Ants, Us, and God.


You acknowledged the easily agreed-with with the requisite formula response. Now, answer the real question:

What do you imagine my motivation must be that I should feel compelled to carry your burden of proof for you?

Late joiner

This is the first time I've read this thread and Gro$$ I think you've raised a very good topic.

I would like to just say a couple of things. There are no points to any of these thoughts, they're just arbitrary things to say.

Your ant story made me think of the last scene in Men In Black where the giant aliens were playing marbles containing galaxies.
Humans really don't know, or can't prove, that this isn't possible.

Then the topic went on to discuss God. I am an athiest. I was brought up a Catholic but as an adult science became my 'religion' if you will. I believe we (humans) are just like every other species on this planet. We are born, we live, we die, the end. Our bodies, over billions of years, will become fossil fuel for whatever is roaming the planet at that time. We will be recycled just like every other species.

As for souls - this one always gets me going. Why does every human believe that only humans have souls? It's really the same as believing in god. Only humans seem to believe in god and souls. Doesn't anybody look at their pet dog and see some sort of a soul in him? Or dolphins? These are animals that are able to express some sort of feeling that we can understand a little. Why can't we attribute a soul to every living creature? I know a lot of people like to go fishing, but all I see is some poor animal being tortured. Imagine a giant hook being caught in your throat and then dragging you under water. That image comes to me every time I see a fisherman.

And doesn't anyone wonder why whales beach themselves in groups? Could they have souls? Or feelings?

I guess I'm feeling a sorry for anything being mistreated because we're sharing the planet with millions of other creatures (plants included) yet it's the humans who are polluting it. Shame on us.

There, I've had my say. No points to make, just wanted to let that out. If you agree or disagree it doesn't matter.

Again, great thread.
Every living species here on Earth has a 'soul' and goes back to the Cosmos. It seems to me that the Whales and Dolphins have just found a better way of living in more harmony together then we humans do.

Couldn't it be that they are further in 'evolution' then we humans are?

Look at the Dolphins for instance, they come up and play with humans pretty often. They are such wonderful Animals. Much more appreciated then humans with their constant arguing.

Look at this thread, arguing all the time. One theory after another and a lot of disagreement.

Well, I go for the Whales and Dolphins and other Animals.

And they certainly have a 'soul' which goes back to the Cosmos.
Even an Ant.;)

Let's see what a comment there will be on this one...

Pretty arrogant of humans to think they are the only 'intelligent' species here on Earth.

Intelligent?? An inventive word made up by humans. Only because they have the possibility to talk to eachother. But what do we humans do with this communication???
Argue, argue, after day, year after year...

The whales have a better way of communication and also do other Animals. Even Dogs and Cats...

Humans have made them domestical to them and make slaves of their pets, for they want to have control over everything, including their pets...
Every living species here on Earth has a 'soul'...

So, how do you treat your fellow cockroaches, mosquitos and houseflys?

With due respect, I trust.
Something I remembered

I think it was from Billy Connolly but apologies if it's not.

Who do you think the more intelligent species is - the dog, or the man walking behind him with a small broom and a plastic bag?

:D Teri
Originally posted by Mr. G

You acknowledged the easily agreed-with with the requisite formula response. Now, answer the real question:

So you are not satisfied.oh! and dont worry i"ll have cattle hired for carrying the burden so that you dont have to.:D

so what did i ask,and where did i agree?i almost forgot the whole thing...

and Mr G you urself have admitted:

that you cant disprove god's existence.

95% of all people of this world according to you are under illusion of god,isnt it?though you feel proud to find urself a part of skeptical community,(ehm,ehm,ehm)but a true skeptic doesnt say WHY buddy... but he questions WHY NOT? open mindedness is pretty important.

and you know u can then point out hundreds of reasons for not believeing in god.:

i dont believe in god because:
1.)my salary is low.
2.)my dog barks slowly.
3.)my girl firend is a liar.

and on...and on...
and now answer my question:
what would you do IF at the end of your life you find out that god exists and he is ruling...?
if tommorrow i find that god doesnt exist i"ll say its okay man,whatever i did was just mine i didnt owe it to anyone,but what about you?you are not safe on one side,isnt it?
Mr. G, there you have me.:)

I prefer the Cockroaches to stay outside, for I don't like it at all if they come inside. I jump high upon a chair if they do come in and I see them.

But they don't have to die, just take them away...;) Outside, where they belong. cant disprove god's existence.

Not with any more success than you can prove to anyone else that such a thing does actually exist -- to people other than those who have commited themselves to choosing to imagine that such a thing actually does exist without any empirical evidence at all to change the supposition to actual fact. Otherwise, what role for faith? open mindedness is pretty important.

Much like a bucket with no bottom. It accepts everything and retains nothing of substance.

what would you do if at the end of your life you find out that god exists and he is ruling...?

I'd form an opposition party and run against him in the next election.
Originally posted by Mr. G
[I'd form an opposition party and run against him in the next election. [/B]


Well satan, why don't you start with the oposition party right away?

Why wait til you are death? You can be elected now if you dare to speak up in the open.
Isn't it so that it is allowed in the united states to have FREEDOM of religion and therefor thus Freedom to make your own election party for not believing and preaching your 'satanic' ideas?

Go for it, I am waiting for you to be electected as the first television 'satan' who makes a good living by preaching your words of 'evil' and disbeliefs in this 'FREE' America now a days.

Good luck. :p

Show yourself to be proven the open...
Believing in Satan, like believing in gods, also is an act of faith.

