The good of Nazi Germany

Discussion in 'History' started by Norsefire, Aug 8, 2009.

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  1. Norsefire Salam Shalom Salom Registered Senior Member

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    Understandably, the media has made Nazi Germany to be an 'evil' state; I do not deny the damage done by this state, and the tragedy of the Holocaust. However, the overwhelming negativity surrounding the nation renders us incapable of examining the many positive aspects of Nazi Germany. It is time for us to be unbiased and examine the history objectively.

    First, animal welfare in Nazi Germany; ironically, Hitler loved animals and cared deeply about compassion and welfare for animals, and Nazi Germany was extremely friendly toward animals.

    Göring's broadcast,

    An absolute and permanent ban on vivisection is not only a necessary law to protect animals and to show sympathy with their pain, but it is also a law for humanity itself.... I have therefore announced the immediate prohibition of vivisection and have made the practice a punishable offense in Prussia. Until such time as punishment is pronounced the culprit shall be lodged in a concentration camp

    Further,
    On a different matter,
    -wiki

    Further, about Hitler:
    1) He unified the German people and helped them regain their sense of pride
    2) Stabilized the German economy and eliminated foreign debt
    3) He instituted the standardized schedule
    for the German train system and a standardized measurement for rail cars
    4) Created the modern autobahn system
    5) Encouraged the development of the Volkswagen
    6) Instituted the Kindergarten system
    7) Encouraged the development of jet aircraft, and rocket development.


    ----
    For unbiased information about Hitler in specific, go to
    http://www.hitler.org/

    The mission of the site:
    The Hitler Historical Museum is a non-biased, non-profit museum devoted to the study and preservation of the world history related to Adolf Hitler and the National Socialist Party. True to its role as an educational museum, these exhibits allow for visitors to understand and examine historical documents and information for themselves. The museum, while acknowledging the tragedy that over 50 million people died during World War 2, retains its non-biased status by refraining from making political judgments of any sort. Neither does it make the standard, uninformative, and cliched historical judgement that the victor of the war was "good" and that the loser of the war was "bad." Instead, all materials and resources are provided as a documentation of the time period and as scholastic resources with notes for clarification. No biased judgments, slanderous labels or childish name calling exist here as they do in most of the writings on this topic

    The teaching of history should convey only facts and be free from political motives, personal opinions, biases, propaganda, and other common tactics of distortion. Every claim that is made about history should also be accompanied by documentation proving its basis. Only responsible scholarship and teaching should be permitted. Those who intend to support particular political interests and agendas should have their biased historical interpretations criticized for lacking proof
     
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2009
  2. Gustav Banned Banned

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    /giggle
     
  3. Doreen Valued Senior Member

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    No. He fanned the flames of hatred between some German citizens against others, non-Jew vs. Jew, straight against homosexual, capitalist vs. communist or socialist. He spent his entire career demonsizing some Germans in the eyes of other Germans. He also divided Germans along the spectrum between war mongering to pacifism. People were scared in a wide variety of ways. He did unify many in their fear. But so would a plague.

    Using short term strategies that destroyed the country. Poor methods.
    But it is a myth the trains ran on time.
    And so on.
     
  4. Doreen Valued Senior Member

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    I am quite sure that Ted Bundy was clever or good about something. Had a nice word for the postman. Kept his yard clear (of corpses).

    Are we remiss if we focus on his serial killing?

    Who cares if Hitler made highways? The fact that people do not really care is why it does not come in discussions.

    If you see an anti-Nazi demonstration where the signs all read

    Hitler did not support mass transit.

    then you can correct with your information about what he did about trains.

    But when people talk about what a dangerous, evil megalomaniac he was, and all the damaged he caused, including incredible damage to his own people, they are not under some moral obligation to point out his 'strong' points.

    I am sure when you are critical of a world leader you look carefully through all of their policies and positions and make sure to point out their strengths and are not simply critical, but there is really no obligation for anyone else to do this, unless they are writing the definitive, comprehensive biography or something similar.
     
  5. Mrs.Lucysnow Valued Senior Member

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    So they killed off jews among others and protected animals. How commendable of them.:rolleyes:
     
  6. mike47 Banned Banned

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    WWI and WWII killed millions and millions of other people and NOT just Jews .
     
  7. spidergoat alien lie form Valued Senior Member

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    Big deal. Guess what, we still have roads and jets and schools and trains that run on time... without Hitler. We didn't need him for that. We could live without the freaking beetle, my Dad's friend died in one, so let Hilter rot in hell.
     
