The Atheist's Wager . . .

Discussion in 'Religion Archives' started by Athelwulf, Feb 27, 2005.

  1. Athelwulf Rest in peace Kurt... Registered Senior Member

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    http://www.abarnett.demon.co.uk/atheism/wager.html

    "It is better to live your life as if there are no Gods, and try to make the world a better place for your being in it. If there is no God, you have lost nothing and will be remembered fondly by those you left behind. If there is a benevolent God, He will judge you on your merits and not just on whether or not you believed in Him."

    Thoughts?

    — Peace, Love, Health, and Happiness to all! Âðelwulf.
     
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  3. Jan Ardena OM!!! Valued Senior Member

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    Athelwulf,



    Where's the wager?
    People still remember their dead (fondly) despite God. And what makes you think you are judged for not believing in God?
    And what's the point in pretending that God does not (definately) exist?

    Jan Ardena.
     
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  5. Thersites Registered Senior Member

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    As we cannot understand anything about god or gods if they exist at all, there is no point wondering about them at all.
     
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  7. KneD Le Penseur Registered Senior Member

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    Its better to live your live as if there is a God. And because of that try to make the world a better place.
    So if God judges you on your deeds, you'll pass. And when He judges on believe, you'll also pass.

    @Thersites: we cannot understand everything, but we sure can understand something.
    So lets try to make most of the clues we get.
    And... since most people do believe in God, there's no harm in at least trying to understand what people believe in, or what makes them wonder...
     
  8. Athelwulf Rest in peace Kurt... Registered Senior Member

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    Right there in black-and-white.

    So? If there isn't a god, they still wasted a portion of their lives praying and worshiping.

    Not for not believing in a god, but for doing good.

    No pretense here.

    You make no sense. I could tell you to stop pretending that unicorns don't exist. But ye'r not pretending, ya just don't believe that unicorns exist. Same with me and this God of yers.

    Don't think that everyone somehow knows there's some god out there, but just is pretending.

    Make the world a better place because there is a god? There's not much incentive there.

    And this God that so many people believe in, He's supposed to be omnibenevolant, yes? Well, it would be malevolant of Him to disregard the good deeds someone did if that someone wasn't a believer.
     
  9. mustafhakofi I sa'id so Registered Senior Member

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    it been done like that for centurys, it dont work religious people kill, the dark ages so called because of religion holding back humanity, it's about time common sense prevailed, get rid of false idols, and make the world for man a better place.

    "It is better to live your life with no false idols only your fellow man, and try to make the world a better place for your being in it. as there is no god, you have lost nothing and will be remembered fondly by those you left behind.
     
  10. KneD Le Penseur Registered Senior Member

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    Make the world a better place because you believe in God, indeed.
    I don't say he would disregard the good when they don't believe, but you can better be sure...
    That's my whole point. You don't know what to expect, better be sure

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    And he may be omnibenevolant (which is worth a huge discussion on itself), he is not omnipotent as far as the acting of us human individuals.
    But that's not the discussion here.

    P.S. I want to make clear that I am not writing from my own religious conviction, I am just trying to make the point that is most common among believers (christian)
     
  11. Athelwulf Rest in peace Kurt... Registered Senior Member

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    I repeat: There is no incentive there.

    If whatever god disregards good deeds because ya didn't believe, then that god is not worthy of worship.
     
  12. Laika Space Bitch Registered Senior Member

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    I'm going to live my life as if there's no God. If there is, on judgement day, when he pulls me up for it, I'm going to punch him in the eye for not giving us any evidence and making us take it on faith. It's so unfair. What a prick.
     
  13. Yorda Registered Senior Member

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    He has shown infinite amount of evidence but these are no longer valid to you because you see them every day and they have become "everyday things".
     
  14. Lord_Phoenix New World Order Registered Senior Member

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    Wheter you believe in god or not, how about we just help to make the world a better place? Why do services to god, when he/she is "all-powerful" (that is if "god" exists)? Service to your own kind is better because they need much more than "god" needs it.
     
  15. Laika Space Bitch Registered Senior Member

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    What is this evidence that I see every day? If you mean the world and the wider universe in general, I don't think that that qualifies as evidence of a sentient creator.
     
  16. Yorda Registered Senior Member

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    I guess so... but why not? There is no proof for the existence of God or against God, so it seems to be a good thing to neither believe or disbelieve.
     
  17. Athelwulf Rest in peace Kurt... Registered Senior Member

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    Laika . . . Funny post!

    Yorda, are you saying we should be Agnostic?
     
  18. cato less hate, more science Registered Senior Member

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    this is how I explain it to all my classmates:
    if god/gods exist they may punish you for believing the wrong thing. so if you simply don't follow anything they can hardly punish you for not wanting to be punished. moreover, if I live a good life, yet because I don't arbitrarily choose one religion over another, god should punish me then fuck god. you heard me, if god would be that spiteful and ignorant then I wouldn’t want him/her/it/they to own my soul anyway. I would rather end my existence than live in eternity under the thumb of something that is less logical than I am.
     
  19. Yorda Registered Senior Member

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    Athelwulf,

    No, we shouldn't be agnostic, we should be like little children who do not believe or disbelieve. We should be ourselves... we should find ourselves so that we realize that we are God so that we can be god... yesterday we were animals, plants and atoms gathering together for more unity... tomorrow we are christ... step by step we find our true self.
     
  20. Lord_Phoenix New World Order Registered Senior Member

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    Well, how can you do the right thing? What is right? This was the topic of my post like a month ago. Unless you can clearly define ethics, there is no point trying to argue over hell or heaven and the process of getting chosen to your final destination.
     
  21. spuriousmonkey Banned Banned

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    It seems rather silly to try to make the world a better place because you see this possibility that there might be a god and that you think that god will be lenient.

    You should live your life the way you think it ought to be lived and then live with the consequences. Otherwise you just live a big lie.
     
  22. Thersites Registered Senior Member

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    The problem is that a religious person's idea of a better place- a place where people follow The True Religion and other people are encouraged to follow it by various methods- is a nonreligious person's- and people who follow other religions'- idea of a worse place.
     
    Last edited: Mar 1, 2005
  23. Sarkus Hippomonstrosesquippedalo phobe Valued Senior Member

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    Ah, the "selfish" believer - only doing good because you want to get somewhere.

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    Why not do good deeds just because they're good deeds and will help people! Why do them just because you'll be judged at the end? Surely you'll forever be doing them for alterior motives? Which is ultimately selfish, no matter how "good" the deed.

    Ah well. I guess that's what religion does to you - turns you into ultimately selfish people.

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