Will Scott Brown Kill ObamaCare?

Discussion in 'Politics' started by madanthonywayne, Jan 12, 2010.

  1. Norsefire Salam Shalom Salom Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    11,529
    Good deal.

    Right, because UK doctors have steadier hands......?
     
  2. Google AdSense Guest Advertisement



    to hide all adverts.
  3. John99 Banned Banned

    Messages:
    22,046
    That is a good point.
     
  4. Google AdSense Guest Advertisement



    to hide all adverts.
  5. navigator Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    327
  6. Google AdSense Guest Advertisement



    to hide all adverts.
  7. fellowtraveler Banned Banned

    Messages:
    323
    I guess the Democrats lost this one.
     
    Last edited: Jan 20, 2010
  8. madanthonywayne Morning in America Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    12,461
    Looks like some quick, sneaky passage of healthcare before Sen. Brown is seated is off the table:
    Washington (CNN) – A moderate Democratic senator is calling on his colleagues to shelve health care reform legislation until Massachusetts Republican Scott Brown takes his seat in the United States Senate.

    "In many ways the campaign in Massachusetts became a referendum not only on health care reform but also on the openness and integrity of our government process, Sen. Jim Webb of Virginia said in a statement Tuesday after Brown defeated Democrat Martha Coakley in the special election for the late Sen. Edward Kennedy's seat.

    "It is vital that we restore the respect of the American people in our system of government and in our leaders. To that end, I believe it would only be fair and prudent that we suspend further votes on health care legislation until Senator-elect Brown is seated."
    CNN
     
  9. Captain Kremmen All aboard, me Hearties! Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    12,738
    Why did the Democrats choose Coakley?
    This should have been a shoo-in.
    Couldn't they find a "Just Like Ted" candidate?
     
  10. madanthonywayne Morning in America Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    12,461
    She won the primary.
     
  11. D H Some other guy Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    2,257
    Famous last words. Some other famous last words: “As opposed to standing outside Fenway Park? In the cold? Shaking hands?”

    They found a "Just Like Mike" (Michael Dukakis) candidate instead.
     
  12. Captain Kremmen All aboard, me Hearties! Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    12,738
    We had a similar thing happen in the UK. General Election 1990.
    Neil Kinnock was expected to win the Election comfortably, and was shown at a big celebration on his home turf in Wales, enjoying himself.

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!


    (Yes, he was that annoying)

    Meanwhile, his competitor, the honest plucky underdog John Major, was out on the streets, standing on a soapbox, battling for votes.

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!



    Major Won.
    Lesson to be learned. Never take the public for granted.

    He was still a crap Prime Minister though.
     
    Last edited: Jan 20, 2010
  13. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    22,910
    Well the question now is to the Democrats have the balls to execute the so called nuclear option or swallow the Senate version? My guess based on past behaviors is no. They do not have the balls to go nuclear (consititutional option) and neither did the Republicans when they raised the issue in 2005.

    So the question is, is the House willing to swallow the Senate version and my guess is no. But I could be suprised. I don't think anyone ever accusing a politician with having a spine.

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!

     
  14. Baron Max Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    23,053
    You mean to shove the healthcare bill down the throats of the UNWILLING American people? Do it quickly, shove it hard and fast, before the people can do anything to stop it? Geez, Joe, not very nice of you, is it?

    What I want to know is .....why isn't this bill being put to a popular vote by the American people? I mean, everyone keeps saying how great it is, how wonderful it is for the American people, etc. Why not just ask them if they want it?

    Baron Max
     
  15. iceaura Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    30,994
    That's still not true.

    And after having been publicly corrected many times, it's now a deliberate lie.

    Why lie to spin an actual victory? Brown's run would have demonstrated Republican recovery and resurgence

    (he's a confident empty suit, carefully prepared with national talking points and coached to avoid local or technical issues, so it wasn't his own capability powering this)

    even if he had lost in the end. Actual victory is dramatically good news for those nostalgic for 2005.

    Every so often, one of the trogs will pull his head out, blink around in the sun, and discover that republican democracy is a way to have a government, not a way to not have a government. And it always seems to be a shock.

