The jews got their own Holocaust, but what about others in the 20th century ?

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But Sam, you have provided no actual link to any such information. As currently composed, your claim is hearsay.

Oh, always, Fraggle.

 

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I accept that definition. Israeli action against the Bedouins is very deliberate and well coordinated. The legislature has passed laws, like the law of no return for the Palestinians which prohibit the Bedouin from living where they have for more than 5000 years except on the worst 1% of the Negev in the concentration (camps, cities, enclosures or whatever name you wish to use for the fact they cannot leave that 1% of the Negev). The judicial system has said their Ottoman Empire land grants and deeds are not recognized by Israel and that they have no right to live outside the concentration camps (despite 5000+ years of doing so before there was an Israel). The administration has long standing policy that the Sinai and Negev are for Israeli settlers ONLY and no compensation is to be paid (except in a few cases small amounts will be if those with very valid, well documented, land claims renounce them. If they do not, their land is just taken for Israeli settlers without compensation anyway). For example more than 50 years ago:

“David Ben-Gurion wrote to his son, "Negev land is reserved for Jewish citizens whenever and wherever they want... We must expel the Arabs and take their place... not in order to dispossess the Arabs of the Negev or transfer them but to guarantee in order to our own right to settle those places."[17] …”
This quote form Wiki at: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Negev_Bedouin and ref 17 to the original is given there.

Not by chance are the maps all changed to remove the Bedouin village names, nor is it chance that dispatches the heavily armored Israeli bulldozers to destroy those villages, nor is it by chance that Israeli planes spray herbicide on the Bedouin farms, nor is it chance that Israel built the concentration camps, etc.

This is a DELIBERATE POLICY, uninterrupted for more than 30 years. - Part of Israel’s program to steal the Bedouin lands. “legally" as Hitler did with German law and by driving them away or promoting low birth rates by allowing men to leave the camps if they join the Israeli Army, or by disease with poor sanitation conditions and practically non-existent medical care in the camps, with Israeli trucks delivereing water of questionable cleanliness to the camps and no sewerage systems.

SUMMARY: Yes by this definition, Israel is making a holocaust for the Bedouins. “Never Again” obviously only applies if Jews are the victims, and not the doers.

You are probably correct but I never read or heard "holocaust" prior to WWII. The centuries old "sport" of burning a small Jewish village and killing a few Jews* (the "Christ killers," etc.) I always heard called or referred to as a “Pogrom.”
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* Especially the ones you owed money to.

 

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That sounds pretty awful and disgusting. I've heard the Bedouins are badly mistreated aside from those who integrate into larger Israeli society, but I haven't heard anything that bad like spraying herbicides on their crops. I hope it's not true but if so, it's something western countries should make an issue of when discussing aid and trade. Aside from that though, I've heard the Bedouin are a much larger group than just belonging to the Sinai and Negev. Supposedly even the Saudi monarchy was originally Bedouin, before settling down and collecting all the cash.

 

the bedouin tribes were/are an arab people. they have had a strong influence on arab culture where hospitality is concerned.

 

Show me the slaughter of the Bedouins then.

 

Jews do control Hollywood, though. Literally two-thirds of all Hollywood writers, directors, and producers are at least half jewish. For a group of people that makes up a small percentage of the American population, that's quite high, and I can't imagine anyone arguing against that.

If you believe I'm exagerrating, then go to wikipedia and look at their list of jewish actors. You will be shocked at their numbers, and how many well-knowners have probably slipped under your radar. It's quite astounding. Here are some that I will cherry-pick -- and remember, these are just a FEW:


