# Violation of Newton's third law with a new space propellant invented by me.

Discussion in 'Pseudoscience Archive' started by victorespinoza, Aug 28, 2013.

1. ### LakonValued Senior Member

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Truly Victor, if you are so passionate about your discovery, why DON'T you make a working model ?

You had previously said you don't have much money to create other working models of your other .. ahem .. inventions, but the materials for this one would be very cheap.

Make a working model and post a video of it.

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Veeg again.
Heh Heh

5. ### Captain KremmenAll aboard, me Hearties!Valued Senior Member

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Q. How does a fan work in space?
A. With a 9 volt computer motor

Victor wins that one.

And what does it push against?
Let me guess. Veegtrons.

7. ### Captain KremmenAll aboard, me Hearties!Valued Senior Member

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Sorry, didn't notice this.
It blows air.

I'm almost afraid to ask, but I will.
Victor. Where does it get the air from in space, which is a vacuum?

Last edited: Sep 5, 2013
8. ### victorespinozaGuest

THEME

Violation of Newton's third law with a new space propellant invented by me.

SUMMARY

I am creating a current of air within a closed system. The air will never exit the box.

DATA

Propellant invented by: Víctor Elias Espinoza Guedez
Email: victor.espinoza.13@hotmail.com

Propellant VEEG - The theory of action and the reaction of Newton's third law is refuted.

My prototype is completely closed and moves in the direction depending on the Red blades.

I hope of the results of the experiments in aerospace companies, to calculate its strength and know if with this drive, can get to the planet Mars.

Important 1: Red blades must not occupy all the space of the output from the turbine or giant fan, so the air that does not touch to the Red sheets ascend the air diverted by Red sheets. So the air will have a single sense of direction.

Important 2: so the turbine or giant fan ventilate air, we have to introduce more air with a cylinder of compressed air.

VIDEOS

First steps to understand my VEEG propellant:

My idea to develop a space propellant [1]:

My second Idea to develop a space propellant [2]:

Very affectionately,
Víctor Elias Espinoza Guedez
Patent pending: 20 August 2013​

9. ### Captain KremmenAll aboard, me Hearties!Valued Senior Member

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Erm, hello?
Where does it get the air from, in outer space?

10. ### victorespinozaGuest

Inside the box with using compressed air.

11. ### Captain KremmenAll aboard, me Hearties!Valued Senior Member

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So, you think that a fan inside a closed container, pushing the air around that container,
will propel the container through space, to mars?
Have I got that right?

12. ### victorespinozaGuest

A box full of air and with 10 giants fans can produce enough force to get to Mars. Watch the video:

Very affectionately,
Victor Elias Espinoza Guedez
Patent pending: 20 August 2013

13. ### spidergoatVenued Serial MembershipValued Senior Member

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53,549
How do you know if it works?

14. ### MarkM125Registered Senior Member

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It's a bit ironic that you claim to have disproved Newton's third law, considering, I don't know, the operating principle of a propeller (your fan) is....well....Newton's third law.

Good luck escaping the Earth's gravitational field. Ignoring air drag, you'll need to supply at the least a constant force of 9.81 Newtons per kilogram of mass for your spacecraft. A (very) rough approximation for the force exerted by the fan can be estimated as

$F = \rho V^{2} A$

That's generous, as I assumed that the blades are perpendicular to the air flow (which they aren't). Let's say the fan has a cross sectional area of a square meter, and the fluid is air. Then the required flow velocity is about

$V = \sqrt{\frac{F}{\rho A}}= \sqrt{\frac{9.81 \ N/kg}{1.2041 \ kg/m^{3} \ * \ 1 \ m^{2}}} = 2.85 \ m/s$

For every kilogram of mass of your craft. As the mass of the MSL rover was about 900 kg, your propeller will need to achieve a flow velocity of air of....2569 m/s, or about 7 to 8 times the speed of sound in air at sea level. Considering your propeller is a computer fan powered by a 9V battery, its unlikely to happen.

Like I said, good luck.

15. ### Captain KremmenAll aboard, me Hearties!Valued Senior Member

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But a fan inside a sealed box isn't going to propel anything, is it?

16. ### MarkM125Registered Senior Member

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115
No, absolutely not. I was assuming there was some kind of air tank and that the air was directed out of the device, just for showing the absurdity of using a propeller to reach orbit. The problems with his "invention" are innumerable, I was just pointing out one that could be backed by numbers.

17. ### spidergoatVenued Serial MembershipValued Senior Member

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You're such a pessimist!

18. ### Captain KremmenAll aboard, me Hearties!Valued Senior Member

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@ Victor. Have you tried this experiment?
If you had the apparatus inside something that floated, you could try it in your bath.

@ non-Victors
Would anything happen to the apparatus put in a bath at all?
Basically, it is a fan blowing on a sail in a closed container.
Might it spin round or something?

19. ### victorespinozaGuest

I speak of a space propellant not of a toy.

For example:

Very affectionately,
Victor Elias Espinoza Guedez

20. ### Captain KremmenAll aboard, me Hearties!Valued Senior Member

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It is an experiment that would tell you whether the larger model will work or not.
Surely you wouldn't want to pay for a patent on something that didn't work?

What are the exhausts on your illustration for?
I thought you said the compartments containing the fans were sealed.

21. ### victorespinozaGuest

On the space shuttle there are 2 sealed boxes.

22. ### Captain KremmenAll aboard, me Hearties!Valued Senior Member

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If the fan is blowing air through the exhausts on Victor's model, then providing the journey begins in space, the 9v battery will be sufficient.
Say the battery, using all its power, pushes the craft in the direction of Mars at 0.01 MPH, the journey will take just 386986 years.
Astronauts are advised not to lick the end of the battery. (Health and Safety)

23. ### Captain KremmenAll aboard, me Hearties!Valued Senior Member

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Same question.
The boxes are sealed.
So what are the exhausts for?