The Pathetic KKK Nazi leader: David Duke lost it, LOL

Discussion in 'World Events' started by To Post It Up, Dec 17, 2006.

  1. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

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    Poor government. Dictators controlling the countries.

    No. Perhaps you should read his book before making assumptions.

    The Roman Empire is dealt with in his previous work Guns, Germs and Steel. Read that one too, if you're really interested.
     
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  3. Count Sudoku Banned Banned

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    Do any black countries, cities have good government?

    I read a critique of one of the books that said Diamond dwelt on small insignificant civilizations while ignoring the big ones.
     
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  5. infoterror Registered Senior Member

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    Jared Diamond is pseudoscience. Stephen Pinker is not.

    <3 Stephen Pinker

    :m:
     
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  7. spidergoat pubic diorama Valued Senior Member

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    Then it doesn't seem all that superior, does it?
    That's not civilization, just ignorance and fear.
    Hunting and gathering no longer works, due to deforestation and environmental damage.
    To some extent, but it's by no means a complete resistance, and no one likes to get bitten by mosquitos.
    Good for them.
     
  8. Prince_James Plutarch (Mickey's Dog) Registered Senior Member

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    James R.:

    Jared Diamond also has been shown to be utterly wrong in many of his discussions of primitive warfare.

    http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Front_Page/HG04Aa02.html

    And he barely touches on the Roman Empire in "Guns, Germs, and Steel" and rejects the mountains of evidence to sugges that genetics (and by extension, race) matter SIGNIFICANTLY in human development.
     
  9. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

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    What's a "black country"? Or a "black city"?

    Guns, Germs and Steel does not discuss particular countries so much as entire continents. Collapse compares examples of civilisations which were similar in many respects but different in certain important ways, in order to examine how the factors that differed impacted on the success or failure of the civilisations.

    If you go searching only for criticism, I am sure that is what you will find.

    Blanket, prejudicial statements such as this just highlight an obvious lack of knowledge. You probably haven't read any Diamond, and probably not much Pinker either.

    Such as?

    Where, specifically, does he reject such evidence? References, please.
     
  10. Count Sudoku Banned Banned

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    Gonna have to backtrack here, farming is usually better even though you have to bust your ass to do it. Is there some reason farming is impossible in Africa?

    It makes perfect sense to thin the herds of dangerous animals.

    Are you serious? Who the fuck makes a living hunting and gathering?

    Your answers are starting to get so ridiculous I'm going to surrender just to spare myself from them.
     
  11. Count Sudoku Banned Banned

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    One where the government is primarily black. Can you tell me one black government that is actually good and why the majority of them suck?
     
  12. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

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    Show me a complete list of "black" governments around the world (no selective picking, please!)
     
  13. Prince_James Plutarch (Mickey's Dog) Registered Senior Member

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    James R.:

    Did you not notice the link I gave you with my prior post? If not, here it is again:

    http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Front_Page/HG04Aa02.html

    I will also reference you the entire book of "Guns, Germs, and Steel". He makes no reference whatsoever to the mountains of evidence produced by scientists in the last 50 years that demonstrate strong (some 50 percent) genetic influence on general personality, intelligence, and other mental characteristics. He also takes into no consideration of studies such as those discussed in "The Bell Curve" and "IQ and the Wealth of Nations" (although the latter was not published at the time) as well as in various others (some even going as far back as WWI) in any of his studies.

    In essence, his entire book was based on enviromental impacts on civilization. Considering enviroment influences only 50 percent of any individual's development, we can say right off the bat that the book is "50 percent wrong".
     
  14. Baron Max Registered Senior Member

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    Yeah, all that's true. But it is kind of a fun book to read ...when you ain't got no other book around when you want to read something!

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!



    Baron Max
     
  15. Prince_James Plutarch (Mickey's Dog) Registered Senior Member

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    I thought it was boring, personally. I only barely managed to slog through it, owing to a friend's request that I consider it.

    He isn't a gifted writer.
     
  16. Count Sudoku Banned Banned

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    Why don't you give me a list of black governments that are actually good? It might be easier as it could be a short list.
     
  17. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

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    Prince_James:

    What about it?

    The book deals with large-scale historical trends over the entire period of "modern civilisation" in the last 100,000 years or so.

