What consitutes human?

Discussion in 'Intelligence & Machines' started by Alpha, Dec 11, 2001.

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  1. Alpha «Visitor» Registered Senior Member

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    Think about it first.
    At what point is an entity human or not human?
     
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  3. Stryder Keeper of "good" ideas. Valued Senior Member

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    I would say if your physically of the Homo sapien specie, then you wouldn't be defined as human. Although you could wonder about Sub-species and evolution/de-evolution.

    A Programmed computer could never be human, it could learn how to mimic a human but never be exactly like us.

    A computer(network) that has the perception of a human mapped to it (his/her lifetime) would have perhaps a "cloned" entity unless the very energies of the individual were used to power the thought processes, leaving no wasted energy or missing thoughts.

    (although the thoughts and memories are stored within the genetics of the brain, but would rapidly become decayed on death)

    If they were to become apart of that machine, you would have to have them understand that for the rest of their days they are housed in a no longer biological system, and there are so many things that people take for granted that they can no longer do and would have to get use to. (sex, using a toliet, washing, drinking, hunger, sleeping)

    That itself would probably mean that a system would need a matrix system for them to exist (A recreation of a world) and this would then bring about a truthful understanding to someone being a "god" like being through a worlds creation, and reincarnation.

    (although I still say that statuettes of "gods" were just Logo-types to take many different teachings and put them under a symbolic body that people could relate to. (A bit like a company logo)
     
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  5. rde Eukaryotic specimen Registered Senior Member

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    To my mind you're human if you've got a DNA-based brain that conforms to human specifications. That's a lousy definition; sorry. What it means is if your brain's human, so are you.

    Of course, this definition is likely to change as technology advances. Eventually, I reckon we'll have to legislate to protect entities that are of human-level intelligence or greater. At that point, any definition of humanity would be pointless.
     
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  7. Rick Valued Senior Member

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    Monkeys,gorilla etc are also having DNA-based brain as far as i know,every brain is DNA based isnt it?so are they all Humans?or i have got it all wrong?
     
  8. rde Eukaryotic specimen Registered Senior Member

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    That's why I added the qualifier 'conforms to human specifications', ie, anyone who has a human brain, a human being someone who's the offspring of other humans. This definition could get really circular, so I'm going to stop now.
     
  9. Chagur .Seeker. Registered Senior Member

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    Hey, all ...

    What happened to the simplest test of all?

    If you breed with it fertile, recognizable offspring result.

    Sure would get rid of a lot of hogwash.

    Take care.

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!

     
  10. Alpha «Visitor» Registered Senior Member

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    If you transferred your consciousness into another human body, you'd still be human right? If you transferred your consciousness into an artificially created human (maybe genetically engineered) you're still human right? But if you transfer your mind into a machine, are you still human?

    What about this: If you get a cybernetic implant that, say, enhances your sight or hearing, you're still human right? What about enhancing your other senses? What if you keep getting cybernetic implants to enhace your body? At what point are you no longer human? When you have more machine than organics?
    Why?
     
  11. rde Eukaryotic specimen Registered Senior Member

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    That's why I said the issue of a definition of humanity will become meaningless. We speak of 'human rights' at the moment because humans are the only entities with whom we can communicate at an intelligent level. If cybernetic implants are used to enhance (or sustain) human cognitive abilites, there's no point in talking about a definition of humanity; there may be other entities worthy of consideration. More specifically, there may be other entities who can complain when mistreated, and do something about it.
     
  12. whatsherface imaginary entity Registered Senior Member

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    But what is it we think is "human"? The more i think about it and check my own programming the more i must suspect i am some sort of AI run amok.
     
  13. kmguru Staff Member

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    What consitutes human?

    Entities in this forum who interact with each other for the next 100,000 years. After that who knows....
     
  14. Rick Valued Senior Member

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    I would say that "Human" definition is same for an upload,isnt it?

    they are same people except that they are in another universe...

    bye!
     
  15. Tyr Registered Member

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    Ok this may seem like a really simple answer, and I'm sorry. I think what defines us as a human is our self-awareness. Other species may be aware of their surroundings, but we are the only species that can take that information and develop an idea or thought about what is going on.
     
  16. ImaHamster2 Registered Senior Member

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    A chimpanzee recognizes it’s reflection in water.
     
  17. Counterbalance Registered Senior Member

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    The point at which an entity uses only perfect reasoning providing perfect solutions is the point at which that entity is something beyond (or less than) human.

