you people should watch the news, I know you guys arent wathing enough news coverage becouse all these things ive talked about would be more clear to you . like korea, you would know that they are a great threat. they have nothing to do with saddam or the al qaeda but are a seperete threat. you would know why they are a threat if you watched the news, not loval news, but CNN or MSNBC, or FOX news Channel
Considering that the #2 guy in Al Qaeda was captured with information that paid a $27 million reward, you don’t think we could go after them faster by diverting the $100 billion we’ll spend on Iraq to the Al Qaeda fight?
it will cost much more than that to ge al qaeda, besides, we will never be able to stop al qaeda unles we convince them that what they ar doing is wrong. they believe it in their religion that americans need to die.
Sounds like we’re dead anyway then. Might as well leave Iraq alone and spend the money to enjoy our last days. I’m more optimistic. If the #2 guy can be sold out, so can they all. It’s not about religion beyond the suicide bombers. It’s money & power, same as Bush’s reason for Iraq.
Anerica does not have the support from the rest of the world like we should have. So America has to eliminate one threat at a time. Right now Saddam is a big threat and he has to be eliminated.
Re: Why does this argument ignore the most basic issue of war? No, Al Qaeda. Who isn’t? That’s thousands of people. Bin Laden is the black sheep. And American money financed the Oklahoma City bombing. The bombers were American citizens. Why didn’t we attack ourselves? We’d attack Saudi Arabia anyway if there’d be something to gain. But it’d be a net loss; the Muslims would go haywire en masse because Mecca, their religion’s capital, is there.
neville Getting back to the original post "what is the worst case scenario": You will be drafted , you will be killed.
Out of the mouth of babes... Jak719, your old enough to join the Marines. Go ahead buddy! Sign up. Get one of those M-16's and start ta shootin' Tex! Make good ol' uncle sammy proud, boy! We need a few good men like youse dying for the american oil company way of life! Go get 'em tiger! {Oh, yes and by the way, I did my time in the Oil Company Army - it's your turn now.} Go on and take a bullet for your good old uncle Sammy.
I guess you've got some growing up to do. That of the people, by the people and for the people have not a thing to do with you fore you are not the "people" this refers to. The "people" this talks about have a few billion dollars in the bank and could care less about you.
A Mister Moderator, Where in the world did you find these people? Was the Jerry Springer show all filled up that day so you invited them here? People, I suggest when you go home, check your TV's and Radios for that subliminal messge machine the CIA so cleary attached to them. Sad, sad, sad...
Re: Re: Why does this argument ignore the most basic issue of war? Oh don’t tell me you’re falling for that crap. That’s like saying Costa Rica was never occupied by the US, it was under the benevolent management of the United Fruit Company. This is what governments do. They set up front organizations to do their dirty work. Ours does the same thing. That’s what happens when people let their governments become too powerful. Power corrupts. Oh sure, that’s what they say now that he’s been made. You’re really falling for this crap. Front men. Front organizations. Their purpose is to keep the government that set them up in the clear, even if they themselves get caught. I’d be curious to know whether anyone, anywhere, ever, in any language, read anything about Osama being blackballed by the family before we finally figured out he was the project manager of 9-11. The Saudi government still gets to masquerade as our dear pals. From the beginning that was clearly a far smaller operation that didn’t stretch anybody’s credibility to think it might just be the work of a couple of one-percenters. None of the evidence pointed outside our shores, where the investigation could have been hampered by uncooperative people or duplicitous governments, and despite great effort to pin this on Muslim terrorists, the investigation couldn’t come up with any evidence to that effect. I suppose you could say it was a government conspiracy to conceal the truth, but that’s my line and even I don’t believe it. I doubt that you do either. As for attacking ourselves, well, come to think of it, after McVeigh was convicted there was a wholesale defection of membership from the militia movement that was in vogue at the time. That was supposed to be our first line of defense against a corrupt government run rampant that might use an excuse, such as a war in the Mideast that never really needed to happen, to totally suspend the Constitution and complete its transformation from democracy into despotism. Gee, and we actually are going to have a war in the Mideast, and the militias really don’t have enough power to stand up to a corrupt government any more, we’re all just sitting ducks waiting for Uncle Sam to save our butts and we’ll surrender any rights they want in exchange for safety... Hmm. Maybe that conspiracy thing was right after all! No more haywire than they’re going to go as it is. If I were an ordinary man-in-the-street in one of those really huge countries with a quarter billion Muslims each and virtually no military might, like Indonesia or Malaysia, I’d be noticing the similarity between what America plans to do and the Crusades. We’re going to punish Iraq for something Saudi Arabia did. It’s as if all Muslims look alike to us. Saudis and Iraqis are interchangeable. Kill ‘em all and let their god sort it out. Instead of counterattacking Saudi Arabia, which, however outrageous to the Muslim world, would at least be seen as justifiable retribution because they did kill thousands of our people, we’re going to pick on Iraq, a country that we supported and armed just a few years ago, and the most secular government in the Mideast, which most Muslims would think would appeal to us and make us feel sympathetic to them. Now that the USSR is gone and can’t automatically block every move the US makes, the US is free to do whatever it wants, and apparently what it wants is to resume the Crusades after a thousand year temporary truce, killing Muslims seemingly at random. I think that will do as good a job of motivating a few tens of thousands of formerly peaceful, secular Muslims from the LARGE Muslim countries to drop in on us with dynamite duct-taped all over their bodies, as a direct attack on Riyadh would.
