the myth of the free market

Hamilton... if he had his way the POTUS would be a king and senators would be for life....

Look, I think the US Constitution was a good starting point [even if it wasn't voted on and was ratified by a handful of land speculators / founding fathers (daring to be fair - but ruthless businessmen nonetheless)]. And I think silver (and gold) made good starting points for this limited central government. Heck, I own a reasonable amount of silver. Bourbon was the common currency for many sailors of that age! Then there's the idea of States paying the central government dues versus free men conducting trade between themselves.

Why should any free person be bound to trade in one form of money over another? What business is it of anyone's how two people conduct their transactions? OH.... unless you have a greedy evil State that needs to vacuum as much per trade as is possible. Then, yes, I suppose a State enforced currency would make sense - particular one in fiat.


Do you think we can have both income tax, a State forced currency and also be free people? I don't.

 

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The only way anyone can be truly free is to raise an army and conquer an island somewhere.
Otherwise we are all tenants and have to live in community with all its compromises.

 

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Nope. I have a realistic view of the world. The world isn't made up of happy corporations trying their best to help your lemonade stand succeed. Nor is it made up of parent-like governments who only want the best for their children. It is a dangerous and competitive world, one where happy fantasies based on Ayn Rand books don't work any better than fantasies about government protection for all.

Yes, I have. She escaped - because she knew very well what her government was there for. (And it was not to protect her.) You would do well to talk to such people, to get a more realistic view of the world.

Nope. In my world, the government owns the street and my taxes support it. If someone tries to build a wall around it, I evict them and take the wall down. If they threaten me or try to stop me, I call the police, who come and tell the person that they cannot build walls on public streets. Problem solved.

In your world? Gold or whatever currency he decides on using (and that is accepted by at least a few others.)

Ah, you are imagining a society without any money at all? Good luck with that.

Nope. Engineer. I design stuff. How about you?

 

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So, let me make sure I have your reasoning correct. Corporations are out to do their best (not to serve the public, say, by providing a product like an iPhone 5) but to press their will upon their customers - because, everyone knows, when you use force against your customer base, that really impresses them and boy o boy are you going to get repeat patronage. So, your solution to the "Evil Corporation" is to give another group of humans, the State, the power (not only to legally use force against you, to violate your civil liberties, to take your property) - but to legally initiate such force against you. Oh, and to put a cherry on top, these so-called "Evil Corporations" can legally support these Political Leaders...errr 'civil servants' elections.

THAT'S your solution?

You're going to GIVE the Corporations access to a Legal Force, the State, so that where once we lived in a free society and had recourse through the free-market to punish Corporations who don't serve society and instead GIVE them nearly direct use of Legal Force against us.

Um, good luck with that - 100 years of State sponsored Corporatocracy...... yes, we truly live in a utopia.

Feds sting Amish farmer selling raw milk locally

What a wonderful "free" society we live in.

Oh, so "The Government" OWNS your property. Great. So, when that evil 7-11 millionaire pays for my election and I decide to build a wall around your house and shoot you for doing anything (outside of what I define as your rights through law I pay off others to pass and prescribe your legal 'rights') ... and you will play your role as "Citizen" and accept it - good.

That's great. Just great.

Nice to know the Cattle around these parts are logically consistent.

No, not at all. Do you know what 'money' is?

Either way, it's nice to see you support being forced to pay income tax on your labor in State backed/fiat 'money'. Good. And guess what? Those Corporations, taht 7-11 millionaire, they are really happy to spend your labor. Nice of you to let them.

Medical Researcher, I train MDs.

 

Why? We can live in a free-market community with law and private property rights.

I'm really only suggesting that for now we shrink the size and scope of the State and expand the size and scope of the Community. Take schooling as an example. It used to be the family and community was responcible for educating children. Now it's up to the State. Ironically, on average 40% of State funded 'Public Teachers' put their own kids in Private (Community) School.

That sort of says something.


What is the most amazing is, in Chicago, the 'Public Teachers' (40% of put their own kids in private school) go on strike to get paid >$73,000 per year (average wage in Chicago is <$40,000) AND these same people (on less than half what public teachers are on) will go out and strike FOR the the teachers! All you have to say is "Don't you care about the Children". It's just amazing to me. Totally amazing people can be so easily led around by the nose - even to sell Bonds on their children's future labor to pay teachers today - whose own children do NOT attend public schools but community (private) schools.

What a farce. Pony up two pigs, let the people vote, and they just swallow the whole lot hook line and sinker.



I asked some med students the other day what they thought of home schooling. Just out of curiosity. One said, I wouldn't want my mom or dad teaching me - they don't know anything! I asked: Did they graduate from high school? Answer: Yes. And..... so you want to go through the same educational system - is that correct? Hmmmmm.... I um.....


It's funny how we just assume whatever we did, however we were raised, this is somehow taken to be not only the "norm" but by default the best option.

 

as usual you try and misrepresent things. yes a large portion of people in chicago send their kids to private school because a lot of people thier send their kids to catholic schools. as you know all religious schools are private schools. and I strongly doubt your 40% number. oh whats that 20% of all elementry students in the cities are in religious schools swo that would mean at best if we accept your numbers which I don't would mean at best one fifth of the people send their kids to for education reasons. which I know for a fact isn't the case.

 

I agree that more government responsibilities should be taken on by municipal governments instead of the feds. This gives the issues a more direct accountability, because the ratio of citizens-to-politicians is much smaller at the local level. Several hundred times smaller!

You would probably enjoy the Swiss system, where they have lots of direct democracy in the form of referendums. They actually had a public vote on whether to maintain a gold backed currency several years ago. The majority decided against it.

What defines 'private property' is tricky. If the government can take something away from you, like your house if you dont pay the property tax...do you really own it???

 

The Washington Times: Public schools no place for teachers’ kids

We have a little saying around where I grew up: Actions speak louder than words.

Percentage of Public School Teachers who put their own children in private schools:
Philadelphia: 44 percent
Cincinnati: 41 percent
Chicago: 39 percent
Rochester N.Y.: 38 percent
San Francisco-Oakland: 34 percent
New York City: 33 percent
New Jersey: 29 percent


That's DOUBLE the average for most Americans. Obama's kids attended a school that costs over $25,000 per child per year. Yet, he's a 'Civil Servant'. Funny how quickly our "Public Servants" are to pull their own children out of State run public schools and put their kids into Community / Private Schools.

Reuters

Yes, life is good when you're leeching off the labor of others. Oh, but thing the Gods we have so many "Public Servants" selling Bonds on our children's labor for us. Geee..... lucky us.


When a High School Degree is conferred it certifies that the holder has met and has some level of expertise in the subjects that were taught. Yet, over and over I hear people say there's no way in hell they'd want their dumb-ass parents (who all hold at the bare minimum - a HS diploma) teaching them! I find that telling. It's fascinating. And so what's their solution? PUBLIC SCHOOL!

HAA!!!

I mean come on! Your mom was given a HS degree and therefor has competence in all areas and subjects core to a HS degree. I mean - that's the whole f*cking point in having a Degree awarded! Also, logically speaking, a single parent individually working with their own children in a 1 on 1 learning environment MUST be way better than shifting class to class (some the size of 40-60 students) where the 'Teacher' is just happy you haven't stabbed the kid next to you. Once this is pointed out people then default to the 'Socialization' of Public School. As if THAT were a GOOD thing! I mean, when are you going to use the "Social Skill" of raising your hand to go to the toilet? Maybe in Prison?!? Maybe as a COG working for someone else?


Society is, as we like to say, bass ass backwards (bass-ackwards)


Oh, and there is not such thing as a Free Market anywhere...