Yellow Rock on Mars!

Discussion in 'General Science & Technology' started by rhw007, Apr 20, 2002.

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  1. rhw007 Registered Senior Member

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    Yellow Rock on Mars!

    Well well well...

    It seems someone is FINALLY noticing that the images they've been releasing as a new and improved public relations 'daily' theme, are ALL in "black-and-white" :

    http://themis.asu.edu/zoom-20020419a.html

    From the above they end their 'Story' with:

    "One thing’s for sure. No one looking at this image could ever think that Mars is a boring place. With all of its bright and dark contrasts, this picture would be perfect for anyone who loves Ansel Adams and his black-and-white photography. "


    Well, I have to disagree and say we are STILL dealing with Monica Mars-In Black n White. The ONLY thing that IS for sure, we cannot REALLY tell what color 'White Rock' is because they didn't release a COLOR picture of it!!!

    C'mon you Pokers in Pasadena and Aereoholes in Arizona, TRUE COLOR!

    If you SAY the thing isn't really white, well what COLOR is it? You didn't even guess!!! If you didn't really know before, and you STILL don't know for sure now, then you just blew that half-a-billion buck-a-roos on one of the reasons for this mission...TRUE COLOR images from Mars. What POKERS!!! I told yas before that Monica was MORE honest and open in her 'Black and White" performance than you have been so far in your anemic Ansel Adams efforts,

    http://communities.msn.com/JPLMarsExploration

    in the Jokey Pokey Liars essay and once more you have PROVEN me right. How? Because you STILL don't know anything more about 'White Rock' on Mars than you did BEFORE this image. You wasted an imaging opportunity to settle a scientific question once and for all. What incompetence! Was it political, or something like the feet-n-meters thing where another half-billion-TAX-buck-a-roos went flying into that red/brown/hot-pink/butterscotch/baby-blue/ghoulish-green/or purple-people eating planet?

    Here's what you said:

    "the bright material is probably made up of volcanic ash or windblown dust instead. "

    Well, which is it? Ash or dust? Ya think a TRUE COLOR image might have helped ya figure it out? Maybe you SHOULD have let the 'little kids' take this mission over, I'm sure one of them has an extra crayon or two to lend ya:

    http://clasdean.la.asu.edu/news/images/msipix

    THEY like to color. Any kids left hanging around out there you could let them have a go at it?

    Here's another comment you made:

    "It looks white, but its apparent brightness arises from the fact that the surrounding material is so dark. "

    Well, like duh! Did you ever stop to think the material might be a bright yellow? How about a light orange, or light blue - maybe light green? It MIGHT even be a bright hussy-hot-pink while the surrounding terrain is a dark-blood-red. How could we tell for sure? And HOW can you say FOR SURE it isn't white? It really really might be. Unless you:

    TAKE A TRUE COLOR IMAGE OF IT ! ! !

    NOBODY can say, FOR SURE, that 'White Rock' is NOT, in fact, white in COLOR.

    C'mon pokers...get with the program and RELEASE the data AS IS, along with the raw I_M_G or MSSS-IMQ data files. There is NO reason to withhold the raw data in embargo from an already publicly released image.period.

    btw: from your own kind posting of THEMIS capabilities

    http://themis.asu.edu/Odyssey_FAQ.pdf

    Image Memory Size:
    25.6 Mb/image @ 9 spectral bands
    15.06 Mb/image @ 9 spectral bands (compressed)
    5.12 Mb/image @ 2 bands
    3.01 Mb/image @ 2 bands (compressed)

    and that was for the infrared only!!! Here's the VISUAL COLOR info:

    Image Memory Size:

    40.72 Mb/image @ 5 bands
    23.95 Mb/image @ 5 bands (compressed)
    8.14 Mb/image @ 1 band
    4.79 Mb/image @ 1 band (compressed)


    We know that TRUE COLOR images are possible to be DIRECTLY transmitted to Earth from the spacecraft without the further need of 'processing' the bands here.

    Why aren't the results you are getting using this methodology being released?

    If there's nothing to hide, WHY hide the data you ARE hiding?

    Once again I must point out that all too often people on YOUR side think those of us on THIS side who criticize do so without appreciation and respect for your efforts. NOT the case at all, we just wish it was done better and more openly; and more shared. If your team is overwhelmed by the amount of data, there are many out here that can accurately and scientifically deal with the raw IMG and MSSS-IMQ files.