Sounds like you’re assuming that Al Qaeda is backed by Saudi Arabia. Give me a link or two for support. Maybe you can trace it all the way back to Cheney & Halliburton? In any case it’s a moot point. If the Saudis were found to be responsible by the CIA, say, that info would be concealed and we’d still go after Iraq, from which we have more to gain. You don’t think they’d have blackballed him at least by when he became public enemy #1 for the embassy & Cole bombings? He was expelled from Saudi Arabia in 1991. Considering that the cost of the 9/11 op is estimated at $500,000, it doesn’t stretch anybody’s credibility to think it might just be the work of a terrorist group independent of Saudi Arabia, especially one headed by a person who could easily afford that. The Crusades weren’t about religion. Neither is Iraq. It’s about light sweet crude. Oil, that is, black gold, Texas tea.
Reassuring answers, but... Wouldn't that be fun? I wouldn't be surprised, the way everytime you pick up one of this administration's pawns the board underneath is covered with slime. I can understand the huge oil reserves. But I still don't see how an attack on ANY Muslim country can be depicted by a model that includes the concept of GAIN. As you've said, it wouldn't take much to incite the entire Muslim community, which is something like one third of the world's population. You've certainly got some persuasive answers to my questions. Thanks. I still don't understand how they acquired the knowledge of exactly the right spot to hit the buildings so they would collapse instead of just smoke. From what I've read, based upon factors such as the height at which the city forced them to stop using asbestos insulation and made them finish with something inferior, not many people had both the knowledge and the ability to figure out where that crunch zone was. BOTH planes hit them, it obviously wasn't a lucky guess. That $500K would have just about paid for tracking down the necessary experts and getting them to cooperate. Unless somebody in the US government really was in on it after all. Considering how well the Oklahoma bombing worked toward building a stronger and more corrupt government, they may have figured an even larger disaster that could be blamed on foreigners would have us whimpering for their (ironically not yet demonstrated) protection. The heads of state know that and an increasing number of increasingly cynical Americans are starting to catch on. But I wonder how many of those two billion Muslims believe that? Considering that the next war is likely to be fought by autonomous individual terrorists with no need for a survival strategy, those are the people who count, not their kings.
Johann you're an unhappy little man. I don't think the hippies would take to you but the army will, anyway no matter, Jak what's up with this? "Anerica does not have the support from the rest of the world like we should have. So America has to eliminate one threat at a time. Right now Saddam is a big threat and he has to be eliminated." "Like we should have" - check how you assume you're entitled to it. Other countries get bombed but if they are not in "US interests" it dosen't even make the polarised news Johann regards as be-all & end-all. Having said that I assume by "threat" you mean US threat. How far will this go? Till every "threat" is eliminated... let me guess that guy in his comfy office says who the threat is. You know what if I had big ears, no brain & desired world domination I'd kill Osama tell the world he's nowhere to be seen but I'm after his operatives wherever & whenever they surface then have my way with the world. Nifty for a big eared no brainer! made possible by the blind the 1 eyed man is king indeed.
Muslims have the same average head on their shoulders as any other major group. They know that dictatorship = bad. If Iraq is democratized and the oil not stolen, repercussions would be minimal I think. That’s a big if though. More likely the oil will be stolen under the guise of liberation, so the plan could backfire big. Even structural engineers wondered about that initially. But those specializing in skyscrapers already knew that there is no such spot. The only knowledge needed was the obvious kind: hit the towers fast and full of fuel. Check out The Collapse: An Engineer’s Perspective. No doubt terrorism is the strategy of the future. These people aren’t nine-to-fivers, so they’ll always need a backer. The counterstrategy has been to follow the money trail and remove its source.