    What people want is Medicare. Everyone agrees - Republican and Democrat, conservative and liberal, the vast majority of the citizenry together - that Medicare is a good idea. And expanding Medicare, or setting up a system similar to Medicare for everyone else, was the first thing taken off the table by Congress and the White House. It was not even considered.
     
    Last edited: Jan 20, 2010
  16. Captain Kremmen All aboard, me Hearties! Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    12,738
    From what I gather, Massacheusetts has a healthcare bill of its own, and doesn't need a National Bill.

    Scott Brown said (roughly)
    "Look guys, you've got this already. This Bill will only raise your taxes.
    What's in it for you? You'll end up paying for the same thing twice over."

    Checkmate. (Worse. It's Fool's Mate.)

    Obama may be very bright, but this contest has shown him to be a second rate tactician.
    If you are an American who wants a universal system of healthcare, this is a disaster.
     
    Last edited: Jan 20, 2010
  17. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    22,910
    Let's do some translation:

    "craming down the throats of the unwilling American people" = passing a law my leader limbaugh the great opposes.

    Let's look at how long it took the Republicans by comparison to pass the largest expansion of entitlements to the benefit of drug companies and insurance companies, the Medicare Prescription Drug Act, it took about 6 months from the time it was introduced in the House to the time it was signed into law. Now contrast that to the time the time spent on healthcare reform.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medicare_Prescription_Drug,_Improvement,_and_Modernization_Act

    There has been nothing quick about healthcare reform. This effort alone has taken up almost a year. That is not quick in my book. We won WWII in 2 years. Show me a limbaugh initiative/law that took as long as healthcare reform. So much for "quick".

    So who is being nice? I'd say the people who are lying to the American people and scaring the American people with lies are the ones who are not being nice or even ethical. But those fighting healthcare reform don't seem to be bothered with little things like ethics.


    Short answer, because that is not the way the founders of this country set up the legislative process. But that being said, I think it is a great idea to have a referendum process whereby American citizens can vote directly on legislation.

    California has a great referendum process. Voters are given a copy of the referendum with pros and cons and an objective assesment of the referendum.
     
    Last edited: Jan 20, 2010
  18. madanthonywayne Morning in America Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    12,461
    Massachusetts has been repeatedly described as such in the media of late. If that description is inaccurate, it can't be off by much. Which state or states is "bluer" than Massachusetts? Also, this is the first time I"ve seen anyone dispute that description. If you have "corrrected" me previously, I didn't see the post. Please point these multiple corrections you're refering to.
    The difference is that the American people are screaming "stop" at the top of their lungs to this particular healthcare package. The public reaction to the medicare expansion was, on the other hand, "ho hum".
     
  19. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    22,910
    Yes the reaction to Medicare Prescription Drug was very ho hum. That is probably because the Democrats were not out there screaming bloody murder and lying to Americans for a solid six months.

    But back to the point, Medicare Prescription drug was introduced into the House and signed into law much faster than Healthcare Reform. And no one, was accused of forcing it down anyones throat despite a midnight vote and extrodinary exceptions made to the voting to get the bill passed...something not yet seen with Healthcare Reform.
     
  20. iceaura Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    30,994
    According to the reality based media, which I recommend as a preventative against retailing corporate Party spin, the State's percentage of registered Dem voters is about average, and four of its last five elected Governors have been Republican - surely among the couple of dozen States with higher percentages of registered Democrats, there are a few with a history of electing Democrats to their most important State office?

    Those would be more blue than Mass, by reasonable labeling.
     
  21. spidergoat Liddle' Dick Tater Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    53,966
    Democrats need to pass health care reform by reconciliation. People are only unhappy at them for not getting things done. This would fix that image. It's all or nothing at this point.
     
  22. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    22,910
    They could pass the Senate version and make modifications to it through the reconcillation process.
     
  23. navigator Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    327
    Your choice of reality based media is only partially right having formed an opinion by ignoring some of the facts. There are many other studies that found 2 out of 3 registered voters in in Mass. were dems, which is no where near average. I would think that puts the truth somewhere between average and 60%+ are dems. Also, all 10 delegates from Mass. to the House of Representatives and both senators from Mass. are dems. It has been that way for some time, until today.
     

Share This Page