You have no conception of freewill.

So if I have no freewill...then who is making decisions for me...god?

 

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His idiocy shows again. I don't know and I don't think anyone would consider that proper argumentation. If you can reread the thread without thinking your word is law and that your right all the time even though you don't even know how you got your conclusion (other than getting it from someone else) you will realize this whole time I've been showing why I think certain things. Your infinite ineptitude obviously renders you incapable of understanding it though.

 

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You are just experiencing. I'm not saying you aren't making a decision you idiot. I am saying your decision isn't of its own freewill and is governed by factors. Gosh you are retarded.

 

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It is my perception that 'I' had no 'free will' in being born.

The experience we call life is predicated upon an origin which, as yet, we cannot prove, although theories abound.

Every 'choice' I make is a reaction to an action, all previous experience, which does not logically imply 'free will'.

 

I like that first statement... I'm thinking the very same thing and only in death will I be free.

 

Well, I've come back - and according to you're belief that we have NO free will, then I had no choice but to return. So how does THAT fit with your threat of reporting someone as a troll, eh? Obviously those two statements of yours are at direct odds / incompatible - so, once again, you've but a bullet squarely through your foot !!!! HA-HA-HA!!! I just LOVE it when a silly person shuts themselves down!!

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(And by the way, I've also reported you - for insulting several people here.)

 

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Governed by what factors?

 

Actually they are... I don't see how me making a threat of reporting you as a troll is incompatible with incompatibalism. Again my making that threat was governed by factors Viz me being unable to put up with you guys being trolls IE being angry.
You are retarded.

 

I need not tell you every factor for your idea of freewill is that freewill is not governed.

But it is governed for 1 by emotion. That is not to say in every instance. It's just to show you, that you have no free will.

 

So basically, you have no clue why we don't have freewill...you just know we don't have it.

Deep, you are not.

 

I don't use the word governed, I use the word influenced. I also note there are often competing factors influencing decisions.

I make my selection based on what seems best at the time sometimes in the case of important ones. In the case of less important ones I may do whatever random thing comes to mind, or the one I have not before.

Speaking of choice, do you know any more names to call us besides " idiot " and "retard?" I'm sure you have a broader selection of insulting terminology to use. Come on, flex that vocabulary!

 

Presuming, for arguments sake that we have free will, what happens to the free will of an individual who acquires amnesia? Or Alzheimers?

Just a discussion point....

 

Governed or influenced?

In DBT training we learn the difference between how we think and what we feel...and that there is a balance between the two.

One need not act on strong emotion, I have lots of practice at not acting on very strong emotional impulses.

You are neither your thoughts, your feelings, but rather a synthesis between the two that is greater than the sum of its' parts, a gestalt.

 

Those who meditate seek free will in their attempts to still the mind.

Try it.

Still your mind.

Completely empty of thought.

Should be relatively easy for a species with 'free will'.

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Alzheimer's? goes away.

Amnesia? their previous life is kind of erased, good and bad, but presuming they still have mental faculties that are normal? They can choose what to do still.

Hmm...along those lines I guess you could say free choice is somewhat of a matter of self-control, to my way of thinking...and that we acquire it as we grow up. A baby has no self-control and will cry if it is in distress regardless. I was able to stop crying at 5 because I'd be hit more, but only just. I can now pull myself together on cue seamlessly.

Similarly, someone who's really, really strung out on crack probably has little free will left.

I guess I don't view free will as some sort of removed philosophical concept, but a real-world item.

And yes, stilling one's mind is very hard.

In the last thread on this I said we had the freedom to choose within a framework of the constraints of physical reality. Which includes our brains not naturally being quiet places.

That's why I asked for the precise definition of free will.
Because I think we do choose, but that choice is never uninfluenced by some outside factor.

So I rather suspect this whole argument may be over definitions...but when I asked for definitions the OP flamed me...

 

Demonstrate a choice that is not predicated upon some other action/choice.

All of our choices are reactions to experience and conditioned response, dependent on our way of thinking/rationalizing.

Look back at any time you believe you have exercised 'free will' and contemplate the means by which you made this 'choice'.

Without any other influences.....

Not talking religion or other woo-woo.

It is an interesting exercise in logical thinking.

 

Definitions-words describing words.

A circular equation.

Words cannot adequately define an experience and we all experience 'life' uniquely, precisely because two objects cannot occupy the same space at the same time.

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Resistance begets resistance. The OP came aboard with spurs and you all took off like broncs fed on corn. Take one rein and circle the beast, lol....

I've been playing devil's advocate. Have to get some sleep now. Have fun.

 

I think that's silly a definition simply tells about the meaning of a concept. A definition doesn't touch on life experience.

 

Well, I thought the op was trying for principles, not real-world examples.

But here are argument seems to have been about "Are you influenced by external factors or governed by external factors?"

I say strongly influenced, yes, but you still have possibilities to select.
Therefore free will within limits.

Other people would say that every decision is controlled by the input of external forces acting on us.

Meh, I personally can see the reasonableness of the one I don't hold. The OP was just acting like a douche.

I chose to act like a douche right back, because I felt like it. There are a number of factors strongly influencing that decision.

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