# Another affair for the ever so moral Republicans!

Discussion in 'Politics' started by joepistole, Jun 24, 2009.

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1. ### joepistoleDeacon BluesValued Senior Member

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Funny how the party that touts morality at every street corner is faced with an endless stream of revealing breaches of moral code by its leaders. The most recent, Senator Kent of Nevada and now Gov. Sanford of South Carolina.

This is the same party that spent 40 plus million public dollars trying to find something to impeach Clinton with durring his presidency. I am continually amazed that anyone in their right mind could take these clowns seriously. But nothing seems to stop the ditto heads from putting these guys in office. You would think that Republicans would pause and maybe just once question those they elect to public office and the leadership of their party...maybe just once.

Last edited: Jun 24, 2009

3. ### PieAreSquaredWoo is resistant to reasonRegistered Senior Member

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we were on the same track Joe

5. ### joepistoleDeacon BluesValued Senior Member

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Indeed we were Pie and at the same time too

7. ### Buffalo RoamRegistered Senior Member

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Yes, I hope they burn his butt good, but you don't have anything to point fingers over, aren't you one of those who defended Billy (Hide the Cigar) Clinton?

Kinda of like;

Barny (Run a Brothel out of my House) Franks

Bill (Blue Stained Dress) Clinton

Eliot (Client Number Nine) Spitzer

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9. ### Buffalo RoamRegistered Senior Member

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OK, then I raise you break the bank Obama;

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090618/...icits_analysis

To use your own word's (fuck over the country)

10. ### PieAreSquaredWoo is resistant to reasonRegistered Senior Member

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after the damage was done.. sweet pea

Gramm was co-chair of John McCain’s presidential campaign and his most senior economic adviser

think it is bad now.. imagine if McLame got in

11. ### Buffalo RoamRegistered Senior Member

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After the damage was done? so Obama dumps a Hydrogen Bomb of $1.85 trillion dollars of deficit on the problem, more than doubling the Deficit in 100 day? and you want to point at Phill Gramm? Obama has added$1.85 trillion dollars of new deficit, Phill Gramm had nothing to do with that at all, it all belongs to the Democrats.

12. ### pjdude1219The biscuit has risenValued Senior Member

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they weren't outspoken against that behavior though.

13. ### joepistoleDeacon BluesValued Senior Member

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The difference is the Democrats are not preaching the right wing moral code from every street corner, not to mention having a major scandal break every few months. You really had to go back to find a Democratic scandal.

Gary Hart 1984 (25 years ago)
Barney Frank 1990 (19 years ago)
Bill Clinton 1998 (11 years ago)
Elliot Spitzer 2008 (1 year ago)

Let's do a little sampling of Republicans wrestling with their well touted moral code:

http://www.salem-news.com/articles/october172007/repub_scandals_10_17_07.php

14. ### TiassaLet us not launch the boat ...Staff Member

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Conservatives and Integrity: A perpetual mismatch

Perhaps it is too subtle to qualify as significant in your view, Mr. Roam, but the primary reason a Republican's sexual affairs are of any interest to liberals is that, as Joe noted, the GOP is "party that touts morality".

People's bedrooms have long been one of the places the "party of small government" wants to extend intrusive governance. If they get the hell out of people's bedrooms, the GOP will get the same deference from liberals that we give Democrats.

Gary Hart — Sealed his own doom by daring reporters to come after him when he knew damn well he had skeletons to hide. How stupid can a politician get? More than the affair itself, that stupidity questions his qualification to be president.

Barney Frank — This one doesn't carry much traction because unethical prostitutes are unethical prostitutes. While liberals may have salivated over the demise of Ted Haggard for instance, even famed sex columnist Dan Savage had a few things to say about the hooker's betrayal of his client. A whore whose revelations are made for money? Nobody really cares. Oh, except conservatives trying to hide from hypocrisy. ("Look at the birdie! Look at the birdie!")

Bill Clinton — So a smear project run by a magazine owned by a known vindictive conservative manages to get Congress to investigate a land deal on which the Clintons lost money, and the investigation finally settles on an extramarital affair? The amount of work that went into that one makes the whole thing laughable. We might impeach a president over a blowjob, but concocted lies to lead us to war, or authorizing torture aren't a big deal? The whole Zippergate episode is a laughable tragedy.

