Who's Afraid of Whom?

Discussion in 'Science & Society' started by Mr. G, Nov 24, 2001.

  1. SeekerOfTruth Unemployed, but Looking Registered Senior Member

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    Re: Re: Whatever works...

    I seem to recall something about a couple of Atomic bombs.... can't quite remember what it was though ...

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  3. Yogamojo Here's lookin' at you...? Registered Senior Member

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    Again...positive progress...

    Again: positive progress, or progress in a beneficial direction. I belive I qualified my post by including this modifier, really none of those instances (Nazi's, the WTC, Nagasaki) involved a benefit for anyone, so they cannot be considered. This is not really a very complicated concept, all it involves is weighing benefit against detriment. And all of the instances cited in your reply were not only detrimental to masses of people, but they are some of the most blatant historical examples of mass death, so who did they help? Where was the progress? These instances (along with several others I can cite) do not warrant further consideration in the court of science or spiritualism since no progress was made along either vector.
    I feel that my point is safe: I'm having surgery this weekend, but I'm not going to a faith-healer, I'm going to my surgeon, but who would sooth the souls of the world's housewives if there were no Yanni or Ms. Cleo? Yuk Yuk!
    Good reply post by the way, Seeker, Thanks!
     
    Last edited: Dec 10, 2001
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  5. Mr. G reality.sys Valued Senior Member

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    But you don't compliment the thought with the understanding that the Manhattan Project was intitiated by a political decision, funded by political decision and executed by political decision. The scientists and the science were the tools of politics, not its master.

    So, you missed the point, too?

    Hey, it happens.
     
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  7. Chagur .Seeker. Registered Senior Member

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    Gee, Mr. G ...

    The scientists and the science were the tools of politics, not its master.

    True, but the scientist 'tools' could opt. out, yet even R.Oppeheimer, for all
    of his reservations, failed to do so.

    Oh well.
     
  8. Mr. G reality.sys Valued Senior Member

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    So, why do you think some of the most brilliant minds on the planet thought the politicians were for once actually right?
     
  9. SeekerOfTruth Unemployed, but Looking Registered Senior Member

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    358
    No, I didn't miss the point. I just don't buy the arguement that politics forced those scientists to create nuclear weapons. It was their own choice. They could have made the choice not to succeed and no one would have known differently for quite some time.

    As to if the political decision to use those weapons was appropriate, yes, I believe it was. But the fact remains that if the scientists had not developed the weapons, they could never have been used. Therefor the scientists were just as guilty as the politicians who made the decisions to use them.
     
  10. Chagur .Seeker. Registered Senior Member

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    Gee, Mr. G ...

    You don't sit on a fence, you hop right on over.

    From: "The scientists and the science were the tools of politics, not its master."

    To: "So, why do you think some of the most brilliant minds on the planet thought the politicians were for once actually right?"

    From poor pawns to complicit brains?

    Whatever it takes to win a point?

    Oh well.
     
  11. Yogamojo Here's lookin' at you...? Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
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    point...

    What baffles me is that I've been agreeing with this "point" except for 1 tiny aspect (from which it seems we've strayed into some political extra which should be saved for another post), and maybe the author of this thread should read again his first post. What have I overlooked? Please include a "point"...oh, and slow down a little for me...
     
  12. Chagur .Seeker. Registered Senior Member

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    2,235
    Yogamojo ...

    I think that the point to be made, at least for me, is that in many
    people's minds there is 'bad' science and 'good' science ... kind of
    like there being 'black' majik and 'white' majik ... and that the 'bad'
    science outweighs the 'good' science.

    AFAIC, I chalk it up to our 'excellent' education system.

    Just thoughts.

    Take care.
     
  13. Mr. G reality.sys Valued Senior Member

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    5,109
    Chagur,

    RE: "The scientists and the science were the tools of politics, not its master."

    RE: "So, why do you think some of the most brilliant minds on the planet thought the politicians were for once actually right?

    Um, ah, um ... I plead temporary inanity. Yeah, that's the ticket: it really wasn't my fault. I've been hanging out in Subcultures way too much. Yeah, that's it.

    There, here. Here, there. There, here. It gets so confusing. I'm so alone, and I just want to be liked...

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    Got me.

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  14. Mr. G reality.sys Valued Senior Member

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    With a little help.
     
  15. wet1 Wanderer Registered Senior Member

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    And the Germans killed the Jews and the Jews killed the Arabs and the Arabs killed the hostages and bad is the news...

    You are a 'nutcase' Mr. G., but I like you any way.

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    I go along with Yogamojo...
     
  16. Mr. G reality.sys Valued Senior Member

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    Now I've heard everything. Relativity is proven beyond any possible doubt.

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  17. Mr. G reality.sys Valued Senior Member

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    Hey, Babelina. Should I take this as Banshee publicly flirting with me??

    I hope Chagur isn't the jealous type.

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  18. Chagur .Seeker. Registered Senior Member

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    Rest easy, Mr. G ...

    Not a jealous bone in my body - particularly when it comes to Bansee

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    Now Bebelina ... that's a different story.

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    Take care.

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  19. Mr. G reality.sys Valued Senior Member

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    Smitten by her giving good color?
     
  20. Chagur .Seeker. Registered Senior Member

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    Damn, Mr. G. ...

    You're a psychic!!!!!

    Take care.

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  21. Mr. G reality.sys Valued Senior Member

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    I knew you were going to say that.
     
  22. Meghan May all beings be happy Registered Senior Member

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    Those who follow the scientific route never discount faith as an outlet. If it were not for someone's dream or view or hope or faith or whatever you want to call it, there would not have been a scientist out there to prove or disprove it. One ties in with the other no matter how you slice it.
     
  23. wet1 Wanderer Registered Senior Member

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