The Future of A.I.?

Discussion in 'Intelligence & Machines' started by Monolith, Jul 13, 2002.

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  1. Monolith Registered Member

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    The 1968 release of Stanley Kubrick and Arthur C. Clarke's groundbreaking film, "2001: A Space Odyssey" introduced millions of moviegoers to the relatively new concept of Artificial Intelligence (A.I.). The HAL 9000, the space ship's on-board computer, could think for itself, speak for itself, even act in self-defense. With its chillingly calm voice and red, all-seeing eye, HAL at once embodied our deepest fears about and greatest hopes for technology. Intelligent machines might help us reach the stars - or else they might eclipse us, and render our humanity irrelevant.

    Either way, the year 2001 has come and gone, and your desktop computer - impressive tool that it is - is hardly cause for philosophical meditation on what it means to be human. Where are the HAL 9000's and C3PO's science fiction promised us?

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  3. Stryder Keeper of "good" ideas. Valued Senior Member

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    Science fiction has some points about it that can have adverse effects on science. For instance if Frankenstein wasn't written, would the human race hav so many problems with cloning as a way of life?

    The depiction of an AI gone wrong, is in fact a point that has steered people developing AI's, not to allow those mistakes to occur.

    Not to forget to mention that the Depiction of "1984" (written in 1947/8) also has proven points about a future society, but has aided in people trying to avoid certain issues.

    (Although the upsurgence of CCTV and the new laws in Britain for arresting people that could do a future crime. nearly mimics the perception of thought crime or even "Minority Report")

    The ability for use to see from fiction the possible errors, isn't always a hinderance though, afterall many mistakes that could occur have been stopped before they start. (take for instance the mention of an Apocolypse in a bible. Some people have taken that as it's going to happen, I perceive it as a way of making people see how not to allow it to happen. Not that I'm a believer)

    As for AI's, well theres this mergence between how the machine should think and what size is needed for architecture. Afterall 2001 had a whole space station filled with computers, not just one lousy desktop.

    I would say that AI has been developed, just not to "Monolithic" preportions in the commercial sector. (exploration, military etc)
     
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  5. Thor "Pfft, Rebel scum!" Valued Senior Member

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    I think the Terminator films are what are scaring people the most. Machines created to serve humans and fight our wars rebelling against their creators. I don't think Sci-Fi films/programmes actually are promising these things to us. They are telling us what might happen if we go down a road we have not travelled before.
     
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  7. Avatar smoking revolver Valued Senior Member

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    I remembered the "Matrix" while reading this. a scary possibility.
     
  8. Cris In search of Immortality Valued Senior Member

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    Yet sci-fi TV and movies are changing their outlook on AI.

    In T2 the bad robot from T1 became the good guy and in the final moments of the movie there was a very clear point that if a machine could learn compassion then there is hope for the future.

    In T3, not released yet, that idea is continued, although in a far more complex good versus bad scenario.

    But look at Star Trek: Data is clearly a good guy. And the Doctor in Voyager is clearly an AI who is definitely the good guy.

    But in reality we are not going to see a highly intelligent machine suddenly appear. True AI is going to be a long road and we will see the slow introduction of semi-intelligent devices which will allow us to become accustomed to intelligent machines. This has already started with the introduction of computers in many household products, e.g. most modern washing machines and dishwashers include such devices. Also all modern automobiles have computer-managed engines. And self-driving cars are well into prototyping.

    One thing I hope we will see soon is intelligent traffic lights. If you have ever been stuck at a crossroad with a red light when there is no other traffic then you should understand the current stupidity of the current technology. However, for these light systems to make intelligent decisions they must be able to see what we can see, and that needs reliable vision systems. In fact reliable vision recognition is likely to be the first major breakthrough that allows AI to take the next step.

    Cris
     
  9. itchy Registered Senior Member

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    What a media driven culture we live in when all of your replies refer to movies.. 2001, Terminator, Star Trek, Matrix, 1984 etc. It's almost as if these movies act as a guideline in AI development, which in that case is unfortunate.

    But in answer to Monolith, I think it is just a matter of time before we start seeing AI incorporated into our daily lives. The computers are simply not fast enough yet but they will be. We have just underestimated the cpu-power needed for AI.
     
  10. Stryder Keeper of "good" ideas. Valued Senior Member

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    Itchy,

    It's not necessarily the speed of the CPU that matters, but of it's capacity. Afterall the human brain can't run at the same speed as a CPU, but it computes at a lower speed with multiple numbers of neurons which would be a larger number of CPU's.

    The brain how ever uses a complex method with it's switches, where normal computer architecture is still flawed. The modern architecture has basically replaced the knobs/dials and plugs of the first systems with fixed switches.

    This is all very well by to mimic the brain complete changes in architecture would have to be made, with multiple processors. Multiple slower processors will give off less heat also, in comparison to a couple of faster ones that need higher end metals so as not to overheat and/or melt.
     
  11. Increan Sage Registered Senior Member

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    Though I love the Terminator movies, They could not have ven happened. Someone went wrong writting it. In the first place Kyle (Johns father) is from the future, but explain this John sent his father back to protect his mother, but how was John around in the first place to send his father back since he is like 40 and his dad is around 25-30 when they first meet. right there makes it impossible for the first movie to even happen therefore the sequel also could never happen, but T2 is one of my favorite movies. I wish they storyline wasn't so fucked up. sorry this doesn't relate to the thread I just have wanted to state this for a while.
     
