Why ISIS is rich (oil only small part of why)

Discussion in 'World Events' started by Billy T, Nov 22, 2015.

  1. CptBork Valued Senior Member

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    Yeah, let's not oppose Russia's blatant intrusion on behalf of a tiny privileged dictatorial minority. Whoever we support would probably be wiped out in a matter of hours anyhow, just like that one time 50 years ago when the CIA sent a mighty army of its most elite washed up Cuban exiles and failed miserably.

    I don't think he/she forgets nearly as much as he/she pretends to. It's all about narrative- remember, you only prosper because you stole all your shit from someone else.
     
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  3. Quantum Quack Life's a tease... Valued Senior Member

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  5. hibatahir Registered Member

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    great noting more to say about this....
     
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  7. sculptor Valued Senior Member

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    If memory serves:
    The problem with the bay of pigs was that we withdrew our support at the last moment. Logistics were a total clusterfuck with the wrong ammunition being supplied to the wrong weapons. When the parties involved had to scramble to put the operation in motion, they were woefully unprepared for the task at hand.

    What happens to our pet rebels when we withdraw our support?
     
  8. CptBork Valued Senior Member

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    Firstly, I don't see much evidence of US support for the rebels to begin with, compared with what all the other regional and international actors are doing there. My prediction is therefore that the rebels wouldn't feel much of a material impact if the US alone were to withdraw its support without affecting the separate activities of Turkey, Qatar, Saudi Arabia, Jordan and Israel.

    Secondly, if the rebels were to go down in defeat, they would be subsequently tortured to death along with their friends and families, and those who survived would be forced to flee to western countries as refugees. Syria, Iraq and Lebanon would become ethnically-cleansed Russo-Shiite colonies and launching pads for the next assault on western allies and secular democratic pluralism in general.

    Thirdly, those rebels aren't our pets. We didn't ask Bashar Assad to go maiming, torturing, barrel bombing and sarin gassing people who politically disagree with him, and we didn't tell Russia and Iran to equip him with the cash and weapons he needs for the job.
     
    Last edited: Nov 26, 2015
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  9. Quantum Quack Life's a tease... Valued Senior Member

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    Good points! IMO

    It is often forgotten that one of the main reasons a despot clings to power, is not so much the desire for power but more the fact that with out it he, his family and any associated will most probably be imprisoned at the least, or slaughtered for crimes committed while in power.
    Assad has committed crimes that he and the world will eventually have to deal with as has ISIL.
    Example scenario:
    ISIL set up their caliphate and manage to repel all actions against it from major players. The 5 years later someone nukes their capital as revenge for decapitating a pilot.
    Opinion:
    Every ISIL insurgent most likely has an Identity file somewhere, every one of them is a marked man and every one of them is fighting more to avoid the consequences of surrender than any pseudo altruistic religious bullshit. Every one of them will be brought to account at some point. (no free ride to hell as they say)
     
  10. Schmelzer Valued Senior Member

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    But now take a look at the times. What is claimed was a 17 sec. violation of Turkish space. This is already far too long for the small distance, says
    http://sputniknews.com/military/20151125/1030699146/questioning-turkey-airspace-story.html One simply computes the claimed distance, and the claimed time, and obtain a speed which is far to small, it would be stall speed.

    But, ok, let's believe the 17 sec. That means, in 5 min you have around 20 times this distance. Look at the map, and try to find out where the planes have been 5 min before, by taking 20 time the distance between the two claimed border crossings. And, then, tell me what would be the point of warning them? They were, from my estimate, not even flying in direction of the border.

    So, what the Turkish side claims is simply inconsistent. They are not only liars, but stupid liars. To lie requires some intellectual abilities: The lies have to be logically consistent, compatible with what is known by physics. If one does not have these abilities, one would better not lie.

    By the way, http://en.farsnews.com/newstext.aspx?nn=13940906000594 explains why Erdogan was so angry with what Putin was doing - bombing the oil tankers of IS. This was his sons business. And he simply hit back.

    And, comment of the day, translated from a Russian blogger: "Yes, I think. Russia has to make an apology to Erdogan. I would propose to write directly on a rocket: "Sorry, Erdogan"."
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2015

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