Zach Efron
Amanda Bynes
Shia LeBeouf
Scarlet Johansson
Natalie Portman (Queen Amidala)
Daniel Radcliffe (Harry Potter)
Michelle Trachtenberg (Dawn from Buffy)
Alyson Hannigan (Willow from Buffy)
Amber Benson (Tara from Buffy)
Sarah Michelle Gellar (Buffy)
Jennifer Connelly (Labyrinth)
Seth Green
Gwenyth Paltrow (from Iron Man)
Robert Downey Jr. (Iron Man)
Joaquin Phoenix (Signs)
Winona Ryder
Alicia Silverstone
Jack Black (School of Rock)
Helena Bohnam Carter (Harry Potter, Fight Club)
Daryl Hannah
Helen Hunt
Sarah Jessica Parker
Adam Sandler
Ben Stiller
Julia Roberts
Susan Sarandon
Kyra Sedgwick
Ally Sheedy (Breakfast Club)
Judd Nelson (Breakfast Club)
Molly Ringwald (Breakfast Club)
Jamie Lee Curtis
Daniel-Day Lewis
Carrie Fisher (Leia from Star Wars)
Harrison Ford (Han Solo, Indy)
Jeff Goldblum
Rick Moranis
Steven Seagal
Billy Crystal
Bette Midler
Meryl Streep
Ben Stein
Tori Spelling
Brent Spiner (Data)
Barbara Streisand
Sarah Silverman
Elijah Wood (Frodo)
Dominic Monaghan
William Shatner (Capt. Kirk)
Leonard Nemoy (Spock)
Walter Koenig (Chekhov)
Jake Gyllenhal
Maggie Gyllenhal
Ben Savidge (The Wonder Years)
Much of the cast from Heroes series and Baywatch series

...and LEGIONS more. ALL JEWISH. All well-known actors and actresses. Still think I'm exagerrating? Half the cast of Buffy the Vampire Slayer is jewish or half-jewish too. Hollywood is like a cult. I've been there, and my brother lives in Hollywood and works for a major Hollywood film studio, so you can just take my word for it.

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Religious favoritism and nepotism reign supreme. Need I remind everyone of Tori Spelling, whose dad produced Beverly Hills 90210 and cast her as part of the mostly attractive main cast even though she has the face of a cross-eyed beagle? That sort of thing happens every day in Hollywood.

So why is this the case? Are we to believe that jews are just naturally better at acting than everyone else? No, that's retarded. Rather, they have cornered the industry and they try extraordinarily hard to keep the business in-house. Fair play, but let's not delude ourselves as to what is really going on. We now know one of the biggest predictors for whether or not you will "make it" in Hollywood... be jewish.

 

Scarlet Johansson? Wow, my Jewdar didn't catch that one! Why don't you write her, and get her to star in your new screenplay about the Armenian genocide?

 

not really that surprising. can you think of another cultural group that places as much value on the creative arts?

 

Maybe gays and lesbians, but they seem to have more influence in fashion instead of film. Also, gays and lesbians are not a consolidated and clannish group of people with highly indoctrinated beliefs, like jews are. By the way, want more assurance that the jews are running things over in Hollywood?

FACT: today, seven Jewish Americans run the vast majority of US television networks, the printed press, the Hollywood movie industry, the book publishing industry, and the recording industry. Most of these industries are bundled into huge media conglomerates run by the following seven individuals:

Gerald Levin, CEO and Director of AOL Time Warner

Michael Eisner, Chairman and CEO of the Walt Disney Company

Edgar Bronfman, Sr., Chairman of Seagram Company Ltd

Edgar Bronfman, Jr, President and CEO of Seagram Company Ltd and head of Universal Studios

Sumner Redstone, Chairman and CEO of Viacom, Inc

Dennis Dammerman, Vice Chairman of General Electric

Peter Chernin, President and Co-COO of News Corporation Limited

All jewish. Those seven Jewish men, commonly referred to in the industry as "the Seven Deadly Heebs" (not my term) collectively control Paramount Pictures, Universal Studios, Dreamworks Pictures, New Line Cinema, Warner Bros, Disney, Turner Broadcasting System, ABC, NBC, CBS, CNN, MTV, UMCA Records, Geffen Records, DGC Records, GRP Records, Rising Tide Records, Curb/Universal Records, and Interscope Records, and a whole lot more. So, basically... almost everything you watch, listen to, or read in "mass media." Interesting, eh?

 

and?

 

And nothing. Just stating. You asked.

 

so your trying to present a vast jewish control conspiracy for shits and giggles?

 

Kay.... someone's in a bit of a mood. I'll remind you that the topic of the thread touches on the theme of Jews having a lot of influence in books and films. Can we say... Steven Spielberg, Schindler's List, Munich, anyone..?

 

I'm not sure I said the list was fully or half jewish anywhere. Please do not presume to know the minds of others here. Speak only for yourself.