    All peoples originated in Africa. Some spread to Europe, Asia and the Americas. The question Diamond answers is why these people, who all started in the same place and share a common ancestry, had widely differing outcomes in terms of empire-building, development of technology and so on.

    Have you read the book?

    "The Bell Curve" has been widely criticised. I'm not familiar with "IQ and the Wealth of Nations". I don't see how either is relevant to large-scale historical trends.

    A person is not a civilisation. I think you're talking about completely the wrong level of analysis. A civilisation is made up of a group of people interacting in an environment. Diamond asks why some groups were more successful than others. Individual variations in IQ and other features can be assumed to be roughly equivalent across different large-scale groups of humans, so other factors must have been more important.
     
  18. Baron Max Registered Senior Member

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    He does NOT answer that question, James, he's proposing a theory ...which to my view, sucks! And that's also the view of many others.

    For example, why didn't he just go out around Africa and look at the native people as they are now, and see how they operate? In many areas, it's exactly the same as it was gazillions of years ago ...they laze around the camps and do virtually nothing. They're perfectly happy to live in mud or grass huts with dirt floors. Oh, okay, they make a lot of babies!

    Diamond didn't prove a damned thing ...not one single, solitary thing. He just made a bunch of convenient excuses for laziness and sloth ...which is still prevalent in the native tribes all over Africa.

    Baron Max
     
  19. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

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    Last time I looked, you weren't an anthropologist or geographer, so I can't place much faith in your assessment, Baron. Sorry.

    You've still got things backwards. Diamond's theory explains why Africans are still living in mud huts, while western peoples are living in apartment buildings and McMansions.

    On the contrary, most of them exert themselves far more than you do, every day. And they aren't happy to live in grass huts with dirt floors. They have no other option readily available.

    For many reasons.

    Yes, you're right. Tell me, how would you go about disproving Diamond's theory?

    You've never been to Africa, have you? Your ignorance is shining through, as usual.
     
  20. Prince_James Plutarch (Mickey's Dog) Registered Senior Member

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    James R.:

    It attacks the representation of primitives in Diamond's book as well as various other inaccuracies of human discourse and civilization.

    Yes, I read the book about three years ago.

    And yes, I am fully aware that this is the premise of the book. However, Diamond does this by totally disregarding every single genetic study ever done.

    Cultures and civilizations depend upon the quality of their people. It is telling that the world's stupidest people according to "IQ and the Wealth of Nations" have never developed civilization to any level approaching the more intelligent peoples. Contrast Sub-Saharan African Negros and Australian Aboriginees with Indo-European white Europeans and East Asian Orientals.

    Considering the studies such as "IQ and the Wealth of Nations" discuss average IQs, the influence of this on the brain power of the civilization must be profound. Accordingly, one cannot disregard the mental quality of the population, when discussing why one group has civilization and the other does not.

    Import high-IQ peoples to areas Jared Diamond claims are unfit for cultivation, and they do a lot better than the natives.
     
  21. Count Sudoku Banned Banned

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    How about you give me a list of good black governments? It might be easier. You can pick from most of the countries in Africa, the Caribbean or black cities in the USA.
     
  22. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

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    Prince_James:

    I disagree with the material in that link regarding Diamond's representation of "primitives". For a start, I don't think he makes any attempt to paint any civilisation as "primitive", or draw any idealised picture of "primitive" life.

    Frankly, 100,000 years is far too short a time for people to have got much smarter than they used to be. Civilisation didn't come about as a result of increases in average human intelligence in the past 100,000 years.

    Your mistake is that you imagine that "cultures" and "civilizations" live in closed boxes, with no movement of people in or out. In fact, every civilization has contacts with other civilizations and migrations in and out. The population of the world is far more mixed than your racist worldview will ever admit.

    That's exactly what Diamond does.

    Only if they already have advanced technology, and effectively ride on the backs of their ancestors who had preferential conditions in which to develop the relevant technology.
     
  23. infoterror Registered Senior Member

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    The "round earth theory" has been widely criticized.

    The reason you don't understand the relevance is that you are brainwashed against population dynamics study.

    I recommend reading The Blank Slate by Stephen Pinker first, then read up on population differences in IQ.

    If your liberal inner authoritarian will let you, that is!
     

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