    This is already being done with the MER images by Mars Anomalist Keith Laney for NASA Ames.

    http://marsoweb.nas.nasa.gov/landingsites/mer2003/mocs

    click on image numbers for image/links to his work for NASA Ames.

    Release the raw data as well. Why not? If there's nothing to hide, why hide that raw data from an already released image? It makes no sense. period.

    The 'Goddess of Justice' is TRULY still color blind. Would we even notice if she was blushing with embarrassment at being associated with such a lame excuse for 'involving the public' in the great explorative discovery that Mars should be. I wonder what Arthur C. Clarke thinks of your 'colorless' exploits so far?

    Let's taunt a Billionaire to Mars ! ! ! Beats Begging.

    Think out there act down here... NOW ! ! ! Have YOU ??

    Give a High School kid a reason to care...a spacewalk.
    Teach 'em a lesson in teamwork.
    Teach 'em a lesson in humanity.

    Bob... ;-{)

    http://members.tripod.com/rhw007/

    http://communities.msn.com/JPLMarsExploration
     
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  3. Xev Registered Senior Member

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    Help me with a moral dilemna, guys:

    Should I taunt or ignore?

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  5. rhw007 Registered Senior Member

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    taunt...go for it and as the song says:

    Hit me with your best shot.

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    After all, haven't I been taunting all along? Like duh...
     
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  7. Teri Curious Registered Senior Member

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    rhw007

    Is that your car rego number plate on the planet Crazy?

    Xev,
    I don't know what to tell you. I can't bring myself to read his posts, my eyes go cross-eyed if I look at it for too long.
    But he had invited a razzing, so give it a shot.

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  8. rhw007 Registered Senior Member

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    yawn

    Xev,

    I'm falling asleep waiting for your great 'taunt' out here...

    Or maybe the the 'shot glass' is empty?

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  9. goofyfish Analog By Birth, Digital By Design Valued Senior Member

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    jeeeez.. don't you ever have anything new to say?

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  10. rhw007 Registered Senior Member

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    NASAs REAL Job!

    Someone once said about the Face on Mars:
    It is not the job of NASA to give "credibility" to the "Artificiality Hypothesis". They will, in time, provide proof, one way or the other.

    my reply is:
    Actually it is. It most certainly and ABSOLUTELY is the provenance and purpose of NASA to [ give "credibility" to the "Artificiality Hypothesis" ] It's in their charter. And the TIME to provide that PROOF through Sir Arthur C. Clarke's Odyssey spacecraft and the THEMIS camera system is NOW!

    Dr. Philip Christensen has authority and custody over a NATIONAL ASSET that belongs to the TAXPAYERS of the United States. Like President Bush's current custody of the White House, George doesn't have title and deed to the property. Neither does Dr. Christensen. THAT is a very important, valid, and pertinent point all too often, too many 'forget'. Spacecraft are NOT the permanate personal toys of the Principle Investigators anymore than George can tear down a few walls and remodel the White House as he pleases.

    The THEMIS camera on board the Mars Odyssey spacecraft has the ability to acquire TRUE COLOR images of the surface of Mars as it would appear to the human eye, AND additionally, acquire a 9 band infrared spectrum image of that same area at the same time, in real-time. In fact, the April 12/13 (which was it really?) 2002 Cydonia image HAD been acquired by ALL five ( 5 ), repeat ALL 5 ( FIVE ) visable light bands by the sensor of the THEMIS camera. Now, apparently, only ONE (1) of those bands was 'commanded' to be sent to the internal bus on its way to the CPU and on-board RAM storage for transmission to Earth. Which one was it, IF-big IF, that was the case? I sure would like to know WHICH of the single bands was used to produce the April 12/13 Cydonia image release located here:

    http://themis.asu.edu/zoom-20020413a.html

    As a result of finding further information on the technical capabilities of the THEMIS camera at:

    http://mars.jpl.nasa.gov/odyssey/pip/2001MarsOdyssey-PIP2.pdf

    It has become clear that my open challenge to Dr. Christensen:

    http://members.tripod.com/rhw007/open_challenge_to_dr_phil.htm

    may have already occured, except that not ALL of the information acquired at the time ( when was the image acquired ? we'd like to know NASA ) was released to the media and the taxpaying public, nor to those of us who are truly interested in this enigmatic area.

