What are Ghost/spirits made of?

Discussion in 'UFOs, Ghosts and Monsters' started by JordanTredray, Sep 22, 2017.

  1. timojin Valued Senior Member

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    good for you, get some of it so it can be reproduced, So how can you reproduce since you can not get ahold of it nor have equipment that can be analysed
     
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  3. Michael 345 Valued Senior Member

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    What part of "equipment CAN measure Dark Matters effects on surrounding visible matter" do you have trouble with?
    Also various other labs and different equipment can duplicate the observations and make predictions as to other effects Dark Matter would cause
    And THOSE predictions have been found to occur

    Can you provide ANY paranormal activity in any field which has consistently produced repeatable results?

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  5. timojin Valued Senior Member

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    Please name the equipment and let us discuss the evaluation. Beside what is Dark Energy and what is Dark matter, would you please describe in your own words, without running into google.
    Can you tell what work Dark Energy can produce ? What wavelength does Dark matter absorbs .
     
    Last edited: Sep 25, 2017
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  7. Michael 345 Valued Senior Member

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    After you sir
     
  8. exchemist Valued Senior Member

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    Telescopes.

    Your other questions are irrelevant to the point at issue. Dark matter was only hypothesised in the first place because of reproducible observations of galactic rotational speeds, which do not fit the estimates of galactic mass one gets from looking at the stars they contain. So the reproducible observation came first and the hypothesis followed.

    With ghosts there is no reproducible evidence at all.
     
  9. Michael 345 Valued Senior Member

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    Thank you sir. You are more charitable than I am. I guess I am feed up with waiting for answers which never appear

    (Can you provide ANY paranormal activity in any field which has consistently produced repeatable results?)

    before being asked for MY evidence (which is obviously not mine) and to produce said evidence from the depths of my puddle shallow knowledge (I can't look anything up???)

    As far as I can determine this thread has reached zero potential as far as learning anything useful

    I might keep it in the attic but in truth my 3 neurone brain Huey Dewey and Louie are bored so for myself it might not see the light of day again anytime soon

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  10. exchemist Valued Senior Member

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    Obviously not. That's why these ideas are stuck in the box labelled "paranormal". If there were reproducible evidence, these alleged phenomena would rapidly get studied and some classification and understanding would emerge, at which point they would become part of "normal".

    But then they would also lose their air of mystery, which I feel sure is psychologically or aesthetically important to those who promote them. So actually their proponents have no interest in such a process of demystification. It quite suits them to leave things as they are, so that they can use this as a stick to beat "closed-minded" scientists with.
     
  11. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    and sell books.
     
  12. birch Valued Senior Member

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    what you miss is that not all phenomena can be repeated or reproducible. it's also because science doesn't understand all the variables involved in such phenomena, yet. you are putting the onus on unrealism just as well. you are also speaking about something which you don't even care to understand.
     
  13. birch Valued Senior Member

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    as if you know this for sure and know how reality works on all levels and in all possible ways. lol
     
  14. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    Are you saying people interested in ghosts and spirits do not write and sell books? Because that is quite demonstrably false.
     
  15. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    I assure you, he is not missing that.

    But I'd say you are using it as a special pleading: "we can't reproduce these things, so we should cut them some slack and just have faith".

    This is still fallacious. If he/we were not interested in understanding it, he/we wouldn't be following it.

    Being interested in understanding something doesn't mean you throw your skepticism out the window and accept everything that comes along.
     
  16. exchemist Valued Senior Member

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    .....And not all "phenomena" are part of science. There is a whole realm of subjective experience that science cannot deal with. I don't in fact have a problem with aesthetic or spiritual experiences, but I do not try to use the toolkits of science when I contemplate them and I do not treat them as part of the physical world, which is what those toolkits are designed for.

    But I do remain highly sceptical about superstitious ideas that try to conflate the two realms of experience.
     
  17. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    And this is a science board.

    Birch, do you ever wonder why those who want to discuss UFOs and ghosts don't go to UFO and ghost sites to do it? But instead come here?
     
  18. birch Valued Senior Member

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    4,100
    again, you are so convinced of your worldview as if you can speak for all of reality.

    this is where you misunderstand and can't or won't apply variables outside of a certain box.

    just as nature doesn't reproduce you exactly, paranormal phenomena has so many variables from time/place, people involved, their internal or emotional state etc that it is difficult to reproduce because it happens naturally. even poltergeists, which is a good example usually occurs unders stress, often extreme such as an environment which can be intense emotions or thoughts. this indicates that the mind is producing these entities as shadows or refuse which takes on a life of it's own. the implication is that people don't just physically give off thoughts, emotions in neat little conventional packages but it can manifest in extreme situations in aberrant ways.
     
  19. birch Valued Senior Member

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    yes, we are doing you a favor to stretch your thinking. lol
     
  20. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    I don't know why you say this.
    I am not convinced of any worldview, and I do not speak for all reality.

    The nature of skepticism is: "Convince me. Elsewise I have no reason to believe. But show me and I'll alter my view".

    That's all anyone is saying.
     
  21. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    As we, you.

    So why complain?
     
  22. Kittamaru Now nearly 40 pounds lighter. Staff Member

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    See... this is kind of the thing, though. These paranormal things, especially ones such as poltergeists, most often seem to occur when the person experiencing them is under some form of stressor... and then cannot be duplicated. This would seem, to me, to indicate that they are, more than likely, a trick of the mind, attempting to make sense of a stressful situation (which can easily lead to a sensory overload).

    Show me any evidence that a person is capable of manifesting anything physical via emotional output alone. I would wager that, even if you were to put people into positively abhorrent situations to stress them out (such as forcing them to slowly murder their loved ones, as an extreme example), you would never get a "paranormal" reading from the room.
     
  23. sweetpea Registered Senior Member

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    770
    My god! I understand the point your making Kitts, but where did that scenario come from? I going to have to change my view of you.

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