    The point at which an entity is never again driven by pro-survival instincts is the point at which that entity is something other than human.

    The point at which an entity has no more questions regarding its own identity and has lost comprehension of why such questions would ever have been important in the first place is the point at which an entity has lost touch with one of the most common purposes for survival known to the human species.

    When a human has lost the ability or desire to sense or manifest all the different aspects of "I", it has become non-human.
     
    Last edited: Feb 1, 2002
  18. Alpha «Visitor» Registered Senior Member

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    What about aliens? Intelligent aliens would have some of those abilities, yet they would not be considered human....
     
  19. Stryder Keeper of "good" ideas. Valued Senior Member

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    I could have been really finnicky on this subject, I could have stated.

    Human is a Species.

    If you as a Human were mapped into a computer, then you would be an "Assimulated of a Human" a simulation Facsimile.

    If you were to move your consciousness across to a clone, you are a "Cloned Assimulation of a Human".

    If your clone was "Human" in build, then you would be a "Human with a Cloned Consciousness".

    Thats pretty much my understanding, As for if you have implants. Your still human but depending on what sort of implant you have would term you. i.e.
    a Whole limb = Cyborg,
    an inplant to enhance sight = Cybernaut,
    A human consciousness in a robot = Android,
    A human consciousness in a computer = a Simulated Human consciousness (Ghost in the Shell)
     
  20. Rick Valued Senior Member

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    Hey Stryder,

    Human is Genus isnt it?

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    ...
    the neanderthal Man was also Human,only that species was different.(I think so,could be wrong)And he was called Homo Sapiens Neanderthelis...



    bye!
     
  21. ismu ::phenomenon::. Registered Senior Member

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    Intelligence and kindness!

    What constitutes human is Intelegence and Kindness. Self-awareness and self-awareness is only a result of tought. Thought itself driven by intelligence.

    Beside Intelligence there are also sign of human, and also other thingking living creature: Passion/Desire and Instink/Nature.

    Check out this thread

    Suppose someday in the future we can build robot with sufficient Intelligence and kindness, no wonder if someone says to the robot: "You are more human than real human!"
     
  22. Rick Valued Senior Member

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    Monkeys also are intelligent,does that point to anything Human?...well i dont think so.The only thing special about Humans is that they are most evolved Genus on the planet.and most Evolved Species.I also would consider Snakes evolved.there is nothing special about humans.they Belong to Kingdom Animalia.had it been that other animal would have evolved better than Humans,then they would have also argued about their specialities...

    A Robot with intelligence of a human(Like downloaded from an upload)Will be an Android,not Human,as he is not the biological product.Clones on the other hand are a result of biological manipulation,hence they"ll be known as Humans only...


    bye!
     
  23. ismu ::phenomenon::. Registered Senior Member

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    ape are dumb

    Apes not intelligent at all. Chimp, the most 'intelligent' creatures before human, are only "monkey see monkey do". Their intelligence in not part of their 'destiny'. If you train a chimp until he smart enough, then you let go in the woods, It's kid can't have it's knowldge. They don't have absoult intelligence.

    Like i've posted somewhere... There are several elements drives creatures action:

    1)Nature law.
    2)Instink.
    3)Passion.
    4)Intelligence.

    Viruses, bacteria and plants lives based on natural law. Simple mobile creatures such as insect, which don't have centralized brain --only spreaded neural system--, act based on their instink AND natural law. Animal who have centralized brain have passion, instink, and still follow natural law. They can 'want' something, or 'fear' of something. But they don't have intuition and/or ideas. They don't know what are 'right', 'wrong', 'shy' and 'mercy' -- unless it's part of it's instink, such as mercy to thir baby. Any research using chimp to do something is only use it's passion to drive it's action, such as to get bait. Goat f*ck his own mom. It's right animal, but wrong for human.

    Human have all of those thing. We can use the intelligence to controll 3 other things. Results of usefull intelegence are self-awarenes, decide 'right' or 'wrong' --in wide aspect--, idea and intuition.
    Since passion the most complex element before intelligence, someone might loose control of it. A very evil criminal who seems only follow his passion without ability to use his intellegence, can be considered as animal, even his species is still human. The humanity is ability to use their intelligence to control theirself. So... the conclusion of 'what is constitutes human' is Intelligent and kindness.

    If we'll gonna buld a robot with humanity, don't forget to put those things. We can use random value to simulate 'intuition', assumption, or idea to be decided in it's intelligence.
     
    Last edited: Feb 15, 2002
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