Eliot Spitzer — People's problem with Spitzer's downfall is that the investigation appeared to be politically motivated. The former New York Attorney General did not simply appear on the radar and get busted. Rather, it appears that investigators were after him specifically in retaliation for certain outcomes of how he did his job.​

That said, I don't see a whole lot of point in giving Sanford shit over this one. The relevant issue, as Joe noted at the outset, is,

"This is the same party that spent 40 plus million public dollars trying to find something to impeach Clinton with durring his presidency .... You would think that Republicans would pause and maybe just once question those they elect to public office and the leadership of their party...maybe just once."​

And even that is of questionable value because, as you demonstrate, some people simply refuse to consider the idea that conservative persecutors and attack hounds should give any attention to integrity.

15. ### Buffalo RoamRegistered Senior Member

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And if you care to notice we punish those who denigrate that Morality, seem to me to be moral is a good thing or are you touting immorality as a norm, as you seem to be with your post.

We did find something to impeach Clinton on, Perjury, but as usual people like you and joe, and the Democrats in the Congress don't seem to be bothered by your politicians, lying stealing, cheating and having no moral compass.

16. ### pjdude1219The biscuit has risenValued Senior Member

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Yes he perjured himself though technically you could say Bush also perjured(perjury is the breaking of an oath) him self and also the question that Clinton lied about was in fact illegal to ask.

17. ### TiassaLet us not launch the boat ...Staff Member

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Why is honesty anathema among conservatives?

Punishment coincides with political need.

As to immorality? I live in a country where a notable proportion of the culture thinks two adults consenting to have sex with one another is immoral.

What is it about you and other conservatives that ignoring the counterpoint and simply repeating the allegation over and over again is considered a useful argument? The response to the issue of Clinton's "perjury" has been presented at least three times (once by Spidergoat, and I've offered it up at least twice). And every time the argument comes up, conservatives just push it aside without any substantial consideration, only to raise it again a while later, pretending they've never seen the counterpoint.

Of course, maybe they haven't. If they simply ignore it—if they don't read it—they can claim they haven't seen it.

Nothing new about that dishonesty. We see and hear it from your ilk all the time.
____________________

Notes:

Huppi, Tom. "Myth: Clinton committed perjury". Huppi.com. Accessed June 24, 2009. http://www.huppi.com/kangaroo/L-clintonperjury.html

18. ### Buffalo RoamRegistered Senior Member

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Sorry but;

As Judge Wright ruled in her contempt holding against Clinton, Clinton made "intentionally false" statements. Clinton also enlisted others to lie for him

Can you show the same for President Bush, a legal ruling.

Technically is not germane to the issue, and your technical opinion is worth squat.

19. ### pjdude1219The biscuit has risenValued Senior Member

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Um ok but that really doesn't respond to my point. arguing a point conceded isn't the brightest idea.

Their wouldn't be a legal ruling because perjury is only a crime in one kind of perjury and not all kinds.

actually technically it is.
So i'd still be ahead of since your opinion period is worth squat.

20. ### joepistoleDeacon BluesValued Senior Member

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Show me just one instance in which I was not bothered by politicians lying, stealing, cheating and having no moral compass...just one. If you have read my posts I am very much against all of those behaviors. That is why I favor the Democrats. I find them ironically a much more ethical group of individuals. In my association with Democrats and liberals I find them often questioning their behaviors to make sure they are acting ethically...something my Republican friends rarely do.

And let's not forget the all so unethical White Water Investigation....a huge misuse of the judical system to pursue political goals of the Republican Party.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Susan_McDougal

It is quite a leap to go from lying about a sexual relationship to corruption and stealing. And as for your punishment, doesn't look to severe to me. Rebublicans have and continue to destroy their credibility.

They are for small government and then the oversee the largest expansion of government since FDR. They claim to be for fiscal responsiblilty, then they go from budget surplus to more than a half trillion dollar deficit and double the national debt. They claim to be for family values and then their leaders are out double dipping their peckers. Ironically Sanford was scheduled to speak at the Republican Values Summit. How funny can you get?

I am not sorry, it makes me feel dirty to be with Republicans who see nothing wrong with that kind of behavior.

Last edited: Jun 25, 2009
21. ### countezeroRegistered Senior Member

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5,590
Tiassa, I actually agree with the first part of your post (the Republicans literally beg for this kind of treatment), but then you start rationalizing ridiculous behavior and almost wishing it away with words and circumstances. It reminds me, since I'm reading the Final Days, of Nixon crooning about how he didn't do anything that Kennedy and Johnson hadn't done and that the whole Watergate thing was just politics. Maybe so, but I'd retort that ill-beginnings can lead to satisfying and acceptable ends (sometimes).

Take, for example, Barney Frank's case. This is probably the most morally egregious of the lot. I mean, I could care less about Hart on a boat, but this was a guy who let an illegal criminal organization operate from his home. That's beyond the pale.

