What is the worst act of the Iranian government towards another nation?

Discussion in 'History' started by S.A.M., Nov 30, 2010.

  1. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    They should be available in the Australian investigations of the incident - at least if the Australian "peacekeepers" have any modicum of decency towards the victims. What did the Australian troops do after they shot the children? What are the "rules of engagement" in such an event? Do they just walk away from the corpses? Do they take the injured for medical aid? Bother to see if anyone is still breathing?
     
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  3. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

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    Since you're the expert on this incident, why don't you tell me the answers to your questions?
     
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  5. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    They walked away from the incident. It was the Afghans who discovered the bodies and supplied medical aid to those who were injured. The troops dragged away the brother for interrogation and released him when it became obvious that he was no insurgent. It was through his efforts and the efforts of the reporters of SBS that any of this was brought to light. Of course if he too had died then he would have joined his family in the anonymity of the victims of Afghanistan/

    The truth is that no one -not the Australians, not the Americans not any one of the troops stationed around Afghanistan - cares for the people or the future of Afghanistan.
     
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  7. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

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    That's The Truth, is it SAM?

    Do you know what SBS is and where it is based? Have a guess.

    Why do you think Australia is keeping troops in Afghanistan? I'm interested to know more of The Truth.
     
  8. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    The SBS is a television station in Australia if I am not mistaken. At least from what I can recall of the news at the time.

    Australia is keeping troops in Afghanistan because it is beneficial to them to support the US
     
  9. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

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    That is correct. In other words, the Australian media has been publicising this story about potential wrongdoing by Australian soldiers. Interesting, no?

    How so? What does Australia get out of it? And from whom?
     
  10. Bells Staff Member

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    You are still to show the majority of Aboriginals who want a separate country.

    I am sure those investigating the crime know the names of those killed. It is not their duty to appease you and publish those names.

    What makes you assume they did not?

    Do you have information to the contrary?
     
  11. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    Not really, what is interesting is that even they do not consider it necessary to name the victims



    Same thing Hamid Karzai does, I would think. Power, money, profit.
     
  12. Bells Staff Member

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    A witness to the incident disagrees with you:

    ZAHER KHAN (Translation): They took me to Tarin Kowt air base. My brother was blown to pieces - he was murdered on the spot. They returned the dead body to us and they released me the next day in the afternoon and they took the injured to the hospital. Well, they took some of the injured to Tarin Kowt air base.. and the others were taken to Mirwais Hospital in Kandahar.


    http://www.rawa.org/temp/runews/2009/03/08/a-survivor-s-tale.html
     
  13. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

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    Do you think the names are important or relevant to the average Australian viewer? What do you think naming all the victims adds to the news reports? Do you think anybody in Australia would know any of the people concerned personally? And if they did, do you think they would need or want the names in news reports?

    As Bells said, I'm sure that the Court Martial will have all the relevant details and background. What the Australian public needs in a news report is the essential facts.

    You're making claims with no back-up, SAM.

    What kind of power does Australia get by keeping troops in Afghanistan? Power over whom?

    As for money, it stands to reason that Australia is losing money by stationing troops in Afghanistan. Supporting a military in a foreign theatre of operation is a massively expensive business. I'm surprised you're not aware of this.

    Who do you think is giving Australia money for staying in Afghanistan?

    And where does the profit come in, exactly?
     
  14. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    Does the Australian press forego the names of Australian victims as well? If it is a generic social attribute to ignore the identity of victims I suppose we could pass it off as a cultural difference
     
  15. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    Thanks, whats the source? It only says "reporter" but does not give the news agency. IIRC, the troops did not collect the dead body at the spot nor did they provide aid to the injured. They tossed the grenades through the windows while dragging off the brother. Is there a deposition of the accused which can be accessed?
     
  16. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

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    There are particular laws in place in Australia regarding the naming of children in the media, regardless of where they come from. The media are restricted in that regard.

    I'm interested, though. Does the Indian press routinely name all of the people its soldiers kill?
     
  17. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    When war crimes are involved to the extent of an investigation? Maybe not all, but they are not invisible and over the course of the investigations, all the names generally come out and they also give the perspective of the victims families. But the Indian press rarely supports the "establishment" - there is too much of the left in India and everyone is the underdog. Even media sources are not spared when it comes to being investigated by the press. Its probably why we have a better picture of global politics or at least, more viewpoints on all sides of the equation.
     
  18. Gustav Banned Banned

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    12,575

    yeah
    all they care about is their own interests and ambitions. for instance the anglos want to make sure no more 9/11's are plotted and planned in afg.....wait...in saudi arabia? they hunt for osama who is hiding in afgh.... wait... in pakistan?


