoma)--mostly because I thought that I might get laid------------
and
I was wrong.-----wrong venue?
To use ER terminology, these people tend to have NEARS syndrome. Checking with their constitution sorta isn't their thing.
Janus58
Valued Senior Member
Of course it doesn't work that way, but do actually expect these people to understand this?
Different reasons for different participants.
The neo-nazis and white supremacists went because they see Trump as the current best route to the fascist state they think they want.
But some of the people who went did so because they mistakenly thought they were defending American democracy - stopping "the steal". The more important question to ask is: why do so many Americans believe Trump's lies, and the lies of his party, some members of which are only now starting to have some second thoughts about what they are condoning and/or endorsing? The answer is a concerted campaign of deliberate misinforming of the American public, carried out over the past two decades (at least), which Americans have, up to the present time, allowed to fester and expand.
America has some deep problems that it needs to stop ignoring and start addressing, if it wants to preserve its democracy in a workable form. Deep divisions have been sown, especially in recent years, deliberately.
Apparently, organisations like Twitter and Facebook are finally starting to realise the implications of the misinformation they have condoned for so long. There are many organisations that style themselves as news sources, which really ought to take a hard look at themselves and their complicity in this, too.
This is an important moment in American history. Protesters have not stormed the US Capitol in this way in over 200 years. How Americans react will decide where the country goes from here.
Yeah. It's kind of unfortunate that--in this particular instance, at least--the behavior of the former was, in a sense, the most "rational." If achieving a fascist state is their goal, they're going about it the right way; if overturning the election results was their goal, they're fucking idiots.
sculptor
Valued Senior Member
amen
Janus58
Valued Senior Member
I wouldn't put too much significance to this. I doubt that it due to some crisis of conscience, but more based on political expedience. Consider McConnell, While he did try to keep Republican Senators from supporting the objection to the Electoral votes, it wasn't because it was an attempt to overthrow an election or would be damaging to the country, but because he thought he thought it would be bad for the Republican party.
Some of them in the Trump camp are already trying to claim that the attack on the Capital was really Antifa doing a "false flag" operation.
Bells
Staff member
A President telling them to fight, who ranted about stopping the certification in Congress and demanding Pence somehow do the impossible for him and telling the people at the rally to take the fight to the Capitol, messaging from the administration and legal representative to 'trial by combat'..
At a "Stop the Steal" rally..
Which Trump encouraged people to attend because, and I quote directly from his tweet:
Peter Navarro releases 36-page report alleging election fraud 'more than sufficient' to swing victory to Trump https://washex.am/3nwaBCe. A great report by Peter. Statistically impossible to have lost the 2020 Election. Big protest in D.C. on January 6th. Be there, will be wild!
https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1340185773220515840
https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1340185773220515840
Perhaps if you are unsure as to what motivates these people, you could drop a line to Derrick Evans.
Who is Derrick Evans? Why, he is the newly elected Republican delegate from West Virginia, who live streamed his participating in the coup attempt, encouraging his fellow Trump supporters to break down the door and egged them on and leading them on a chant of "Trump, Trump, Trump".. And we know it was him, because he was kind enough to keep turning the phone around to film himself as he was doing it..
https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=393888625208875
He has since deleted the video, but people were kind enough to keep receipts..
And if you are still unsure about what motivated them to do what they did, just as the process of tallying the elector's votes was happening in the Capitol, you can perhaps ask Rudy Giuliani, who, after the coup attempt had failed and they got back to tallying and certifying the votes, decided to make some phone calls. And left a message asking Tommy Tuberville, who he thought he was calling, to do everything he could to continue the delay.. But because he is a complete moron, he dialled the wrong number and left the message on someone else's phone..
You can read the entire transcript of his message and listen to the recording of his message here: https://thedispatch.com/p/giuliani-to-senator-try-to-just-slow
Hopefully that has cleared up some of your confusion!