    Here is a PRIME image of the famous D & M pyramid and the Cydonia Face and in further study and homework we learn that a full five color visable image AND a 9 spectrum ifrared image is available ON THE SENSORS at the SAME TIME as this Odyssey space craft is flying over the most interesting landscape on the planet, in near-perfect lighting, and ONLY ONE (1) , repeat ONLY 1 ( ONE ) sensor bank was 'commanded' to be 'read' by the onboard computer???????????????????????

    C'MON ! ! !

    I will only 'presume' that IF, and HOPEFULLY, ALL the bands were commanded to be read, AS IS POSSIBLE, for this image; that the withholding of this information is 'political'. If that is the case, then we should do all we can do to peacefully change this political conundrum. Because if ALL the bands were NOT commanded to be read, then that is one wasted wonderful oppurtunity to really show us all out here the FULL capabilities of this instrument in a landscape that has attracted more of humanity's attention on Mars than any other. THAT would be a shame. Sort of like letting George gut the White House for an indoor baseball field.

    Let's taunt a Billionaire to Mars ! ! ! Beats Begging.

    Think out there act down here... NOW ! ! ! Have YOU ??

    Give a High School kid a reason to care...a spacewalk.
    Teach 'em a lesson in teamwork.
    Teach 'em a lesson in humanity.

    Bob... ;-{)

    http://members.tripod.com/rhw007/

    http://communities.msn.com/JPLMarsExploration
     
  11. wet1 Wanderer Registered Senior Member

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    rhw007

    Why are you so single minded about color pictures? As was brought up at Space.com, the Odyssey is not equipted to give color pictures. This answer was given to there. There are 5 filters and a monochrome camera. Any filter will give you an image, in that frequency only. No amount of combining will give you a true color picture. At best you could get a computer to estimate the color values but that would not be a true color picture. No matter what filter you use, or no filter at all, you will still only come up with a monochrome image.

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    This answer was given to you by a member of that forum, glynebwy, to be exact:
    ***glynebwy's words used by permission***

    for the full thread and what was said:*here*
     
    Last edited: May 3, 2002
  12. Xev Registered Senior Member

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    This conspiricy monger is boring - can't he scream about the Illuminati or the Cthulhu Cult or the Grassy Knoll or somthing?
     
  13. rhw007 Registered Senior Member

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    Hey wet1, you got the WRONG thread for over there where the folks admit they were wrong and the camera IS capable of true color images.

    Try <a href="http://uplink.space.com/2/OpenTopic?q=Y&a=tpc&s=874094803&f=684094803&m=2463051305">This Thread here in SETI section</a> for a more 'illuminated' discussion.

    AND you probably didn't even bother to read the pdf file above where it has the true scientific capabilites spelled out. Maybe you can't understand it?


    Xev, still waiting for your 'best shot'. If the last was it, I've used an 'illuminati' reference so take that stick out of your hair, it might increase the blood flow to your brain which has certainly shown its been lacking sufficient supply.

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  14. Xev Registered Senior Member

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    Stick? Hair? The simple protein sack cannot compose a proper insult.

    Nor do I feel like it. Cthulhu calls - quite literally.

    Oh yes, and Wet1's quote is right - 5 spectral bands is not 'true color' at all, and even if it was, true color images serve little scientific value.

    Other than convincing the public to foot the bill, of course.

    *Yawn*
     
  15. wet1 Wanderer Registered Senior Member

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    8,616
    No rhw007, I got the right thread. Nowhere did they say it gave true color pictures. They said it approximated. No green filter, no true color.
     
  16. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

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    Because if ALL the bands were NOT commanded to be read, then that is one wasted wonderful oppurtunity to really show us all out here the FULL capabilities of this instrument in a landscape that has attracted more of humanity's attention on Mars than any other.

    The landscape of Cydonia attracted my attention for a whole 10 minutes.

    There must be another humanity of which the Q is not aware.
     
  17. Bebelina Feminazi Messiah Valued Senior Member

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    I´m more amused by the picture of Bob and Hillary. Look how she´s smiling at Bob, who looks like he was going to kill her the next second.
     