    The leaders of the powerful capitalist nations, which see themselves destined to control the world of states, have never particularly respected foreign sovereignty. They define what they have caused in other countries – or the parties and leaders they have supported – in some cases as “failed states.” With this designation, they write off a bunch of members from their honourable “family of peoples” as state structures and partners of their capitalistic world order that can be taken seriously; at the same time, they push the blame for the disaster of these countries onto the local potentates and their footsoldiers; and leave the devastating collateral damage of their world order and its global economic mode – the raging misery, the neglect of whole peoples and the collapse of whole states – to the television cameras of go-getting reporters and charity groups. With this presupposition, those countries which always keep the whole world in view as a field of deployment for their capital and force become active as soon as they feel the need, and prescribe national reestablishment for a desolate country – “nation building.”.

    Afghanistan is one case; here a successfully promoted anti-communist holy war slipped out of the control of its sponsors; a violent recall was necessary; now the rubble is visited again so that a repeat of the danger is impossible. What the cost will be remains up to the free discretion of the guardians of the world order in each case, just like the decision to define each of the continuously resulting disasters as a challenge to their authority over the world order

    http://www.ruthlesscriticism.com/afghanistan.htm
     
  19. Gustav Banned Banned

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    ja
    a sanctimonious and self righteous imperialist goes on the offensive with simple minded platitudes

    /vomit
     
  20. spidergoat pubic diorama Valued Senior Member

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    Imperialism is the same thing as power. If you cannot project your power around the world to influence events (imperialism), you aren't powerful.
     
  21. Bells Staff Member

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    One of the survivors disagrees with you. Refer to my previous post and quote.

    Here from SBS Dateline, the ones who investigated and which you referred to above:

    Khan’s wife and Amrullah’s wife had remained at the compound the whole time in the wake of the attack. They told him that while he was being dragged away, the Australian soldiers fired bullets and threw grenades inside his brother room. The teenage sister, the eleven-year-old boy and the ten-year-old then died on the veranda of the house of their wounds, while Amrullah and the two babies died after being evacuated by the Australians for treatment.

    -----------------------------------------------------

    So in early January this year, Popal set off to Afghanistan with a small video camera, flying straight into the war-torn southern city of Kandahar.

    There, he met up with Zahir Khan for the first time and with Khan’s five-year-old niece Shuri-noor, the daughter of the late Amrullah. A quiet little thing with big eyes, Shuri-noor was injured by shrapnel that night and was evacuated in a helicopter by the Australians and treated at their base in Tarin Kowt. Popal filmed the long, thick scar that now runs the length of her stomach and Defence sources have since confirmed to Dateline her injuries and treatment.

    ---------------------------------

    Shapero also claims that after admitting they made mistake and taking away the injured to be treated, the Australian soldiers gave her 15 thousand Afghanis, (approximately $US 300) and told her that money was to pay for transport for her to come the hospital later that day.

    ---------------------------------

    Dateline has also learnt that in the days following the attack, Australian soldiers gave $US10,000 to a local government official – a payment apparently intended to be passed on to Zahir Khan as compensation. However, apart from the few hundred dollars given on the night, both Zahir Khan and Shapero say that the family has never received any other compensation for the deaths of their six relatives.

    We asked Defence if they were aware that some local official had apparently pocketed their payment. They replied, acknowledging that a meeting was held with ‘a senior provincial official’ but that ‘for reasons of privacy and security, Defence does not provide individual case details,’ and that they has not been advised of any issue related to the payments.



    http://www.sbs.com.au/dateline/story/about/id/600361/n/Questions-from-Oruzgan-A-Special-Investigation



    So contrary to your personal beliefs, they did not just step over the bodies and walk away without providing any aid. I know that it makes you feel better to believe they did, but they did not.

    The SBS link also provides links to the interviews they discuss in the transcript itself. And remember, these interviews happened before they decided to charge the soldiers involved. I'd suggest you read the interviews and the link from SBS itself. I found it enlightening. You will probably find it entertaining.

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    Ermm no.
     
  22. Bells Staff Member

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    James is correct, the names of child victims is rarely ever stated in the media. In this instance the names are made available by SBS, a very unusual move for them at least.

    Having read through some Indian media sources in my time, I beg to differ. Most are more interested in how they are perceived by VIP's and foreign press than they are in the actual story. You have a better picture that they want to portray to you. One only has to point to the $300billion or something a day Obama trip story that originated in India to to know that your press does not have a better picture or "more viewpoints on all sides of the equation".

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  23. StrawDog disseminated primatemaia Valued Senior Member

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    Regarding the topic, has the No.1 Bogeyman of the world committed any other worst acts towards other nations? Apart from defending itself against US supported Iraq?

    I am struggling to find anything. :m:
     

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