Suffering Extreme Anxiety Because of LHC in CERN - Please Help

Discussion in 'The Cesspool' started by Michael83, Jan 8, 2008.

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  1. Michael83 Registered Member

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    To anyone who can help, please read.

    Firstly, I would like to introduce myself. My name is Michael, I am 24 years old, and I have come here to address some issues I'm having about LHC (Large Hardon Collider).

    I'm a very intelligent person, but I suffer from OCD and Anxiety disorder.

    My mind has a habit of forcefully attempting to comprehend extremely large ideas/thoughts, even ones it does not have the ability to comprehend or ones there is not clear answer to.

    In the past I have had suffered from large amounts of anxiety due to my questions about death, purpose of life, religious matters, and more recently science. I have managed to temporarily calm my fear of death, but that fear has been replaced with an intense fear of certain scientific matters, specific astronomy and extremely advanced areas of physics (such as what is being done as LHC).

    To give you an example of my thinking, I have an unquenchable thirst for knowledge. I often spend hours at a time reading Wikipedia. In college after my classwork was done, I would spend hours reading random books I found in the University library about every topic until the library closed. History, business, science, religion, philosophy, etc. Reading about astronomy, and outer space in general, and my mind's insistence on trying to comprehend these things in their full capacity, has led me to become absolutely terrified of reading about outer space or even looking at the stars. I only go out at night when it is cloudy, or if I must go out when the stars are out, I put my sun visor down (yes, at night) to keep from seeing the stars. Everytime I look at them I keep trying to grasp my mind around the incredible proportions in which stars exist. To think I'm looking at something so far away, it took the light itself years to reach me is literally mind bending and induces an incredible amount of anxiety on me. Or trying to comprehend the power of a supernova or a black hole. Impossible given the limited comprehension our minds have. But my brain insists on trying, which most of the time makes me feel disconnected from reality and out of touch with human emotion and engulfed in anxiety.

    But I've managed to calm my fears of the stars recently, at least to a livable extent, although I still hide from them.

    More recently I have read about LHC and it's potential to do harm. I understand that thousands of the world's best physicists are working on this project. However I feel as though we are entering a era in science where we are running too far into the unknown without first taking due caution. The blind and unquenchable thirst for discovery by scientists has made safety and respect for mother nature take a back seat.

    I would compare it to a chemist experimenting in a lab with the lights out. We "think" we remember where we put everything. We "think" certain things are as they seem. But there exists that possibility that we could be wrong. Our mind have limited ability. Limited comprehension. And science may or may not have an entirely new world of undiscovered laws, possibilities, and logical reasonings that we are not familiar with that lie beyond a threshold that we have not yet crossed, but may be close to crossing. I am reminded of the familiar situation in cartoons where a given character walks into a house or some other set unknowing of something very large or dangerous in their presence because they mistake it for something small - like the tiger who happens to be lying next to the fireplace, but Elmer Phud thought it was just a rug and decided to take a nap on it (my cartoon recollection is fuzzy, but I'm sure you understand the concept of the situation I'm trying to describe).

    Anyway, but my main point is that we have not yet discovered the the complete "circle of life" in regards to science. How everything fits together. How everything is explained.

    I am tortured with fear everyday thinking about the LHC. What terrible unknowns it could open, even if the possibilities are microscopic, why are we risking it?

    My frustration is even further compounded when thinking that there is little real benefits to society this project with achieve besides adding more pages to textbooks. Save me the idealistic "go where no man has gone before" nonsense.

    I hope that my extreme anxiety is the worst thing that will come out of this machine. I cannot tell you all the trouble it has caused me. I'm afraid to die. And I love this Earth and I love my life, even with all the problems I've had.
     
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  3. Frud11 Banned Banned

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    Michael83: Are you concerned that the LHC might create something (some new kind of matter) that might destroy, or consume the planet?

    Like the story that they are trying to create a black hole? This is only theory, and if it happened, there's only so much energy that can be injected into an accelerator ring--so whatever comes out is what went in. The idea is basically to collide things together (hadrons or atoms), and "see what happens".
    But two bits of matter colliding head-on will become mostly energy, briefly, then decay into other equivalent bits of matter and energy. The experiments are about finding out what gets created in collisions like this (high-energy collisions, where the particles are traveling close to the speed of light).

    If a black hole was created (which would need a perfect or inelastic collision) it wouldn't last very long, like anything else they look for, most "exotic" particles have a very brief existence, against the current background, or energy density of the universe.

    I'd say there really isn't much to worry about.
    I'd be more concerned about them reading your thoughts--and I'd be looking at counter-measures; tinfoil doesn't actually work all that well. (Ignore the last bit--I'm kidding)

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    P.S. I once suffered from an anxiety condition (I thought I could hear birds talking, and telling me off, and voices--real people actually talking--seemed to always be directed at me, somehow. I think it's called paranoia, which is a kind of delusion). I thank the practice of a certain kind of Yoga, and possibly the fact that I'm intelligent enough to realise it was all in my head, as it were, for my "recovery".
     
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  5. Michael83 Registered Member

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    Thank you for your reply, it means a lot of me.

    I am concerned about the possibilities brought up by WL Wagner (who I believe is a member of this forum). Stranglets, opening a new dimension, tiggering some reaction similar to a atom bomb (where a small amount of energy sets off a massive amount of energy, eg where the small initial explosion ignites the larger nuclear explosion).

