Support for belief in Noah's flood, not evidence.

[billvon]

Math being the most plausible one, I guess if life on earth got wiped out by a flood and only 5/6 people survived, could we get to where we are in 4000 or so years?

I was thinking more of the math required to account for all the water.

The earth is a sphere that is approximately 41,807,000 feet in diameter at sea level. If you covered every point on Earth with water, it would need to be a sphere at least 41,865,032 feet in diameter (to cover the highest mountains.) You can calculate the volumes of those two spheres and subtract them. That gives you over a billion cubic miles of water you would need to add to the Earth to cover the tallest mountains. There are only 332 million cubic miles of water on the entire Earth.

So problem one is you would have to claim that over a billion cubic miles of water just appeared from somewhere. Even if you evaporated every bit of every ocean, lake and river on Earth and had it fall as rain, you'd still only have a third of that. (And of course it would run right back into those ocean and lake basins.)

And problem two is that you would then have to claim that, after it fell from somewhere, it all magically disappeared again.

The repopulate the planet from 6 people isn't impossible numerically. If every couple had 6 kids starting at age 20 you could get from 6 people to 8 billion in about 500 years. Needless to say there would be HUGE genetic problems from inbreeding but it's possible in theory.

 

[billvon]

The flood has been recorded thru out history by various civilization and some civilizations have been lost to it.

There's been more than one flood.

 

[davewhite04]

I was thinking more of the math required to account for all the water.

The earth is a sphere that is approximately 41,807,000 feet in diameter at sea level. If you covered every point on Earth with water, it would need to be a sphere at least 41,865,032 feet in diameter (to cover the highest mountains.) You can calculate the volumes of those two spheres and subtract them. That gives you over a billion cubic miles of water you would need to add to the Earth to cover the tallest mountains. There are only 332 million cubic miles of water on the entire Earth.

So problem one is you would have to claim that over a billion cubic miles of water just appeared from somewhere. Even if you evaporated every bit of every ocean, lake and river on Earth and had it fall as rain, you'd still only have a third of that. (And of course it would run right back into those ocean and lake basins.)

And problem two is that you would then have to claim that, after it fell from somewhere, it all magically disappeared again.

Could it of come from under the crust of the earth?

EDIT: How about if all the ice caps melted at once?

 

[DaveC426913]

Could it of come from under the crust of the earth?

How would that work? How would it go away again?

EDIT: How about if all the ice caps melted at once?

How would that raise the water level to above the mountains on top of which that ice sits?

I think you're reaching. How long before you suppose it came from outer space?

 

[davewhite04]

I think you're reaching..

I'm looking into something else and require honest debate to get to the bottom of this.

 

[mathman]

I have seen geological evidence that the Black Sea flood took place around 5500 B.C. and was attributed to a break in the Bosporus, which had been a a dam. https://www.historytoday.com/archive/black-sea-history

 

[zacariah88]

Science deny nothing. Science not a person; science a process. Process say follow the evidence.

Science is a process but our eyes and how we think we still have errors find the real truth and our civilization truth since we started.

 

[davewhite04]

I have seen geological evidence that the Black Sea flood took place around 5500 B.C. and was attributed to a break in the Bosporus, which had been a a dam. https://www.historytoday.com/archive/black-sea-history

Thanks, the biblical flood supposedly took place 2350ishbc. But how a flood can happen is interesting.

 

[billvon]

Could it of come from under the crust of the earth?

You mean, suddenly appear out of the crust via mechanism X and then disappear back into it via separate mechanism Y? I suppose that's possible, but there is zero evidence of that happening, or even of how it would happen.

EDIT: How about if all the ice caps melted at once?

Well, think about it. If the northern ice cap melted the sea level would not change at all. (That ice is floating already.) If all the ice in Antarctica melted, the sea would rise by 216 feet. If all the ice on Greenland melted, the sea would rise another 23 feet. Total rise 239 feet. There are a great many mountains over 20,000 feet tall, and over 95% of the US is over 239 feet in elevation - so the total land here would change very little.

 

[davewhite04]

You mean, suddenly appear out of the crust via mechanism X and then disappear back into it via separate mechanism Y? I suppose that's possible, but there is zero evidence of that happening, or even of how it would happen.

The bible talks of "fountains of the deep". It sounds possible, but there is zero evidence of it happening.

