Theists in severe decline.

Discussion in 'Religion' started by Xelasnave.1947, Sep 4, 2018.

  1. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    26,906
    Many. Possibly more believers than theistic religion, over the long past - depends on how one defines deity (most people want to exclude animal and tree spirits, ghosts, dead ancestors in their spiritual abode, fairies and pixies and so forth, etc)
    Notice the absence of deity in all of that heaven and hell and rotting in the ground stuff - no deity necessary.
     
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  3. Michael 345 Looking for Bali in Nov Valued Senior Member

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    I guess we are in Humpty Dumpty territory

    Please name a atheist religion

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  5. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    Zen Buddhism and a couple of other branches, Classical Taoism, Confucian ancestor worship, most animist and shamanic tribal religions of the major continents, etc.
    A strict definition of deity or theistic might exclude religions like the Egyptian Pharaohnic, the Buddhist and Taoist sects that have auxiliary spiritual entities of a supernatural nature, etc, although I wouldn't go that far.
    A strict definition of religion might include Leninist and Maoist ideological organization, Cargo Cults, and the like, as well - adding to the list of the atheistic.
     
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  7. Michael 345 Looking for Bali in Nov Valued Senior Member

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    In an effort to keep things as simple as possible I invoke my Humpty Dumpty rights

    Religions believe in god(s)

    Other quasi religions do not

    On the fringes some mingling which turns discussions into judgement calls all parties can claim correctness

    However I really fail to follow the logic of people who do not believe in any god(s), quasi or otherwise, can be said to belong to a religion

    Those outside of my limited and restricted view of religion who take part in quasi religious ceremonies I would place in the second group, no gods, and call sects, spiritual gatherings etc etc

    Agree / disagree thats fine but in such language debates I invoke Humpty Dumpty

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  8. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    There is change with all things.
    Folk will find something somehow...You seek it. As time goes on you find a way of putting something together or follow established ideas beliefs and rituals.
    I find it comfortable that there isnt any particular meaning.
    It is vast and even if the is some entity I dont know that we may even be part of the plan.
    This entity may be building something it which humans dont figure.
    We may be like some bacteria in his plan☺
    I think my dwelling in astronomy and thinking about the vastness of the observable universe and all that we can not see...it just makes us rather small...I look at the Hubble Deep field shot where the field of view is what is covered by a grain of sand held at arms length and behind that grain of sand there are thousands of galaxies...and they probably are all say a mollion light years seperate from each other and each probably have 100 billion Suns and goodness knows how many planets and asteriods and sub planets and dust....a lot of stuff behind yhat grain of sans and so it is for wherever you hold that grain of sand as behind it wheter you see them or not are thousands of gslaxies...its huge.
    So I dont find it difficult to think wow its big and its nice to be alive....I dont need more than that☺
    Give everyone and understanding of how big it is and who could tell?
    Some may feel whats the point some may accept insignificance.
    If you have to form odd ideas to manage I guess thats what you do.
    The vastness makes me happy to be here if only for a blink and for no reason.
    Life is good if there is a creator thanks hope my mob doesnt get in your way.

    Alex
     
  9. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    4,900
    Do you like my approach to the big issues?
    Do you think it was all made for us?
    Do you think we are the only intelligent life in this incomprehensibly huge universe , including the vastness that lays past our observable universe.
    If so we would be very special indeed.
    I dont know but I do wonder how theists take on the vastness of the universe.
    It is rather hard to think we are all there is.
    Alex
     
  10. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    4,900
    Here is a frightening thought.
    There could be billions of Earth type planents out there with trillions of humans all just like us, for whatever reason life just evoles so soooner or later the human form work best for the technology we use and thats why humans are everyehere in the gallaxy.

    I wonder if anyone has had that idea.

    And in a hundred years or so all reach the ability to travel everywhere in the universe in an instant.