  18. rhw007 Registered Senior Member

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    xev:
    Oh yes, and Wet1's quote is right - 5 spectral bands is not 'true color' at all, and even if it was, true color images serve little scientific value.


    rhw:
    what a contradiction, you are so so so unsure of yourself that you have to make qualifications, just in case you are wrong, which you recognize you often are.

    THEMIS absolutely and truthfully CAN acquire TRUE color images so that we could see what Mars would look like to the human eye from orbit. And as to the 'scientific value', seems SOMEBODY at NASA seems to think it has scientific merit:

    http://antwrp.gsfc.nasa.gov/apod/ap010417.html

    You Sad Neurotic Intellectual Puppet Puppies need to stop squeezing your heads so hard, it drains all coherent thought right out of that cranium, if there's any left in there.

    I have provided links to REAL scientific data and explanations. You folks have yet to provide even rudimentary remarks worth remembering.

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  19. Xev Registered Senior Member

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    You pathetic excuse for a man, why is this in the science section? You have yet to tell me what scientific value true color images have - you linked to the astronomy picture of the day. The APOD is put out for public relations and teaching purposes, not for the specific scientific community.

    You insult NASA and JPL, expecting legitamate scientists to provide intellectual fodder for your bizzare and delusional theories regarding Cydonia. I have news for you, you atavistic twat, but real scientists deal in real science, not "Fungi from Pluto impregnated my dog"-esqe bullshit.

    We have better things to do than entertain the delusions of a man who, in all probability, regards the Weekly World News as a peer reviewed journal. We have research to conduct, worlds to explore, planets to discover. Ad astra!

    So, take your tin-foil helmet and climb back into whatever slimy hole (parent's basement?) that you came from.
     
  20. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

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    19,125
    I have provided links to REAL scientific data and explanations. You folks have yet to provide even rudimentary remarks worth remembering.

    Could it be that we don't consider you or your conspiracy theories? Could be.

    btw - I was reading the threads over in SDC regarding this topic. You are way out of your league, junior.

    Xev

    I got chills up and down my spine reading your post. More please.
     
  21. rhw007 Registered Senior Member

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    Actually its the pokers in the :

    Jiffy-Pop League (JPL) that are out of their element.

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  22. Xev Registered Senior Member

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    But of course, if the Q wishes me to slap this moronic troll about a bit more.....

    Pokers? Interesting. I see two possibilities arise (no pun intended) from such an 'insult'. Either

    A: You think that is actually an insult, in which case my estimate of your intelligence was seriously off - you are not a moron, but the most cretionous fool that I have seen in some time.

    B: It is a rather Freudian comment - you are concerned over the size of your 'poker' and feel rather insecure. The thought haunts you: Do the men at JPL have bigger 'pokers'?. You lie awake at night, obsessing over this. Having sexual fantasies about the 'Greys' simply adds to this neurosis.

    One might also note that your use of the simile 'popcorn' favors hypothesis B - 'pokers' expanding.

    Most curious.

    However, whatever your motivations are, you remain a babbling fool. Your attempts to insult NASA and the members of this forum have backfired, proving once again that you are a boring Velikowsky-reading excuse for a man. Dr.Christianson's reasons for not responding to you are obvious to anyone with two neurons to string together - he cannot be bothered by a ranting lunatic with the intellectual capacity of string cheese.

    In calling you "a ranting lunatic with the intellectual capacity of string cheese" I wrong string cheese. String cheese could run circles around you, intellectually. Perhaps the mold that forms on string cheese would be your equal.

    It is blatently obvious that you haven't the slightest conception of what legitamate space scientists do (either with their instruments or with their 'pokers') and merely insult what you cannot comprehend. Do us all a favor, and find some other forum to pollute with your bombastic pronouncments.
     
  23. rhw007 Registered Senior Member

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    Xev:
    Dr.Christianson's reasons for not responding to you ...

    rhw:
    You STILL can't get ANYTHING right can you. Not only has Dr. Christensen ( correct spelling btw...something you learn through HOMEWORK and RESEARCH try looking both up in a dictionary...its probably the biggest book on your shelf with the most dust on it ) replied but has stated he wasn't about to release images that were 'inappropriate'. I have been trying my darndest to figure out what could be 'inappropriate' to the general public about Mars. Still can't find out, especially since he won't release the data, and has indicated such directly to me.

    Keep twisting your hair...you're good at it because it is sure twisting everything coming out from underneath it.

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