And yes, the Republican witch hunt against Clinton was a politically-motivated, tiresome waste of cash, but so too was the Clinton mentality of lying, playing hardball (See Hitchens account of Sydney Blumenthal), lying some more and then trying to absolve oneself from the results of the mountain of dishonesty by crying about the nastiness of the dishonest game he had already mastered.

Spitzer, most clearly, falls into the category of "party that touts morality," as he was a man who set himself up as an "upright" fellow, fighting for the "law," when, in fact, he was immoral, unethical and on the wrong side of the law. Was the investigation that led to his downfall politically motivated? I don't know. And I'm almost prone to say I don't care. He was clearly well in the wrong and therefore cannot hold his hand up and bicker about the circumstances that led to his exposure. Good riddance to him and all the other charlatans.

Oh, and Buff's list isn't complete without your golden boy: John Edwards. I believe he's under investigation right now for misappropriating campaign funds (something the Times all but proved years ago) and a few other slippery dealings. But it all comes out in the wash? His wife wrote a book and went on television, right? And I actually felt sorry for her, before that, of course. Now she's just another part of the American obsession with other people's sex. Kind of boring, if you ask me.

22. ### madanthonywayneMorning in AmericaRegistered Senior Member

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Indeed, it's much better to tout decadence, sin, and vice. That way, you get a free pass. Since Jesus was the only human who is said to have lived a sin free life, I suppose anyone else who favors virtue over vice is a vile hypocrite.

Everyone is human, Tiassa. Even conservatives. To expect perfection of anyone who would even start down the road to virtue is nihilism. Warren Zevon had a song about the quest for perfection:

Ponce de Leon took his cruise
To see that it was all a ruse

(That's why I'm) Looking for the next best thing
Looking for the next best thing
I appreciate the best
But I'm settling for less
'Cause I'm looking for the next best thing

Looking for the next best thing

All alone on the road to perfection
At the inspection booth they tried to discourage me
You can believe what you want--that'll never change it
You'll have to come around eventually

(And you'll be) Looking for the next best thing
Looking for the next best thing
I appreciate the best
But I'm settling for less
'Cause I'm looking for the next best thing

Looking for the next best thing
I'm looking for the next best thing

We're all flawed. So go ahead and enjoy making fun of this guy. Just be glad the media's not there checking up on everything you've ever done. Oh, I know, you're not conservative. So the rules don't apply. But, seriously, have you never failed to live up to your own values? Even once in your life? Has your every action been in accordance with the grand ideals you espose?

23. ### TiassaLet us not launch the boat ...Staff Member

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37,405
My god, you're sick

You know, dude, if you're not going to bother to read and pay attention to what people write, don't be surprised if they wonder whether you're dishonest or just stupid.

Yes, everyone is fucking human, Madanthonywayne. So you know what? Get your fucking political party out of people's bedrooms. Period. Everyone is human. So let them be.

I don't understand why you conservatives have such a problem understanding that simple idea. I mean, you're perfectly happy to point it out when it's, oh, a Democratic AG like Eliot Spitzer, right? So how come it's so hard for you to understand the fact that people are responding to the hypocrisy of identity politics? Oh, right, because it's Republicans.

Oh, cry me a river. And when you're done, try getting a real issue. Or, in other words, to reiterate:

That said, I don't see a whole lot of point in giving Sanford shit over this one.​

Did you miss that, Madanthonywayne? Or was it simply inconvenient to acknowledge that point?

I'm sorry, but the party that won't let people just be human doesn't get to hide behind, "Everyone is human," or, "We're all flawed."

That's one of the advantages of being a nobody in this society. And it's also one of the advantages of not going out of my way to persecute people for having consensual sex.

Get honest and quit whining. For heaven's sake, man, you're embarrassing yourself. Pack up the zeal and put it away for a day when it's relevant. I mean, really, this whole thing about inventing fake issues in lieu of dealing with real ones just reminds everyone that even among politicians, Republicans are still sleazier than the rest.

You know, sir, there's a difference between the average person failing to live up to their own standards, and, an authority figure who would persecute others for the same things he does. Lots of people have affairs, but it's absolutely ridiculous that a bunch of Republican adulterers should have hounded Bill Clinton from here to perdition over it. Lots of people have done cocaine, but it's especially offensive that George W. Bush should see people locked up for snorting a line. Are you capable of understanding that basic difference? Because I'm the college dropout stoner, and you're the freakin' optometrist who finished school. So why the hell can I figure it out? And what the hell is your excuse?

Your petty hatred is sickening, sir. How can you sit in front of this forum and expect people to respect you? I mean, really. What kind of twisted delusion is that?