The Danger Of Soul Games

Discussion in 'Ethics, Morality, & Justice' started by davidelkins, Jun 3, 2016.

  1. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    It's exactly the same thing. Movies and literature based on true stories are reflecting reality. Movies and literature based on fictional stories also reflect reality. This is self-evident and I'm beginning to suspect that you are just trolling at this point.

    No..you could describe the reality of your day without talking about irrelevant details. We do this all the time. We describe the relevant details of our day and we have described it's reality. No need to mention everything. No need to talking about pooping.
     
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  3. Retribution Banned Banned

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    That is one essence of it, another being making yourself aware of any related historical accuracy, which leads to

    this being poppycock.

    Movies and stories, based upon reality or otherwise, are usually presented in such a manner as to present a moral message. That most movies and stories are presented in such a way as to entertain the reader/viewer within a small timeframe only gives them a more disproportionate influence on shaping common thought, with all due reference to information being taken from popular memes, rather than any real research or knowledge.

    More often than not, they don't "reflect reality" much at all. Events are co-opted and re-framed so as to lend "evidence" for this moral message at the expense of reality.

    "Braveheart" is one example. "The Red Baron" is another.

    And as for GoT... I'm going to assume, at this point, that the story isn't going to end with the final scene being something like "and then the white walkers killed everyone who was left. The End".
     
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  5. Yazata Valued Senior Member

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    Do human beings have souls? (What's a 'soul'?) What's wrong with souls having parts? (If souls somehow constitute the conscious human personality, that personality would seem to be complex, with perception, self-awareness, emotional feeling, associative processes, memory, intention and all kinds of parts.)

    How would one represent a soul in a pictoral representation?

    Maybe symbolism like that is involved in black magic. I've heard of accounts like that about malevolent witchcraft in traditional cultures. If somebody tells me that a clod of dirt represents my 'soul', then crushes it, it's certainly an expression of that person's dislike for me and it would probably make me disinterested in having any further relationship with that person. But I wouldn't think that any essential part of me had been damaged.
     
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2016
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  7. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    If that were true, then there would be zero room between 'based on a true story' and 'real life' for documentary.

    Based on a true story is a dramatized version of the events. Literally, removing the stuff that doesn't tell the story, and adding stuff that emphasizes the story. One can happily add dramatic scenes - such as cathartic moments, and pivotal dialogue, that was not part of the true story but should have been - to make the story dramatic and watchable.

    Precisely. You edit your day to tell the essence.

    That's a contradiction.

    Reality is blind to relevance. Relevant to what exactly?
    To the account we want to tell.

    Relevance can only come into play as a test. Is this event relevant or is it not? Does it complement the story? Even if that story is just 'here's how my day went'.

    Precisely. Remove the irrelevant details because they don't help describe what you want to tell. But what you tell does not reflect reality accurately.
     
  8. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    They both express reality, only in different ways. There's even the docudrama that mixes both techniques. It's all capturing reality on film.

    If you told me what happened to you at Burning Man that would be a dramatized version of events. You tell me what happened, how you and others reacted to it, what conversations you had, etc. But that would be the reality of what happened. You wouldn't need to go over your pooping in the portapotty or your eating or any other mundane irrelevances. Reality IS what happened. It's not necessarily everything that happened. But it's still the sequence of events that happened during that day. Same with movies and literature.

    There is no "essence" of the day. It is simply a mishmash of diverse and often unrelated events. If you tell about the events that led to each other, you are still depicting the reality of the day. You aren't distilling it all down to a single theme or thought.

    Relevance is how reality happens. Events happen during the day that are relevant to you. When you relate those chains of events, you are describing reality. You are depicting actual experiences you had during the day. That's reality.

    Yes it does. Telling anything that happened during the day is reflecting reality accurately. Newspapers and tv news do this all the time. They are showing us reality as it actually happened.
     
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2016
  9. Tiassa Let us not launch the boat ... Staff Member

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    I wouldn't actually wish to disrupt this discussion of storytelling theory. To the other, I feel compelled to explicitly remind that the realm of storytelling theory is itself diverse and dynamic. Toward that point, then, I might recall a trope from once upon a time, a snooty classical music aficionado telling me that jazz or rap aren't real music.

    (For the record, I've been through the transformation on rap; decades passed before I finally acknowledged musicality as an inherent attribute of rap.)
     
  10. davidelkins Registered Senior Member

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    I am not trying to imply that souls don't have parts or do have parts for certain, nor am I trying to say that parts are bad. I would actually be quite intrigued at the notion of parts. I have nothing wrong with horseshoes either, but if someone assaults me with a horseshoe I would be very concerned. Some people, who are good, might draw a series of geometric lines to represent their own soul artistically. I could do that of myself, but it would only be a representation and I would never draw a representation of another person. I would feel uncomfortable about that. DE
     
  11. mtf Banned Banned

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    352
    You know where something similar happens? In religion, of all places.

    In religious discourse, they paint a scenario, with a placeholder-you (something that supposedly represents you) in it, and then that placeholder-you gets crushed in that narrative if said placeholder-you doesn't comply with the scenario.

    All in an effort to trick you into thinking that _you_ had been or will be 'shattered', 'broken', or 'rent'.

    !!
     

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