lot of fun to be had taking to the streets. however excepting for france and germany, the other major leaders have turned a blind eye towards the protest movement.
bush doesnt seem to even acknowledge them here in the us. howard has the gall to say that " policy is not made by street demos" (or something to that effect)
blair seems to be as stubborn as ever despite the fact that there is a large anti war sentiment in his country.
i maintain war is inevitable and would like some opinions on what measures should be taken by the peace movement once hostilities break out!

in the states we have a bunch of cowardly fucks in the opposition party that have kowtowed (http://www.sciforums.com/showthread.php?threadid=11917) to bush from the time he was elected. the media does not help either. it appears that resistance is futile in the states.
what about britain, is there a possibility that blair will be forced to resign? is he not despised by the average joe?
i notice brother asguard calling for howards resignation. chances?

what happens to the movement if the war goes well and the iraqi's throw flowers at the soldiers? will they still protest carrying banners (us troops out!). will the movement put pressure to rebuild iraq or forget about em like the afghanis?

Democratic Party is backing Bush’s war (http://www.wsws.org/articles/2002/oct2002/dems-o11.shtml)

If the occupation goes well, I will study Peace no more, and become a Klingon.

But it won't.

Meanwhile, as energy prices go up and the dollar goes down, Members of Congress will stop drawing the window shades when the crowds appear. They will undrstand when the jig is up. On the streets, we'll show them.

The amazing mobilization this week was not around Iraq. It was around the world, and I believe it is the tip of a very pissed-off iceberg.

Bushevik plans are not going to work out. If they persist, me and several million friends of mine are comin' to get 'em:eek:

blair seems to be as stubborn as ever despite the fact that there is a large anti war sentiment in his country.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Then he must know something you don't as he will get the sack if proved wrong!
PS sack = lose his job!

• The now-acknowledged fraudulent document offered by Britain to support Iraqi links to weapons of mass destruction that turned out to be an old thesis by a US student

you mean he knows stuff like this?

prove what wrong? that saddam does not have wmd? i always assumed he did but yet i would not go to war over that
the question here is what are we prepared to do for our govt to be more responsive to our needs? how can we tolerate a leader that wants to fight a war that most do not want?

Originally posted by spookz
lot of fun to be had taking to the streets. however excepting for france and germany, the other major leaders have turned a blind eye towards the protest movement. ...[/url] Well, the least we can do is to manifest our opinion as the world citizens have being doing for ages. If we do not do it, we will not be calling to conscience any political body and events would not go down into the annals of history as they should.
We should always be aware that politicians are not much more then puppets, the ones that are actually moving the string have a power and a mentality far beyond our wildest dreams. Ask your self, why its (as an example) the Trilateral society and other invisible societies full of ex-politicians in their membership roster??
:m:

rather than attributing world events to the subtle machinations of secret societies or imagining vast conspiracies spanning the entire globe, i find it more plausible to follow the money. to be more specific, in the case of the usa, this war seems to be a "get rich" scheme tied in with an re-election campaign

no? yes?

;)

Yes.
"..."get rich" scheme tied in with an re-election campaign"

Amazing there is not higher intelligence, though- The Busheviks are about to make America poorer, and will not get re-elected.

My only problem with my own theory is: Who the hell are we supposed to vote for?

that is hard to do in australia becaus its ILLEGAL

the PARTYS money may come from subsicriptions but its controled by the electral comission, which also gives public funds to party

in the case of howard its really easy, he is ONLY the head of a party and can be removed easerly if they want to

if he doesnt want to lission its time for the back bench to look to there OWN interests and vote costello

Letter to Phil Barresi
Dear Mr Barresi

i have met you a few times when i was at heathmont and when you came to give an australian flag to one of my friends at 3rd ringwood scout group. Every time i met you, you say that if there is anything you can do to contact you

well i find there is, REMOVE HOWARD

see he is no longer a fit PM, a PM represents the people of australia but hes not, infact a direct quote from him says that he will ignore the will of the people as iralivent

now i know it must be hard for you to vote against someone you have surported but a rabid dog MUST be put down

if you wish my vote in the next election you will vote for a new PM, costello would be nice or maybe you know someone better but its time for howard to go

i am intending to put this letter up on a website i help run, www.sciforums.com

altho it is run out of canada it has a large group of australian and victorian members

please do what is right for yourself, your electrate, the country and the world and use your vote to remove howard

Anthony Corrigan
******* Ringwood east, 3135

• The now-acknowledged fraudulent document offered by Britain to support Iraqi links to weapons of mass destruction that turned out to be an old thesis by a US student

you mean he knows stuff like this?
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
No of couse not,that was just put forward for people like you,who have better contacts than any of the govenments in the world,to base what you say on!

:D

why bravo asguard. that is an obvious start! what about acts of civil disobedience? strikes? i am talking about the kind of shit that will get you arrested! refuse to pay your taxes. refuse to do anything until your demands are met.