Well, think about it. If the northern ice cap melted the sea level would not change at all. (That ice is floating already.) If all the ice in Antarctica melted, the sea would rise by 216 feet. If all the ice on Greenland melted, the sea would rise another 23 feet. Total rise 239 feet. There are a great many mountains over 20,000 feet tall, and over 95% of the US is over 239 feet in elevation - so the total land here would change very little.

There was a disaster disaster movie about global warning and the melting of the ice caps caused a global flood, this is where I got the idea from, maybe Al Gore documentary.

This is pretty crucial because if there wasn't a worldwide flood then Jesus cannot be who he said he was, plus much of Orthodox Judaism view is flawed. The bible falls apart.

 

[Seattle]

A worldwide flood, as described, isn't even possible. Where would all that water "recede" to?
The erosion that would take place, the sediment that would have been deposited all over the world, the heat that would have been required (and time) to evaporate all that water...the whole thing just isn't realistic.

 

[Sarkus]

A worldwide flood, as described, isn't even possible. Where would all that water "recede" to?

Um? Just take the plug out, surely? Same as your bath... the taps are the rain, the bath tub the earth (note how the water level rises the longer the taps are on, assuming the plug is in). When you've finished, just whip the plug out and shortly thereafter the floor of the tub will be revealed once again! Simples. Don't you know anything? You can be so slow!

 

[Seattle]

Um? Just take the plug out, surely? Same as your bath... the taps are the rain, the bath tub the earth (note how the water level rises the longer the taps are on, assuming the plug is in). When you've finished, just whip the plug out and shortly thereafter the floor of the tub will be revealed once again! Simples. Don't you know anything? You can be so slow!

True. You know how I am...

 

[davewhite04]

A worldwide flood, as described, isn't even possible. Where would all that water "recede" to?

This is the main issue, I've done a bit searching but there is little evidence either way, just aged text books. I've seen arguments for that don't mention where the water comes from and where it receded. There is evidence of a global flood but not mainstream. It's like mainstream simply dismiss it now. I still don't think it's answered. The waters may have erupted from under the crust of the earth, and then start to return after a year or so.

The erosion that would take place, the sediment that would have been deposited all over the world, the heat that would have been required (and time) to evaporate all that water...the whole thing just isn't realistic.

There is evidence of large deposits of sediment.

 

[Seattle]

This is the main issue, I've done a bit searching but there is little evidence either way, just aged text books. I've seen arguments for that don't mention where the water comes from and where it receded. There is evidence of a global flood but not mainstream. It's like mainstream simply dismiss it now. I still don't think it's answered. The waters may have erupted from under the crust of the earth, and then start to return after a year or so.



There is evidence of large deposits of sediment.

Not uniformly everywhere at the same time.

There is also no evidence of waters erupted from under the crust of the Earth (beyond simple ground waters). Nothing like oceans so say nothing of the pressures and temperatures involved.

 

[davewhite04]

Not uniformly everywhere at the same time.

It may not of happened everywhere at once.

There is also no evidence of waters erupted from under the crust of the Earth (beyond simple ground waters).

We give up looking for evidence decades ago and we haven't even explored the vast amount of our oceans, so what makes you think it's not possible?

Nothing like oceans so say nothing of the pressures and temperatures involved.

No idea.

 

[Seattle]

Have you figured out how light was created on the first day and the heavens, moons and stars weren't created until days later? Where does light come from without the stars?

 

[DaveC426913]

This is pretty crucial because if there wasn't a worldwide flood then Jesus cannot be who he said he was, plus much of Orthodox Judaism view is flawed. The bible falls apart.

This is your thesis? This is the part of the Bible you take umbrage with?

 

[billvon]

This is pretty crucial because if there wasn't a worldwide flood then Jesus cannot be who he said he was, plus much of Orthodox Judaism view is flawed. The bible falls apart.

Well, keep in mind that the flood was in the Old Testament, Jesus is in the New Testament.

It's pretty clear that the Bible cannot be taken as literal. (It even contradicts itself in places.) But that does not mean (for example) Jesus or Moses never existed, or the Jews are a myth.

 

[davewhite04]

Have you figured out how light was created on the first day and the heavens, moons and stars weren't created until days later? Where does light come from without the stars?

It could mean God simply created light.