A box, a choice and a risk.

Quantum Quack said:
Everneo,
would your decision be any different if the risk was so small a normal calculator could not calculte it?

If the odds are less than a trillionth, i might open the box hoping that i and the universe would not have that much 'bad luck' of getting destroyed with such negligible probablity.
 
everneo said:
If the odds are less than a trillionth, i might open the box hoping that i and the universe would not have that much 'bad luck' of getting destroyed with such negligible probablity.

I guess it is all really a matter of values. How important is it to know?
 
"How important is it to know?"

know what? probability? values? Please elaborate.
 
everneo said:
"How important is it to know?"

know what? probability? values? Please elaborate.

Everneo,

I dunno, sometimes I feel that it is the desire that we want more than that which we desire. We sometimes loose sight of what is of value. Does knowledge have enough value that it is worth risking my family and loved ones for?

Is knowledge just a mere commodity that can be traded for the material ?

After posing the thread question , I thought "F*ck this I am just going to go for a walk with my dog and watch a sunset!"

Some times I guess we need to keep what we value in perspective.

I do not need the knowledge of creation to enjoy my life and well If I don't need it then why open the box and risk that enjoyment.

So I am of many minds on the subject.
 
Quantum Quack:

Excellent hypothetical. Great topic!

"with in this box is the knowledge of creation, whom ever shall have this knowledge shall rule the universe but beware there is a small chance that opening the box will immediately destroy all of creation."
Next to the box is the key that opens the lid.
There is no other information, however you have every reason to believe what is said on the lid.

Question:

Do you open the box?
What are the reasons for your decision what ever they may be?

Ultimate knowledge and power is indeed something worth having. I cannot think of something more valuable. But at the same time, I ask this: To what end would this power really be useful for? One could satisfy everything one wants, yes, but cosmic ennui seems a great possibility. Nothing would even be a challenge anymore, nor would there be any aspiration towards a thing.

One_Raven:

3.) If WAS true, then the warning kind of goes without saying. If anyone has the power to rule the Universe, the power to destroy all lies within their grasp.

Good point.

Whitewolf:

One of the reasons I have been thinking about this question is regards to the exploding of the worlds first atomic weapon. I wondered if the scientists new for absolute certainty that the atomic blast would not set off a chain reaction and wipe out the Earths eco system.
I often wonder what must have been going through their minds as the count down approached zero.......
Like
"what if we have just destroyed the planet?" type questions....hmmmm

Funny you should speak about that. They actually thought it a possibility that the extreme heat and pressure would trigger the ignition of the atmosphere.

So everything that was created ceises to exist. And? That's not the most interesting part, to me. What a caterpillar calls the end of the world is called a butterfly by scientists.

Well put.
 
Another question springs forth:
What does ruling the universe really mean any way....she's a bloody big place to rule....assume millions of cultures and what does ruling all that mean.?
[ sounds a bit like a star wars saga continued but even the federation is a small mote in the scale of things.....]
 
Quantum Quack said:
I dunno, sometimes I feel that it is the desire that we want more than that which we desire. We sometimes loose sight of what is of value. Does knowledge have enough value that it is worth risking my family and loved ones for?

Personally i won't risk my family (in this case it is the entire universe) for knowledge especially when the odds are not known.

Is knowledge just a mere commodity that can be traded for the material ?

Depends on how desperate we are in acquiring that knowledge ( here the accompanying power might add to desperation).

Some times I guess we need to keep what we value in perspective.

I agree.

I do not need the knowledge of creation to enjoy my life and well If I don't need it then why open the box and risk that enjoyment.

What about power?
 
"What about Power?"


hmmmmm......if power is absolute is it really power.....[thought comes to mind]

hmmmmm...sorry I'll get my thoughts together and post again.....

definition of power is needed I think.......
 
Quantum Quack said:
Do you open the box?
What are the reasons for your decision what ever they may be?

I would open the box out of sheer curiosity of what's inside.
 
Quantum Quack said:
Do you open the box?
What are the reasons for your decision what ever they may be?


