Weird lights spotted over San Diego

Discussion in 'The Cesspool' started by Magical Realist, May 1, 2015.

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  1. Randwolf Ignorance killed the cat Valued Senior Member

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    And another one crawls from the woodwork...
     
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  3. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    So it wasn't a foggy night as the article claimed. Or it was foggy, but somewhere else, not where the photographer was and not where the antennae was. And so that distant fog that was somewhere else and certainly not around the antennae on the mountain magically made the lights brighter than they normally would be. lol! This is getting rich..

    I see, so the fog below, which wasn't being looked thru, and the moisture above, which was being looked thru, "amplified" the lights to be brighter than they normally would be. I don't think so.

    I've never heard of moisture, which isn't fog, making lights brighter.

    I'll have to get out my telescope and look at the stars the next foggy night that comes. Maybe I'll see Saturn's rings! lol!
     
    Last edited: May 9, 2015
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  5. Kristoffer Giant Hyrax Valued Senior Member

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    What's rich is your constant 'nope, I won't listen to rational explanations, I prefer the most unlikely scenario'.
     
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  7. debra Registered Member

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    dear randwolf lol

    im far from crazy .... if I come to a forum about aliens and write something ...that means it is VERY much a reality. prove me prove me prove me ...we cant always get what we want hm? in time.
     
  8. Kittamaru Ashes to ashes, dust to dust. Adieu, Sciforums. Valued Senior Member

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    Actually, on a science board, when one claims "prove it", they are entitled to just that

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  9. Randwolf Ignorance killed the cat Valued Senior Member

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    That remains to be demonstatrated.

    Perhaps in your mind. The rest of us would like some objective proof. I personally believe other sentient life is likely to exist in the universe. I'm ambivalent as to whether said intelligence could, has or is visiting this little backwater planet we call "Earth".

    The onus is on you sweetheart.

    Good song.
     
  10. Bells Staff Member

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    You are making even less sense than usual.

    I take it basic trigonometry is a foreign concept to you?

    Haven't you ever noticed how sometimes the air above fog is very clear?

    And reducing light pollution, which if there was fog, definitely would reduce it, does make things in the sky and at a distance look brighter. You have never looked up outside during a blackout?

    It's actually an optical phenomenon caused by ice crystals in the atmosphere.

    Wow, science wasn't a big subject at school for you, was it?

    On a foggy night, go up a hill, above the fog and look at the stars. You will see they are much brighter without the light pollution, which the fog will dampen down. Or better yet, take a drive out to the countryside, where there is much less light pollution and look up and around you and you will see how lights in the distance look magnified and the stars are much brighter and you will see more stars and more distant light objects, because there is much less light pollution around you.

    Do you know what light pollution is and how it affects what you see in the sky and how you view distant objects at night? Do you understand how light pollution can actually mask lights off in the distance? Do you understand the role weather plays in how well and clearly you see distant objects?

    The image you provided, the sky looked very dark, which means there was much less light pollution as there would normally be over a city like San Diego. Which would be why more distant objects would appear brighter, and especially if there was a lot of moisture in the air.
     
  11. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    Sorry...but I stand by my thesis that fog doesn't make lights brighter. In this case, the fog, if there even was any, merely blocked lower level lights on the mountain creating the illusion that the antennae facility was suspended in the air. That's all the fog did. There was no brightening of the lights due to the fog. That's just nonsense...
     
  12. Daecon Kiwi fruit Valued Senior Member

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    Considering that you've demonstrated time and time again that you're willfully ignorant of science, your "thesis" is worth crap.
     
  13. Bells Staff Member

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    So you still do not understand what light pollution does and how it affects your ability to view distant objects...?

    With the fog blanketing out the usual light pollution, any objects above that fog line will look or appear brighter, and people notice them more. Which would explain why so many people suddenly now noticed the lights on that hilltop. And if the air above the fog is cool enough for small ice crystals to form, the lights would reflect off those little ice crystals, making them appear even brighter. Where you would normally have a sky that is bright from light pollution, you suddenly have a black as black night, with very little light pollution and people are suddenly able to view distant shining and flashing objects. How can they see them? Those lights appear brighter because of a literal trick on the eyes and they also appear brighter because they are not competing with the usual light pollution that would otherwise compete with them so strongly, that people would not really be able to see them.

