What will we replace religion with?

Discussion in 'Religion' started by Magical Realist, Feb 19, 2014.

  1. Balerion Banned Banned

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    The link doesn't work for me, but very nice find, quinnsong. I wonder what Syne has to say about that.
     
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  3. Syne Sine qua non Valued Senior Member

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    We are talking about adults and scientific studies.


    There you have it folks, Kittamaru admits to being delusional.
     
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  5. Syne Sine qua non Valued Senior Member

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    Putting aside for the moment the fact that people are known to exaggerate desirable qualities such as happiness on dating sites... Yes, but there does not seem to be any comparison of happiness between those in religious and non-religious societies. It is not too surprising that everyone in more secular societies, where there is significantly less opportunity to participate in religious community, are equally well off.

    The problem is that even long-standing secular societies do not seem to offer an alternative benefit. From the dating website's "eDarling research blog":

    Implication:
    Overall, religious individuals are psychologically healthier than non-believers. However, this overall relation occurs only because religious believers are particularly psychologically healthy in religiosity-applauding countries. Given that religiosity continuously declines in most European countries, it seems likely that the psychological health benefits of religiosity will not be evident in the future any more.
    - http://www.science-of-love.org/edar...sychological-health-cross-cultural-comparison (emphasis mine)​

    If the bolded statement is true, then we can expect for secular societies to be less psychologically healthy than religious ones. Let us compare the same countries they did (most and least religious).

    Turkey
    The suicide rate is 4.0 per 100,000 population (TurkStat, suicide statistics, 2010).
    In Turkey, neuropsychiatric disorders are estimated to contribute to 17.0% of the global burden of disease (WHO, 2008).

    Sweden
    The suicide rate for males is 18.1 per 100,000 population and for females is 8.3 per 100,000 population.
    In Sweden, neuropsychiatric disorders are estimated to contribute to 35.6% of the global burden of disease (WHO, 2008).

    - http://www.who.int/mental_health/evidence/atlas/profiles/en/

    Sweden is clearly less mentally healthy than Turkey. So while the benefit of religion may be bolstered by social approval, its benefit is absent in the absence of a prominent religion. IOW, secular society has no substitute that bestows such benefits.
     
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  7. quinnsong Valued Senior Member

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  8. Jan Ardena Valued Senior Member

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    Nope.

    jan.
     
  9. Jan Ardena Valued Senior Member

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    You speak for all atheists when you say ''Atheists don't want......''.

    jan.
     
  10. Jan Ardena Valued Senior Member

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    I think you're missing what the point of ''religion'' and ''scriptures'' are.

    jan.
     
  11. Kittamaru Never cruel nor cowardly... Staff Member

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    Oh, so adults cannot partake in music and drama clubs, barbershop choirs, chess clubs, or the like? No wonder you are such an angry, vindictive person ...

    As to scientific studies, ill post some in due time (lil hard to do from my phone, and truly you arent even close to worth the effort)
     
  12. quinnsong Valued Senior Member

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    Syne's position that ultimately belief in a god is what makes people happier and more well adjusted fails. The back door that he is using does not support his argument. If he were to say that a sense of community, conformity to the whole, goal orientation and friendship in a group setting, all those things that churches provide then I would have no problem with his position. Religion or a god per say is not the reason these people or happier but the methodology that churches and other organizations (secular) use to strengthen our connection to one another. Loners and lonely people who have little or no moral support from friends or family ( which churches do provide) are more likely to be depressed (duh) and it seems the less densely populated regions of this country have higher suicide rates. Most humans need the support of their fellow humans is what I get from Syne's position, nothing more.
     
  13. Kittamaru Never cruel nor cowardly... Staff Member

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    Here you go Syne:

    Book Club good for seniors mental health and acuity.

    Team sports boost mental health

    Social activies good for emotional health

    So... yeah, there you go. Those three took me about five minutes to find.
     
  14. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

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    Yes, it is, because there is nothing else God could have created the universe from, it had to be nothing.
     
  15. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

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    Obviously, especially considering there is nothing else to provide such things.

    You do, obviously.

    There is no better alternative.
     
  16. Syne Sine qua non Valued Senior Member

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    Yeah, because the US is the pinnacle of religious approval, huh? You should notice that our popular culture/media is almost exclusively secular.

    Again, you fail to address the benefits solely from religious belief. If religious attendance were the whole story, I would tend to agree with you.

    Then you should really tell all these secular countries, because from the statistics and studies it does not appear that they have figured it out.
     
  17. Jan Ardena Valued Senior Member

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    Then it's what YOU think, not me.

    jan.
     
  18. quinnsong Valued Senior Member

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    Syne;3176762

    Again, you fail to address the benefits solely from religious belief. If religious attendance were the whole story, I would tend to agree with you.



    Then you should really tell all these secular countries, because from the statistics and studies it does not appear that they have figured it out.




    Denmark is a pretty agnostic and secular country, so maybe you can explain this:

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/10/22/denmark-happiest-country_n_4070761.html
     
  19. Syne Sine qua non Valued Senior Member

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    Denmark is pretty even with the US in terms of mental illness. http://www.who.int/mental_health/evidence/atlas/profiles/en/
    And half of commuting being done by bike would increase the general sense of well-being for any country.

    Therefore it came as little surprise to us discovering that the world’s happiest countries rank at the very first places also in the ECF Cycling Barometer. In other words: the more a country rides, the happier it is. - http://www.ecf.com/news/a-bike-trip-towards-happiness/

    Why cycling can make you a happier person


    Still does not address the benefits of religious belief itself.

    Belief in God or a higher power might not be on the list of prescribed treatments for depression or anxiety but a recent study concludes it can improve outcomes for psychiatric patients. - http://www.nepsy.com/articles/leading-stories/study-belief-in-god-aids-treatment/
     
  20. quinnsong Valued Senior Member

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    Consider it addressed:

    http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/dr-raj-persaud/religion-depression_b_3928675.html
     
  21. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

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    So, we should accept Jesus as our savior because it improves outcomes for psychiatric patients? The depths believers will stoop.
     
  22. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

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    Then, where do you think God acquired the raw materials to create the universe?
     
  23. Kittamaru Never cruel nor cowardly... Staff Member

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    Isn't it obvious, Q? Just like the omnipotent being of your namesake, he simply snapped his fingers and the Universe flared into existence, straight from the mind of the Great Bird of the Galaxy (Bless his soul, may he rest in peace)

    I mean, really... if a fictional TV character can do it, then surely... well... wait, I guess that argument kind of falls flat, huh.
     

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