Those who profess to favor freedom, yet deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground. They want rain without thunder and lightening. They want the ocean without the awful roar of its many waters. This struggle may be a moral one; or it may be a physical one; or it may be both moral and physical; but it must be a struggle. Power concedes nothing without a demand. It never did and it never will. (Frederick Douglass)

disobedience (http://www.actupny.org/documents/CDdocuments/HistoryNV.html)


screw the police approved protest route

i dont pay taxes at the moment cause i dont have an income and its impossable NOT to cause thet basteds take it straight out of ur acount

as for strikes im at school:(

i cant aford to fail this corse cause my parents paid for it:(

but i will be out at every protest i can get to (ie everyone in the city)

Originally posted by odin
No of couse not,that was just put forward for people like you,who have better contacts than any of the govenments in the world,to base what you say on!

what outrageous claims have i been making? what controversial viewpoints have i been espousing? you do realize i said that saddam probably has some wmd capabilities? there are probably numerous violations of un resolution dating back quite a few years that could used as a reason for military intervention. yet i still do not see the need for this shit. the least i demand of my govt is the ability to lie convincingly and not get busted.

plaigarised documents maketh not good evidence!(Psalm 119:195)

odin
have you at any time been in the employment of the oil industry?
i demand an honest answer!

:D

odin
have you at any time been in the employment of the oil industry?
i demand an honest answer!
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
No never!
I have to take what my gov say to be true,as I do not have any way to know what is really going on,as I said T blair will get the sack if he is proved wrong.

Originally posted by Asguard
i dont pay taxes at the moment cause i dont have an income and its impossable NOT to cause thet basteds take it straight out of ur acount

of course i did not mean you as an individual do that stuff. it could get quite dicey by yourself. the key here is the power of numbers.
govts can hardly kill or lock up sizable portions of their population

if they refuse to listen to the people on the street - then move the protests from the weekend to weekdays, walkouts and a general strike will make them listen.

shut down the most important thing to Bush, Blair and Howard - the economy.

shut down the most important thing to Bush, Blair and Howard - the economy.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Why?what info do you have?That makes you right in this matter,please share it with me!
:confused:

well trades hall have already declared that if war breaks out all unionsts, union work sites ect will stop work

NO WAR FOR OIL
------------------------------------------------
Asguard please share your proof for this with me,as I have only seen lose accusations about this.
& America has said it will use the oil money to rebuild Iraq,& then give the Fields over to them.

"America has said it will use the oil money to rebuild Iraq,& then give the Fields over to them"

Those are going to be some big words to eat; let's not forget them.

America has said it will use the oil money to rebuild Iraq,& then give the Fields over to them.

ROFL

US Secretary of State Colin Powell has said that Iraq's oil will be held for the Iraqi people. But on who will get paid to take the oil out of the ground, and where it will go next, he has said nothing.


A recent Deutsche Bank report entitled Baghdad Bazaar: Big Oil in Iraq suggested a potential conflict of interest amongst the permanent members of the United Nations Security Council over the commercial implications of war in Iraq. A regime change in Iraq would benefit US and UK oil companies while a peaceful resolution would benefit oil companies based in Russia, France and China.

These issues are vital to US national interests because the US economy remains an oil junkie in bad need of a fix. Industrialised countries consume almost 50 million barrels of oil each day, with the USA alone accounting for two-fifths of this.

The US Energy Information Administration forecasts that world demand for oil will rise by between 37% and 90% by 2020, depending on the rate of economic growth. The US alone is forecast to need another two to three and a quarter billion barrels a year over the same period.

From this article - http://www.guardian.co.uk/oil/story/0,11319,887456,00.html


How can people dismiss the oil motive as mere conspiracy theories?

The Guardian!
Thats like saying you get the truth about Palestine in Debka!

In a huge wave of demonstrations not seen since the Vietnam War, more than 6 millionpeace protesters took to the streets in 600 towns and cities from Cape Town to Chicago on Saturday.

Bush told reporters that "democracy is a beautiful thing and people are allowed to express their opinion" but that Iraqi President Saddam Hussein is a risk to peace.

"Evidently some in the world don't view Saddam as a risk to peace. I
respectfully disagree," Bush said.

He added: "War is my last choice, but the risk of doing nothing is even a worse option, as far as I'm concerned. I owe it to the American people to secure this country. I will do so."

my hero!

;)


Oh yeah, yeah, yeah,
I'd do anything to be your hero.

Maybe I'm never gonna change the world,
Or split the atom in two,
I know one man can't save the universe,
But girl if I could,
I'd do it for you,
I'd give you anything you asked for,
I'll be your knight in shining armour,
And just like Superman,

I'd move heaven and earth,
In order to save you,
Swim seven seas,
To come to your rescue,
What would it take,
Just let me know,
I'd do anything to be your hero,

I know I may not be invincible,
Or be the world's strongest man,
But baby nothing seems impossible,
With you by my side,
I'll hold back the time,
I'll be your knight in shining armour,
Bright light to guide you into harbour,
And just like Superman

I was just in the car listening to Limbaugh and some of the other Far-right pundits. They are obsessed attacking the anti-war demonstrations. That makes me feel SO GOOD! They are worried!