Why would I be inclined to buy into another version of the very same thing?

But in the spirit :rolleyes: of the thought experiment, were I to meet Satan on my way to meeting your god, I'd tell him I'd seen your god fondling Satan's own little sister.
Mr. G,
A little civility please. Antagonizing folks will not help. Contribute if you will but that is the key, if you respond with constant criticism you will wind being viewed much the same way as Tony1. It would seem that you are persistently hounding certain members. While you may not agree with those views it is a large world with viewpoints to correspond to such. The ladies here at Sciforums are a welcome change and a great amount of effort was spend in getting some of them here. It all goes to waste when posters start "stalking" them and those ladies decide to go elsewhere. I for one, enjoy seeing them here. Say what you have to say but name-calling, rudeness, and the like is not required on either side of the board.
zion, if the only reason you believe in God is so you'll be on the "safe side" just in case he exists then I doubt it's doing you any good anyway. From what I understand about God, he will not condemn you for not believing in him most of your life. As long as you help others, give instead of recieve, you are living for God anyway, even if you don't believe he exists (even if he doesn't exist...). You are still living for the "spirit" of religion, which is to be caring, compassionate and helpful towards eachother.

If in the end God does exist, and he sends me to hell even though I've lived a caring and giving life then I'm not sure I want to follow him. He would sound more like a power-hungry monarch to me if he did that :(

if you read my several posts regarding my opinions about God and various other beliefs about how life exist,you"ll find out what i believe and why i believe in god.the example given to Mr G,was an example for sake of discussing a thing out.also there is a strong analogy for me between "THE MATRIX" movie and the real life as i believe,that is the reason why this name.

The Matrix is a movie...

A good movie, but it is a movie. It is not the truth. And it is made up. Just like Science fiction.
But it is a real good movie...;)

Are we going to discuss the existance of god here? There is a Religion Forum for that.

And then again. I agree with Xelios on this one. If you live your life in understanding with other humans, Earth and Nature, and try to do the best you can to live your life Free from 'evil', you live your life in the best way you can. A lot of humans kill in the name of gods love. Love? (Pride in the name of Love - A shot rings out in the morning Sky. Free at last, they took your life, they could not take your Pride(Pride??). In the name of Love, one more in the name of Love - U2)

Why is there an only good god necessarry, who judges us all after our body has died? Heaven and hell? A 'good' and a 'bad' afterlife? Nothing in between?

Guess you better call it 'All That Is' then. There is no such rude judgement here, only a new life to come, in which you have to deal with the experiences and decisions you've made in this life-time.:) And deal with it...

Mr. G, A little civility please.
More than a little civility have I consistantly afforded everyone -- some more then others, like anyone else.

Antagonizing folks...
I challenge folks for how and what they think, as everyone is free to do with me, as you are doing. I've stated this before --it should at this late date be no surprise to anyone. You say "toe-mah-toe"...

...if you respond with constant criticism
A generality untrue when one examines the full spectrum of my threaded posts. Where I feel compelled not to leave anyone's wierd thinking argument from authority unchallenged I respond. If my responses to WTAFA are numerous perhaps WTAFA are numerous, too.

I don't know him. He must hang out in places where I'm not being anagonistic. :p

It would seem that you are persistently hounding certain members.
I challenge WTAFAs. That there may be certain members more prone to such thinking might therefore mean I respond to more of their posts than the remaining others.

While you may not agree with those views it is a large world with viewpoints to correspond to such.
It is a large world, and all people can respond to my views with equal freedom to disagree and challenge me. It is a fact that I previously have encouraged people to challenge me. To discourage me challenging others is to discourage others to challenge me. Are we all to be cognitive couch potatoes?

The ladies here at Sciforums are a welcome change and a great amount of effort was spend in getting some of them here.
Sir, I take personal offense to your opprobrious innuendo that I biasly single out females, any female, for prejudicial derision. I challenge you either to offer up a single textual, gender-specific utterance here attributable to myself or to apologize.

It all goes to waste when posters start "stalking" them...
I respond to WTAFAs where I find them. If the same people are where I respond to WTAFAs there can always be construed the appearence of 'stalking'.
You question my intent. Have you equally questioned the intents of those who do not recognize that perfectly innocent coincidence may be at work? Who suggest 'stalking' as the only certain cause?

...and those ladies decide to go elsewhere.
By leaving, do they then not do a disservice to all females by leaving the community with the gender-specific impression that females are not the equals of males because they require special accommodations and special protections?

By such reasoning, if I challenge females equally as I do males am I not actually paying females a most significant gender-neutral compliment?

Say what you have to say but name-calling, rudeness, and the like is not required on either side of the board.
Again, I challenge you to produce a single example of 'name-calling' or non-subjective 'rudeness' to support your accusation.
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wet1 ...

I happen to know for a fact that ... I hope you don't get too upset with me for
blowing your cover Mr. G ... he, Mr. G, is an Episcopal Bishop who has devoted
his life to the Truth as he sees it. Consequently I can understand why he would
get upset with the likes of Bebelina and Banchee who promugate paganism, for
lack of a better term, on Sciforums.

So please cut him some slack and tell Banchee not to go referring to him as 'Satan'.
Lets have a little respect shown to a man of the cloth! I can shrug off, even
get a chuckle out of Bebelina calling me 'ogre', but that's something else, she
has a thing for me. Why do you think she accused me of 'flirting' with Mr. G? Yes, a
woman scorned.

Take care. ;)
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