  12. Increan Sage Registered Senior Member

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    Time travel is a really confusing subject, lol
     
  13. Stryder Keeper of "good" ideas. Valued Senior Member

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    You could look at the possibility that his father came from a parallel, afterall Terminator was all about a "Future that doesn't have to happen".

    If you looked at the timeline being a singularity, then the future was going to turn out that way no matter what.
    But the universe isn't quite like that, it's not a singularity, it's made up of many alter universe, with different chronological positions, possibly even different directions. (When you encompass Wave inversions, even if only inverting a .wav file, and I mean the wave itself, not playing it backwards)

    You might start to wonder where this thread is going, but there are still points in quantum studies that can be utilised in developing an intelligence that works utilising Fractal preminition strings to "Layer" it's intelligence.
     
  14. Increan Sage Registered Senior Member

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    But he sent his father back! that couldn't happen he has to exhist first
     
  15. Avatar smoking revolver Valued Senior Member

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    maybe he exists precisely because he sent his father back.
    Read "Fantastic Saga" by Harry Harrison...He plays with these kind of things there.-> America was discovered by vikings, because a holywood producer with a time machine decided to make a movie that showed hav america was deiscovered by vikings. The evidence of the viking theory was a camp found in archeological findings nowadays, but that camp later appeared to be built as a decoration to make a movie about viking settlement in america...It's great novel...
     
  16. Increan Sage Registered Senior Member

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    But he didn't exist in the first place to be able to send his father back. if someone else first sent his father back then it would work. but if he wasn't around there would be no reason to protect sarah so no one would be sent back and he would never exist I can go on like this forever, lol
     
  17. Avatar smoking revolver Valued Senior Member

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    I can also

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    . multiverses ,multiple timelines and time travel is a bit complicated
     
  18. Increan Sage Registered Senior Member

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    yes, yes it is.
     
  19. Monolith Registered Member

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    preception, reality & funding

    I think that the fact of the matter is that there has not been as much development in AI as publicly anticipated simply because there has not been much cause for one.

    I think that science is haunted by the public perception of terminator-esque creations and thus its quite hard to find the funding required for those scientist pursuing such ventures.

    On the other hand, miniaturization and the speed of computers is occurring at a much greater pace than many science fiction authors planned. HAL was a huge computer system, while today's CPU are often smaller than the digit of the finger.

    I think that the general idea of advancing IT technology was correct, only the impetus of research was not in the direction that was predicted.

    The PC of today would seem to be just as amazing as a huge monolithic supercomputer. I dare say, if the US government really cared about AI as much as they wanted new jet fighters & nukes, we would have had HAL9000-grade computers and public perception type AI related technology years ago.
     
  20. Monolith Registered Member

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    I recall an experiment that was being conducted at Cal Tech that dealt with a program that consisted of a database that included all known mechanical elements - such as pulleys, wheels, cogs, fulcrums, etc. You would somehow communicate to the program something like "I want to build a mouse trap - and here are all of the things you need to know about mice." The program would then develop a device based on the mechanics in its database. I'm not sure what became of this experiment, but I would like to look into it further.

    This also brings to mind a simple program that I remember playing with back in the 80's that faked A.I. called "Eliza" - you can view an on-line version of this rudimentary program here:

    http://www-ai.ijs.si/eliza-cgi-bin/eliza_script

    It would be nice if someone added the ability to learn new topics.

    Here is another interesting link to click around in:

    http://web.mit.edu/STS001/www/Team7/application.html
     
  21. Rick Valued Senior Member

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    First of all when this topic was started it stuck with wrong note.

    AI was introduced by Arthur.C.Clarke.No one ,NO ONE evr mentioned a damm about an entity called ISAAC ASIMOV?

    ideally or from theoritical perspective Isaac Asimov was the one who has bought the subject of robotics,(even the name)no one experimented with the notion of AI being a positive thing.it was a subject of Monster films.

    it is very hurting indeed not to find the name on the page where the man deserves to be the most.the AI practically deserves everything from Isaac Asimov.


    Issac Asimov was the one who talked about computer networks and a <b>Palm Top!</b>in late 1930s!.hell no one could think of such a possibility and most of all he was honest in saying that he was merely giving ideas and he knew nothing about how actually he was going to implement it.

    AI deserves more work than we are doing.implementation of AI as an expert system is just insufficient.Hollywood people have always exploited the given subject for their fascination etc.this should change.

    But i think not only this,the hollywood has often criticised the upcoming technologies,or rather misused it for their own tastebuds's satisfaction.take for instance the comncept of living in an animated world, and some pictures ring your mind,dont they?


    bye!
     
  22. kmguru Staff Member

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    Hi zion,

    Glad to see you back...


    I beg to differ. Incremental change to the level of AI will take too long and may not happen that way. It is a much more possibility that a virus program with the right type of DNA will mutate in the internet in a P2P envrinment or SETI type computational environment to bring about an intelligent program that is more like at an animal level. Then someone will discover that and disect/disassemble the program and improve on it to bring it to a higher order.

    I think it is easier to create a DNA than write a 100 million line code program for an AI. Machine time for evolution is cheaper than human time.
     
  23. Rick Valued Senior Member

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    hi Km.

    I missed you.

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    i missed sciforums badly.
    the coding part neednt be essentially a big one,with some odd hundred thousand or a million lines of code.it can be a small code,meant for futuristic auto add ons.


    the only way to do it,is improve the languages that has been built by our computer theorists,that computers can understand.i"ll come up a thread on bringing a new dimension to AI with theory of formal languages and automata.

    later...



    bye!
     
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