International A.N.S.W.E.R. (Act Now to Stop War and End Racism) is a front group for the communist Workers World Party. The Workers World Party is, literally, a Stalinist organization. It rose out of a split within the old Socialist Workers Party over the Soviet Union’s 1956 invasion of Hungary — the breakaway Workers World Party was all for the invasion. A.N.S.W.E.R. today unquestioningly supports any despotic regime that lays any claim to socialism, or simply to anti-Americanism. It supported the butchers of Beijing after the slaughter of Tiananmen Square. It supports Saddam and his Baathist torture-state. It supports the last official Stalinist state, North Korea, in the mass starvation of its citizens. It supported Slobodan Milosevic after the massacre at Srebrenica. It supports the mullahs of Iran, and the narco-gangsters of Colombia and the bus-bombers of Hamas.

This is whom the left now marches with. The left marches with the Stalinists. The left marches with those who would maintain in power the leading oppressors of humanity in the world. It marches with, and stands with, and cheers on, people like the speaker at the Washington rally, Imam Musa of the mosque Masjid al-Islam, who declared “the real terrorists have always been the United Snakes of America,” and then led the crowd in the Islamic bombers’ chant “Allahu Akhbar!” It marches with people like the former Black Panther Charles Baron, who said in Washington, “if you’re looking for the axis of evil, look inside the belly of this beast.”

Michael Kelly (http://stacks.msnbc.com/news/862778.asp)

"The Workers World Party is one of the most obnoxious groups on the far Left," says Stephen Zunes, an associate professor of politics at the University of San Francisco who studies the antiwar movement. The WWP exercises influence, Zunes explains, by its sheer energy and resourcefulness. "Historically, you have these groups that are just able to out-organize anybody else. One thing you can say about Marxist/Leninist groups is that at least in the organization stage, they are very efficient." The Workers World Party has simply out-hustled other leftist groups in the work of getting parade permits and organizing big events. According to Zunes, that has created a problem for more moderate antiwar organizations. "It causes division among the non-authoritarian Left groups. They say, 'Do we march at a rally organized by a group like this? I don't feel comfortable with this, but it's the only game in town.'"

But it is not at all clear that other Left groups are truly distressed by the WWP's tactics. In interviews with several representatives of peace-movement groups, most declined to condemn the politics of Brian Becker and his associates. "Good for them for having the wherewithal to call the demonstrations," says Scott Lynch, a spokesman for Peace Action, considered the largest antiwar group in the country. "This is ANSWER's dance, and they get to call the tune." Leslie Cagan, a long-time antiwar activist with the group United for Peace, adds, "We are at a point where it is really, really critical that many, many groups come out and voice their opposition to this war. Some in the hard-core Left have taken the lead on that, and I applaud those groups for that."

http://www.nationalreview.com/10feb03/york021003.asp

http://www.laweekly.com/ink/02/50/news-corn.php

But what about ANSWER itself? Does it want to “smash Zionism”?

For the anti-war cause, ANSWER has assembled a relatively broad coalition under its own banner and is working with even broader coalitions. The organization, at least in this conversation, downplayed extremist views. Becker noted that ANSWER’s coalition includes Jews. And he maintained, “We take no position on Israel. International ANSWER came into being since September 11. It has not tried to take a position on all global issues. What has united us is opposing the Bush program’s drive to war, and its racist attacks on civil rights and civil liberties. We do support the right of self-determination, and that includes the Palestinians.”

Plitnick, of Jewish Voice, stresses the importance of working with ANSWER. “Lerner raised some important points, and they can be dealt with in the spirit of keeping us working together in our common cause,” he said. “There’s considerable work to be done with ANSWER, and our approach is to engage them.”

But what if ANSWER’s soft sell is just spin control — especially given the anti-Israel rhetoric of some speakers at its rallies? Critics, including Marc Cooper, assert that ANSWER and its founders have a long history of anti-Semitism and it would be naive to overlook that. Such critics also worry that the right wing will increasingly exploit ANSWER’s reputation to demonize and deflate the entire peace movement. So the critics feel compelled to demonize their own fringe as a preventive remedy. The risk is that these attempts to shove ANSWER to the sidelines also could provide the right wing with another round of ammunition.

Furor in Frisco (http://www.laweekly.com/ink/03/13/news-blume.php)

rabbi lerner was allegedly refused speaking time at a rally

America has said it will use the oil money to rebuild Iraq,& then give the Fields over to them

If America can ensure that Iraq sells it's oil just to us (anyone for reparations?) then I'm sure the US will be happy to let Iraq maintain the fields. With US help of course.
The sooner Iraq is back on it's feet the sooner we all start making money..

That's what we said the last 3 times.