  8. mike47 Banned Banned

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    And when Katrina hit the people died with no aid....fantastic politics...!.
     
  9. GeoffP Caput gerat lupinum Valued Senior Member

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    Oh for fuck's sake. This again?

    It must be August, because Norsefire is posting again about why Nazi Germany "wasn't as bad as you haters think".

    "Hitler loved dogs and small children. He never, ever, littered. And he made sure to finish his business in the bathroom promptly and efficiently, never languishing with a book or sketching things."

    Enough, already.
     
  10. Norsefire Salam Shalom Salom Registered Senior Member

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    I'm not saying we wouldn't; I'm simply pointing out that Hitler was a deep, dedicated, passionate, and intelligent individual that did good as well as bad.

    Let us not skip over that good; he had his reasons. He made his mark. Why are you always so quick to insult him?
     
  11. Norsefire Salam Shalom Salom Registered Senior Member

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    The reasoning is probably that he figured humans are more fair game, because humans are less innocent, more intelligent, and it is humans that affect humans, not animals; thus it is easier to blame a human.

    Nazi Germany and Hitler, and his ideology, had many merits and many positives; indeed, in many ways they were progressive.

    History is done and over, but if Hitler had, instead, not been racist......if only.
     
  12. spidergoat alien lie form Valued Senior Member

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    He was a drug addled narcissist with anger management problems. The only thing good he did in his life was kill himself.
     
  13. GeoffP Caput gerat lupinum Valued Senior Member

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    Yes, but he was an ardent agriculturalist and he had a deep appreciation of classical music.

    Let's not damn the man with our narrow-minded focus on genocide.
     
  14. Norsefire Salam Shalom Salom Registered Senior Member

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    Probably, but let's not forget his tragic childhood, as well as the fact that he fought, and probably saw friends die, in WWI.

    He is the product of events, like anybody else; Post-Tramautic, and an anger at the Republic which imprisoned him, will do that.
    Do not be so narrow. I understand you don't like him but you know he deserves credit for alot of good as well as bad.
     
  15. Norsefire Salam Shalom Salom Registered Senior Member

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    He did alot more than that.
    Really? Where were the Nuremberg trials for the atrocities and inhumanities committed by the Allies? Where is the blame for the Allies for unfairly punishing Germany?

    The Allies are no innocent party.
     
  16. mike47 Banned Banned

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    Did you not know that the allies were the factor in the JEWS occupying Palestine ?!.
     
  17. Doreen Valued Senior Member

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    What is the problem if we do not focus on the good side of Hitler. there are books out there that mention things that he did that were neutral or good. Must every person offer a complete evaluation of someone when they talk about them? Do you do this? Much of what might be considered positive is not relevent in discussions of Hitler. If a group of people are discussing the history of highways in Germany they should probably mention any of Hitler's contributions. If they are trying to be complete.

    But why should anyone feel obligated to mention the good otherwise?
     
  18. Norsefire Salam Shalom Salom Registered Senior Member

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    It's called history. Mentioning only the bad is a one-sided, propagandist thing to do; he did good as well as bad, so teach about both.
     
  19. Doreen Valued Senior Member

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    And radically anti-communist and sexist. And someone who punished dissent. And someone who considered fear the best leadership tool. And someone who hated democracy and freedom of speech. And someone who through that all out attacks were all one needed to have a complete military leadership style. These are a few other if onlys.

    If only he did not see military solutions as the best in nearly all international relations. If only he did not rape his much younger female relatives.

    If only he did not lie to his people about the war, other political parties, the actions of other countries.

    If only he did not think that torture was a good tool for everyday use.

    It certainly would have been better if he hadn't been racist, but he still would have been a shitty leader. He still would have ended up destroying his own country for a while and having large numbers of his own population killed via his overoptimistic, hysterically aggressive military choices. Hell, most people found out about the Holocaust after the war. The war was fought mostly by other nations who saw a dangerous threat to their sovereigty or the welfare of their allies. He still would have led his country down the toilet even if he had liked Jews as much as dogs and little girls. Well, maybe not in the way he liked little girls, that would have been abusive, also, to Jews.
     
  20. spidergoat alien lie form Valued Senior Member

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    He doesn't deserve anything like that. He took control through a ruthless army of thugs, and a cynical campaign of propaganda and lies. His ambition sentenced Germans to years of war and certain death for many. Even his own officers tried to kill him for ruining the honor of the military.

    The only admirable things that came out of this debacle were the work of meticulous German engineers and scientists, (who were educated before the Nazi era).
     
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