    Mmmm think about that ss you go to sleep.
    Alex
     
    Last edited: Sep 9, 2018
  11. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    The Eternalists☺
    Memeber ship one☺
    Alex
     
  12. Michael 345 Looking for Bali in Nov Valued Senior Member

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    And the micro micro micro management of the

    Manual for running Planets

    Local name Earth
    Species Human
    Last inspection about 2,000 local year units

    Page 2,154,753
    Reproduction - requirements
    1 X Male
    1 X Female

    Method - place together as per diagram

    Allow unrestricted reproduction

    On no account should condoms be used by the Male nor ........(Google the rest)

    The attention to detail is staggering

    Oops there's another sparrow falling

    Bed time - good night

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  13. Michael 345 Looking for Bali in Nov Valued Senior Member

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    Where is your
    Church?
    Holy book?
    How much have you collected from the gulible?

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  14. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    The whole universe is my church and its already built and there to look at so you dont need a book.
    I dont like dealing with the gulible but I would not take their money their money is best used to support the air line builders...filter down economics...
    I do think one could probably build a following with the net as crazy things take off...hech look at what some folk send money to...
    A interesting thought exercise but there must be better ways to make a billion...er actually there isnt☺
    Alex
     
  15. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    4,900
    A church for atheists that could take off... basic idea eternal universe so everyone has something to believe in, personal value system dictates humility via recognition of ones insignificance in the grand universe and a determination to recognose they there is stuff we dont even know we dont know and avoid relyance upon speculation for answers to questions that may have answers we have not can not conceive.
    There will be of course rituals..lots of parties that demand nudity out of respect for what we are with plenty of music beer and food...and flowers I like flowers butterflies at certain times of the years... parues on days of significance like a luna eclipse or just Saturday night...
    But its all too much really those who need something can read their bible and pick out a good message if thats what they are looking for...and keep it to themselves I ok with that.

    Hows take for being laid back☺

    Alex
     
  16. Musika Last in Space Valued Senior Member

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    1,906
    Who is the "we" and "us"?

    Btw, there is more than one theist take on an eternal universe.
     
  17. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    4,900
    A church for atheists that could take off... basic idea eternal universe so everyone has something to believe in, personal value system dictates humility via recognition of ones insignificance in the grand universe and a determination to recognose they there is stuff we dont even know we dont know and avoid relyance upon speculation for answers to questions that may have answers we have not can not conceive.
    There will be of course rituals..lots of parties that demand nudity out of respect for what we are with plenty of music beer and food...and flowers I like flowers and butterflies at certain times of the year... parties on days of significance like a luna eclipse or just Saturday night...
    But its all too much really those who need something can read their bible and pick out a good message if thats what they are looking for...and keep it to themselves I ok with that.

    Hows that for being laid back☺

    Alex
     
  18. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    4,900
    Lets make groups..start with all humans...the good ones? theists?
    Alex
     
  19. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    4,900
    7 billion humans I wonder what percentage think the universe is eternal?

    Maybe each human thinks just a little differently to all the others so each have a sligthly different view☺Well they must ...are humans like snow flakes no two the same but how do we know that two snow flakes cant be the same we havent compared them all...


    Alex
     
  20. Musika Last in Space Valued Senior Member

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    1,906
    Well if we have a world that seems functional to individuals that don't identify as theist or even human, it seems we have a category that is a bit broader than your initial estimations.
     
    Last edited: Sep 9, 2018
  21. Musika Last in Space Valued Senior Member

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    1,906
    When I said "theist" I was talking about religious traditions ... not youtubers or youtuber commentators or whatever
     
  22. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    I imagine some folk imagine the Universe was made for them so as to fit into the grand plan that they believe is the grand plan.
    Alec
     
  23. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    I expect most religious traditions believe the Universe is made for them after life or not.

    Not unreasonable.

    I feel like its mine to enjoy at least in a happy sort of way just without focusing gratitude on an entity...obviously.

    Alex
     

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