Will the Universe Run Out Of Energy?

Discussion in 'Astronomy, Exobiology, & Cosmology' started by paddoboy, Mar 31, 2015.

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  1. Kajalamorth The Doctor Registered Senior Member

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    I have a question.
    Would a sapient species be able to survive in a universe such as this? The energy will still be there. Or will it be too spread out to be used for anything?
     
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  3. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    An excellent authoritive reference site gives more detail about the solar system, galaxy Universe and their probable histories at.....
    http://math.ucr.edu/home/baez/timeline.html#future

    extract:

    10*13 years from now - The smallest and longest-lived stars capable of supporting fusion today, red dwarf stars with a mass about 0.08 times that of the Sun, run out of hydrogen.

    10 to 14 years from now - All normal star formation processes cease. The universe settles down with a population of stars consisting of about 55% white dwarfs, 45% brown dwarfs and a small number of neutron stars and black holes. Star formation continues at a very slow rate due to collisions between brown and/or white dwarfs.

    10 to 17 years from now - All currently existing white dwarf stars cool to black dwarfs with a temperature of at most 5 Kelvin.

    10 to 19 years from now - All galaxies "boil off", gradually losing their dead stars to intergalactic space.

    3 × 10 to 22 years from now - All binary brown stars spiral in and collide due to gravitational radiation.

    10 to 23 years from now - All galactic clusters boil off.
    Temperature: 10-13 Kelvin.

    From then on: the Universe expands exponentially and cools down to a temperature of 10-30 Kelvin. All black holes eventually evaporate, and all other forms of matter eventually disperse into individual elementary particles.

    Note: the future sounds pretty boring here, but that's because I've had to omit all the exciting but unpredictable twists due to future discoveries by various forms of intelligent life. We can't really tell what will happen! What you do may have an effect - so be good.
    http://math.ucr.edu/home/baez/timeline.html#future
     
    Last edited: Apr 4, 2015
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  5. dumbest man on earth Real Eyes Realize Real Lies Valued Senior Member

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  7. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    The above full quote after the article proper.....
    Note: the future sounds pretty boring here, but that's because I've had to omit all the exciting but unpredictable twists due to future discoveries by various forms of intelligent life. We can't really tell what will happen! What you do may have an effect - so be good.
    http://math.ucr.edu/home/baez/timeline.html#future

    And as per usual dmoe, your misinterpretation is obvious.....
    The model of the future of the Universe as generally accepted is based on real live data, and is a genuine scientific theory.
    At this time perhaps you need to check on the definition of a scientific theory.
    That theory stands at present as the most likely scenario. No one has said it was certain. Probably [as I have informed you of before] only one theory [Evolution] could be said to be certain, and a few like the BB, SR/GR and Abiogenesis as near certain.
    I do though understand your predicament as one who doesn't accept the BB.
     
  8. dumbest man on earth Real Eyes Realize Real Lies Valued Senior Member

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    ...misinterpretation...??? ...obvious...???

    Would you be so kind as to cite the "misinterpretation" that is so "obvious", paddoboy?
     
  9. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    Sure...Firstly taking it out of context.....and secondly no one said it was "certain" anyway [appears you may have just jumped on the bandwagon on that one] thirdly it's obviously supported by data and is the reason why it is generally accepted as the likely scenario.
     
  10. dumbest man on earth Real Eyes Realize Real Lies Valued Senior Member

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    ...taking what , exactly..."out of context"???

    ...you used the word "certain", paddoboy.
    Neither did I quote John Baez using the word "certain", nor did I use the word "certain" in Post #23...or Post #25.

    paddoboy, you seem to be trying to argue with yourself...

    At any rate...I must ask, once again, would you be so kind as to cite the "misinterpretation" that is so "obvious", paddoboy?
     
  11. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    Let me state it again, in no uncertain terms.....
    The article I presented is based on the accepted assumptions from the data and observations of WMAP and other observations......
    Most is based on the critical density aspect and observed accelerated expansion as I have explained.......
    No one has claimed it is a "certain scientific theory" But it is well supported.
    If and when any new evidence emerges, we may need to reconsider. At this time, that seems unlikely.
    http://map.gsfc.nasa.gov/universe/uni_fate.html
    http://www.universetoday.com/22382/...e-chandra-provides-insights-into-dark-energy/
     
  12. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    I used the word certain in relation to Evolution and near certain in relation to the BB, SR/GR and Abiogenesis.
    I said the scenario discussed in the article is well supported.
    I'll stand by what I have posted in regards to the article in this thread dmoe, 100%, despite the unsupported drivel and opposition from a couple of shall we say, anti science cranks?
     