Have you worked in the film industry, fraggle..? I have a direct and constant source to someone with first hand experience who has and continues to. Tell your old stories if you must, but I assure you this isn't some concocted hype I made up, and the list I compiled was selected from a very general list. One person being fourth jewish doesn't change that a rather huge number of jews saturate that industry.

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Actually, in point of fact your reference states:

The question is whether they are in fact correct, but it doesn't help to selectively quote. You presented the statement as fact. Is it indeed fact?

 

By Fraggle's definition of "holocaust" (and most any reasonable one) there is no requirement for firing squads, gas chambers, etc. that produce immediate death for the eradication of a people and culture to be a "holocaust." It can be done by a deliberate policy of slow eradication as Israel is doing to the Bedouins.

No one knows for sure how many Bedouins occupied the Sinai and Negev 1000 years before there was an Israel but estimates typically are 200,000 + or - 50,000. Now, in the concentration camps there are approximately 20,000. Probably several times that number did escape to other Arab lands (As many Jews escaped for Germany when Hitler was gaining power).

Also your point that many other nomadic people have disappeared is true, but more than 3000 years ago, the Bedouins of the Sinai & Negev were only "semi-nomadic." I.e. they built villages with surrounding farms and occupied them during that part of the year when rains were sufficient to grow crops. – Sort of like the more limited seasonal migrations of the Swiss dairy industry ( keep the cows in the valleys during the winter and drive them up into the mountains to graze in the spring until late fall but to feed their herds on the thin grass of the deserts, the Bedouins roamed at least 1000 miles each year when not in their villages.

If Israel had not announced its intention to steal the Bedouin lands 50 years ago and used the law and other means to do so AND not confined these people to concentration camps, with poor land and sanitation (admittedly no gas chambers), NOR bulldozed down their villages (some 5000 years old)* NOR sprayed their fields with herbicides, etc. then I too would agree that the decline of the Bedouins was typical of many other nomadic people who come into contact with “civilization” and not a case of deliberate genocide or a “holocaust.” Israel has to avoid the world learning of how it is treating the Bedouins as unlike the Palestinians, they are too illiterate to learn how to make crude rockets and have no guns to resist the Israeli ceasure of their lands.
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*One of the Sinai sites where Bedouins had lived was being developed as a small Jewish settlement. During the excavation an old grave yard was uncovered. Israeli anthropologists determined that some of the bones in it were at least 5000 years old. I am sorry, but I no longer have a reference for this fact. Probably someone skilled in searching, especially if they can read Hebrew can provide documentation. This information many have come to me from publications of the Israeli/Bedouin Friendship Association. (Or some name similar to that)

 

Replying to the part I made bold:
Yes that is true. If you go back several thousand years almost all Arabs lived with herds like the Bedouins of the Sinai and Negev did until Israel was created. Most of those outside of the Sinai and Negev CHOOSE to convert to a more modern life style. (Finding oil in their lands facilitated this). I.e. These other Bedouins were peacefully assimilated as has happened to many other nomads.

The main difference in the disappearance of the Sinai and Negev Bedouins is that Israel was (and still is to some extent) a small country with a great influx of Jews, especially from Russia. Israel needed land for expansion and took it. In some sense Israel is more justified in this than the early Americans were in destroying the Indian culture, confining them to reservations, etc. - For example shooting buffalo from trains just for sport (or sometimes stopping and taking only their tongues for sale). The continental USA had plenty of space for the early Americans to expand into without confining the Indians to concentration camps. The Indians were very skilled with horses and many did become cowboys, etc. Most would have assimilated without the slaughter and other abuses they were subjected to.
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*The spraying of herbicides on their crops has only been occurring for a decade or so. Before that, the crops were plowed under, but spraying herbicides is cheaper so only it is used now. It is very effective in relative dry lands – I have seen before and after photos. You can too if you search – I have forgotten the site where they are.

 

I can only assume it is. There are many similar statements but Ben Gurion is well known so it is the most quoted. (Moshi Dayan, the great Israeli war hero, made a similar one, I have read.) I did not intend (nor do I think I did) "selectively quote." - I gave the link to the statement AND included the reference to Wiki's source.

Surely if it were false, there would be someone challenging that quote in Wiki. Presumably the letter still exists and so the statement cannot be successfully challenged.