    Do you understand now? The fog is not making the lights brighter. The fog makes the lights appear brighter because it will have reduced the amount of air pollution that would otherwise detract from the view.

    I am surprised that I am having to explain this very simple concept to you.

    Do you never go outside at night or have never looked at a dark sky without light pollution before?

    Okay..

    Here is a photo of Hong Kong with light pollution:

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    As you can see, you cannot see far and any distant lights virtually disappear because the light pollution closer to the person taking the photo is so bright, you can barely make out distant objects.. You can't even see any mountains behind any of those buildings. The light pollution is that bad, that it blocks your actual view.

    And this is what would happen if you removed the light pollution:

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    Do you see how much further you can see and how you can even see the mountains on the other side? So if there was a pall of fog over Hong Kong, which blanked out all that light pollution, and you were above the fog line, say up a mountain, you would suddenly notice and see lights that were on those distant hills that would normally be wiped out by that light pollution.

    Do you understand now?

    Let's use the Hong Kong image as an example. Say you are used to that level of light pollution, every night. And then one night, fog rolls in and it blankets out that light pollution and all of a sudden, you notice lights across the harbor on top of some of the mountains, lights you have never seen before because the light pollution right in front of you and around you was so bright, it doesn't make that distant light a UFO. It just means there is too much light pollution where you live.

    And if you don't believe me about fog blanketing out light pollution? Check this out. This is what you see if you are above the fog line at night:

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    And Shainblum takes a lot of photos of the night sky in California and he does so by leaving the light pollution behind.

    If that cover of fog/cloud was not there, you would not be able to see the sky that well and you certainly would not have seen the more distant lights from towns, etc, in the far distance.
     
  14. billvon Valued Senior Member

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    Blocking the lower level lights made the lights on the mountain RELATIVELY brighter. Both your eye and modern cameras respond to RELATIVE, not absolute, levels of light. That's why you can't see the stars in the daytime, even though they are just as bright as they are at night.
     
  15. zgmc Registered Senior Member

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    Its odd that the power lines that are visible in the first photo are not in the second photo.
     
  16. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    LOL! So much effort to prove an irrelevant point. As we can see from the picture of the antennae in San Diego, fog wasn't covering all of the city. Just the portion below the antennae. So there would still be light pollution in the air. Just as there always is over cities at night.
     
  17. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    I can still see the city lights below the antennae. So there is no "relative" brightening of the lights.
     
  18. Kristoffer Giant Hyrax Valued Senior Member

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    Denial's a bitch.
     
  19. Daecon Kiwi fruit Valued Senior Member

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    No, denial's a troll.
     
  20. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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  21. billvon Valued Senior Member

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    They are attenuated, just as the stars are attenuated during the day. (Unless you see stars all the time during the day! LOL! LOL! LOL!)
     
  22. Bells Staff Member

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    That is because in one, they are standing closer to the fence and slightly more right of the frame. And in the daytime photo, the photographer is a bit further back and a bit more to the left of the frame.

    Which means that in the night photo, the photographer had the power lines either directly above them and out of the shot.

    So you admit the lights were from the antennae.

    The fog over the portion below the antennae blocked out the vast mounts of light pollution, allowing the person who took the photograph to actually see the distant lights of those antennae.

    You just proved my point. The light pollution from other parts that were not fogged in, were far enough away to not affect the parts that were fogged in. In short, the fog was clearly spread out enough over that portion of the city to dampen down the lights to allow more distant objects to be seen.

    Yes, but they are not as bright as they normally would be, therefore because they are very dim or thinned out by the fog, those standing further back and out of the fog or above it will still have a clearer view of what lies beyond the light pollution, such as the lights of those antennae.

    Since you have already admitted the lights were from the antennae, I cannot see the point of your still trying to argue.
     
  23. Kristoffer Giant Hyrax Valued Senior Member

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    Why not lock or cesspool this thread? The "mysterious" lights have been explained, so is there anything to discuss?
     
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