  13. dumbest man on earth Real Eyes Realize Real Lies Valued Senior Member

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    ...I must ask, once again, would you be so kind as to cite the "misinterpretation" that is so "obvious", paddoboy?
     
  14. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    [1] You took a sentence out of context.
    [2] Inferring the science behind the article was not valid
    [3] No one said it was "certain" only that it is well supported.

    OK, dmoe, knowing you and your record, I do know how fruitless this will end up.
    So let me again say, in line with Caine's article the two links I have given, and Baez's rundown on the scenario, this is the most likely scenario, unless of course you would like to refute the science instead of me. Now that would be a change!

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    Looking forward to your proper refutation.
    Otherwise any nonsense posted, that you are renowned for, will go unanswered.
    Seeya!
     
  15. dumbest man on earth Real Eyes Realize Real Lies Valued Senior Member

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  16. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    The most Interesting thing to come out of this accepted scientific model of the "End of the Universe" is the obvious grounds and knowledge that 20th/21st century cosmology has made.
    Just think, a 100 years ago, we thought the Universe was our galaxy...The MW galaxy was all there was! An Island Universe it was termed.
    Then we discovered the static Universe was not static.......it was expanding!
    The cloudy nebulei structures we saw with 'scopes, were not a part of the MW galaxy, but other more remote galaxies......the CMBR!....the BB model, curvature of spacetime in the presence of mass/energy, synthesis of elements and the working methodology of stars.......the ability to take us back and describe the Universe's birth 13.83 billion years ago, from that first 10-43 seconds after the event, and the ability to forecast the eventual probable fate of the Universe in a big freeze in about 10-23 years from now.
    Amazing awe inspiring stuff to say the least!
     
  17. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    To add to the previous post, in a few hundred billion years [please don't hold me on the time frame

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    ] when our local group of galaxies will be merged into one, the more distant galaxies will have been redshifted beyond the observable Universe, and nothing will be visible outside our system.
    In essence in that period, we will not have anything to point to an expanding Universe as we do now.
    To even imagine that we are at this time capable of predicting such happenings, based on current cosmological knowledge is as I have already said, totally amazing and awe inspiring.

    I wonder how quantum Interactions will influence the scenarios in the last two posts...if they will at all.
     
  18. CHRIS.Q Registered Senior Member

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    Sorry, I made a mistake
     
  19. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    With temperatures just a smidgin above 0 K, I would probably think not.

    My questions arising out of the probable scenario of the heat death, would be.
    What part if any does quantum interactions play?
    And what part would DE component play?
    The most obvious part would logically be since the discovery of the acceleration of the expansion, is securing the present heat death model on firmer footing, while totally discrediting the "Big Crunch" recollapse possibility.
    Other more speculative scenarios speak of an eventual "Big Rip"

    The point is though, that while the heat death, Big Freeze model as mentioned in the article does have logical scientific reason and WMAP data supporting it, all other alternatives [as far as I know] have none at this point in time.
    That is the biggest contribution of DE.
     
    Last edited: Apr 4, 2015
  20. dumbest man on earth Real Eyes Realize Real Lies Valued Senior Member

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    paddoboy, would you please supply evidence to backup your above quoted claims??
     
  21. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    Perhaps DE interactions at the quantum level?
     
  22. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    More data supporting the expansion rate and current accepted model..........
    http://snap.lbl.gov/
    SNAP - the SuperNova Acceleration Probe - is a proposed space observatory designed to measure the expansion of the Universe and to determine the nature of the mysterious Dark Energy that is accelerating this expansion. SNAP is being proposed as part of the Joint Dark Energy Mission (JDEM), which is a cooperative venture between NASA and the U.S. Department of Energy. If selected it will be launched before 2020.

    https://www.cfa.harvard.edu/supernova//HighZ.html
    The High-Z SN Search Team is an international group of astronomers interested in using type Ia supernovae to trace the expansion of the Universe from the present day to 9 billion years in the Past. In 1998, along with another team, the Supernova Cosmology Project, we uncovered evidence that the Universe is accelerating as it expands. To find out more about the Universe and our work, visit our public information area which contains an in-depth description of our work for non-scientists, lots of pretty pictures, and an update of our current work.
    and......
    http://www-supernova.lbl.gov/
     
  23. dumbest man on earth Real Eyes Realize Real Lies Valued Senior Member

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