Would you use torture ?

Yes, but I mean originally. People want to cause evil because evil things have happened to them. Within, originally, all humans are good. There are only evil events. Hitler was a good person, he just happened to have a bad childhood and such.

Fear is the beginning of evil. People fear that others will hurt them, so they defend even before it happens. In the end, that fear turns into hatred, and there was never really anything to fear or hate. Everything is born inside our minds. Not even the outer things can affect us if we can control the inside.

They are being persons. A person is not the real self, it's a mask.

I thought you were completely serious.

No, everyone has Perfectly good reasons to do the things they do. Evil is only on the core, the good is inside.

 

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good and bad are subjective, and pure concept, but people can have negative energy, and posative energy.

some people would seeme vil to others, but the "evil person is just bieng himself and could see nothing wrong with it.


peace

 

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That, sir, is the largest pile of bullshit that's ever been stated on this planet! You may, of course, continue to believe that, but it will be to your detriment and to your misfortune.

But, .....but, ...didn't you originally say that all humans were good? If so, then why should they fear another human in the first place? And even if they did fear them, if they were really good, then why did they attack the other?

You should think a bit more about your beliefs in humans. It would also behoove you to consider that humans are just one other animal on the planet, and keep your beliefs in perspective, instead of using so much human EGO.

Baron Max

 

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Don't be afraid.

It is because people don't know that others are also good. They think there's a difference between the inside and outside, so they create a difference, in their mind.

Because they feared. Their fear made them go away from the good. Without fear, the universe could not exist.

I don't need to, I already know everything, so I never think.

Humans are humans and they are creatures, just like animals are. But humans are not animals.
---
All humans are good BECAUSE they have good reasons to be evil! None of them wanted to be evil in the first place. It just happened. It was not their fault, so they are not evil. Nothing is no ones fault so nothing is evil. People don't know what's up.

 

It's not hypocritical to expect more from governments than people. There is no political justification for revenge, which is the only valid use of torture.

 

Aren't governments made up of people? ...regular, good ol' fashion, ordinary humans? ...just like all the rest of us? Or are you an elitist?

What's "political justification" mean? And again, aren't politicians human like the rest of us?

Baron Max

 

Ooooo......kay!

Baron Max

 

ok then mr rentacop,

wo do i have to worry about?, the FBI busting down my door? wait a second while i go bolt my doors and hide in my nuke bunker,

are you serious?, you think a single post on this forum can convict me in the court of law? you obviously havent heard of a thing called evidence, its a fickle little thing that isnt it, and witnesses? and what about the fact that nobody can prove i actually typd this, and nobody can prove i did anything, as nobody can testify against me wit proof,


i can see the headlines now,

man jailed because of a post on sciforums, there is no actual proof, no witnesses, no evidence, no actual victim to testify anywhere to be seen, but we have him on lock down anyway, without trial, or lawyer,

good work boys,


sillyness,

peace,

 

We limit the power of our government, and rightly so. It can't make me get medical treatment, it can't search my property without consent or cause, there are alot of things it can't do that a private citizen can and I don't want it to torture people in my name. I thought you republicans were for limiting the power and size of government.

 

But I'm a citizen, too! What if I DO want my government to torture suspected criminals and terrorists? Why should "we" have to do it YOUR way and not mine? Why should YOUR ideals be obeyed, but mine tossed to the garbage heap?

Who said anything about repub or demos?

Baron Max

 

We should do it my way and not yours, because "my" way is what we already agreed to in signed treaties, which are as sacred as the constitution and the bill of rights. My way is what we also persuaded other countries to agree to. My way helps protect our soldiers from mistreatment. My way prevents the enemy from having to fight to the death instead of being captured.

I'm not saying that you shouldn't hold that opinion, or try to make it a political reality, that's democracy, but it's not the law at this time. In my opinion, it should never be the law.

 

To save people? No.
Just to harm the prisoner? Yeah, sure, why not?

 

Governments tend to show emergent behavior. They're more than the sum of their parts. They've been able to greatly improve living conditions, take us to the moon and into the cell.

That, and all kinds of made for tv atrocities.

I see beaurcracy as a step beyond just a collection of people or a despotic leader. They seem to have a knack for doing stuff that individuals would have a hard time doing.

But I might be wrong.

 

No, i dont think you are.

You gotta good point there.:m:

 

And perhaps doing things that individuals wouldn't even consider doing!? And worse, "forcing" individuals to do those things that they don't want to do?

Baron Max

 

Well, that might be true ....but they can use the idea of saving people to better explain their actions of torture?

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Baron Max

 

You mean like how we "force" individuals not to rape anyone? And unlike how you want to "force" confessions out of people you think are terrorists?

Many people are like children. You have to force them to do stuff, even though they want to, because it's good for them.

A good parent spanks his kids for bad behavior, a good parent teaches his kids to keep his room clean.

Likewise, a good government punishes citizens for felonies and punishes polluting companies.

 

Ahh, but that's okay with you as long as ye're one of the ones who makes all those determinations of "what's good for them", right?

Only if they're caught!! As freedom-loving people, we're all free to do any and all of those things, and get away with it if we're not caught and convicted in court! So now ...what's this about a "good government"???

Do you know how many unsolved murders there have been in the USA? Do you know how many thefts go unsolved each years in the USA? Etc., etc. Is all of that what you call "good government"?

Baron Max