I don't open the box. I have no wish to rule the universe, I'm too inperfect.
I destroy the box, so noone else has the chance to rule.
 
This sounds like a metaphor for scientific knowledge, which gives us powers, but can be dangerous. I would open it.

If the universe can be created once, it can be created again.
 
Quantum Quack said:
You have dug down 100 feet from the floor of an ancient Aztec temple. You find a small box. On the lid of this box is an inscription that reads:

"with in this box is the knowledge of creation, whom ever shall have this knowledge shall rule the universe but beware there is a small chance that opening the box will immediately destroy all of creation."
Next to the box is the key that opens the lid.
There is no other information, however you have every reason to believe what is said on the lid.

Question:

Do you open the box?
What are the reasons for your decision what ever they may be?
No.
I'll light it on fire. That's not opening it, technically, but it's destroying it.
 
Yes, but I see more danger in the "ruling" bit, not the knowledge.
Knowledge by itself does not give the power to rule.
 
QQ said:
There is no other information, however you have every reason to believe what is said on the lid.
The two clauses in this sentence are mutually exclusive - they can't both be true.
 
Some have argued that if the risk is so small then why heed the warning.

The interesting thing is :
At what level does the risk of destroying everything become acceptable?

Obviously if I said that the risk was 50/50 then it might be unacceptable but if I said 1 in a trillion it becomes more acceptable.

So at what level would the risk become acceptable is a reasonable question I feel.

posted by one_raven:
Isn't there a tiny, barely calcuable, fraction of a risk that everything was going to end today, anyway, regadless of whether this box is opened?
It could be argued as One_raven has mentioned that there is always an ongoing risk at all times regardless of the box. Would the risk be deemed as acceptable if the risk was less that the ongoing "normal" or "common" risk.
And would it be acceptable to be the one person responsibile for a negative outcome reagrdless of the risk?
 
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Prince_James said:
Quantum Quack:

Ultimate knowledge and power is indeed something worth having. I cannot think of something more valuable. But at the same time, I ask this: To what end would this power really be useful for? One could satisfy everything one wants, yes, but cosmic ennui seems a great possibility. Nothing would even be a challenge anymore, nor would there be any aspiration towards a thing.

The ultimate power, that comes with ultimate knowledge is I agree an attractive proposition. The question though is about wisdom and how that wisdom is needed to use that ultimate power and knowledge.
How often in books of fiction and film do we see where the quest for power and knowledge becomes self destructive because wisdom has been lacking not only in the quest but in the use.
A crazy Jim Carrey film "Bruce Almighty" is but one fictional example of how a man achieves ultimate power but stuffs up big time because of a lack of wisdom.

An interesting question came to mind:

If you had absolute power over an assumed millions of different cultures would you aspire to democracy...a sort of autocratic democracy, not unlike the UK's monachy?
or would you rule in a totalitarian style?
 
prince james said:
One could satisfy everything one wants, yes, but cosmic ennui seems a great possibility. Nothing would even be a challenge anymore, nor would there be any aspiration towards a thing.
but is this not where widsom comes to the fore?
If you were wise would you not rule in a way that gave you plenty to do?

I would suggest that if you ruled in a totalitarian way cosmic ennui would set in and eventually destroy your rule and possibly everything else.

Contention:
The greatest asset you have is not your power but the creativity of those you rule.

To inspire their creativity would be a valid occupation I think.
In another thread I have contended that freewill is manifested in creativity, as we improvise our way through all lifes situations.

To rule in absolutum would impinge on freewill there fore creativity and if this were the case a lot of effort would be required to maintain that rule. However if the rulers mission was to enhance freewill then less effort would be needed to maintain that rule. [ certainly cheaper and more fun ]

So therefore the freedom of those you rule becomes paramount and in your best interests as a ruler.

Of course this touches on what may be the attributes of God and concepts of Grace and freewill, and how God and freewill can be quite compatible concepts but that is for another thread I guess.

"The Ruler [ God ] provides the stage upon which all life can dance upon"
[ I am sure the above is not at all original]
 
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