    I don't want the world to turn in a massive ball of unstable matter or some other similar extreme situation. I'm not an expert on science like most of you. It scares me and leaves me disconnect from humanity. I'm into history and philosophy, the social sciences. But I'm very good at inventing very abstract/extreme/unusual scenarios in my mind and I cannot help but do that whenever I think of LHC.

    I feel like everyone is saying, "Oh nothing will happen...probably."
     
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2008
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  7. Frud11 Banned Banned

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    You need to do two things about your worries: don't take it so seriously, and take (some of) it more seriously, if you see what I mean.

    Don't take what others have to say as seriously (as you appear to), since, if you think about it, they are the only ones who think they have to (this includes me).

    And seriously start looking at more than forums like this, if you want to know about what "they" are up to. There are plenty of papers and journals where the "real thing" is getting gotten on with every day, available to you and me.

    Don't concern yourself with the math (some of the language you come across in these published papers), just read the words. The math comes later, if you really want to look at that much detail. But don't believe everything you read in a journal either.

    There are some very easy ways to get to look at this stuff, and some post bits of it now and then. Just plug some big words into google, the more words, the fewer hits.
    But do at at your leisure, type of thing. It isn't the end of the world yet, but then some things look set to happen at some point, that will have a big change on how many of us live, and use energy, and so on. We're always between the good stuff technology delivers, and the effects it has on the world. It's kind of all connected, you know?
     
  8. Xelios We're setting you adrift idiot Registered Senior Member

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    These are things a lot of people think about. I know when I look at stars I find myself thinking about those same things, trying to comprehend scales my mind just can't handle. The difference is for me these things are exciting and wonderous.

    I won't talk about the LHC itself because it doesn't seem to be the source of your fear. For you it seems to boil down to something simple. Fear of the unknown. Many people have it, some more severely than others, and diagnoses like OCD or Anxiety Disorder are just other words for it. Like any phobia it's not a disease or condition which you have no control over, but rather a state of mind that you can change, albeit not easily. This is explained very well in Robert Anton Wilson's book Prometheus Rising and I really recommend you read it.
     
  9. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

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    That is the problem in a nutshell.
     
  10. 15ofthe19 35 year old virgin Registered Senior Member

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    1,588
    I would think some combination of Levitra and Viagra could help you with that sort of problem. And you would certainly be a hit with the ladies. You should honestly think about marketing the Hardon Collider.
     
  11. spidergoat Valued Senior Member

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    Michael83, it's certainly probable the Large Hardon Collider will cause a black hole to open under it, swallowing the Earth in an unprecedented catastrophic conflagration.

    I would also look into HAARP.
     
  12. cosmictraveler Be kind to yourself always. Valued Senior Member

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    Please watch...

    http://youtube.com/watch?v=deFp4JtfR4w
     
  13. Michael83 Registered Member

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    I'm not sure what you mean by this or what you think I should take seriously. Please advise.
     
  14. Michael83 Registered Member

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    Ok, how does your statement help me?
     
  15. Michael83 Registered Member

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    Ok, it's a photo slideshow, what's the point? To scare me more?
     
  16. spidergoat Valued Senior Member

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    I'm not trying to assuage your irrational fears. There are so many things one could be worried about, you need to focus on your problem, not the problem of dangerous experiments (which the supercollider isn't). There's lead in our toys, global warming, fascist politicians, diseases of all kinds, the world is full of things that can harm you.

    You don't know that. Knowing the nature of matter and energy is no small accomplishment, and could lead to all sorts of practical applications.
     
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2008
  17. cosmictraveler Be kind to yourself always. Valued Senior Member

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    To let you see how very well constructed it is. There's safeguards built in so that if anything should happen it automatically shuts itself off.
     
  18. BenTheMan Dr. of Physics, Prof. of Love Valued Senior Member

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    8,967
    I agree with what most people are saying.

    The LHC WILL turn on, trust me. Most physicists who study the problem (and I know many such physicists) don't really take the possibility seriously that black holes could form at the LHC.

    Why don't you worry about asteroids hitting the earth, or the failing load support beams in your building, or the gnomes that steal your underwear at night, or the Illuminati. If the world ends when the LHC turns on, then it ends---there's nothing to be done. Make sure you go to church. Baptize your kids. Sacrifice some goats. Smoke some pot and commune with Jah.

    The thing is, humans are curious enough so that the LHC, or something like it, will eventually be turned on. And if it means a cataclysmic end to humanity, then at least we gave it a good run.
     
  19. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

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    Michael83:

    It can be helpful to think about probabilities in this kind of case. What are the chances, estimated by qualified physicists, that the LHC will create a black hole or otherwise cause an accident big enough to create real danger for the Earth? And how does that risk compare to the kinds of risks you experience every day, such as the risk of being hit by a car as you cross the street, or being struck by lightning?

    The answer is that physicists estimate that the chances of the LHC getting "out of control" in ANY way are absolutely minuscule. The LHC requires a constant input of energy to do its thing. If anything weird started to happen, a flick of a switch would shut the thing down. Of course, there's always the unexpected, but truly unexpected events in physics that are actually dangerous are very very very rare indeed. The bottom line is that your worries about the LHC are actually out of all proportion to the real risk.

    Some people worry about flying in a plane - what if the plane crashes? Like your LHC worries, their worries are vastly out of proportion to the risk. Statistically, you are far more likely to die in a car accident on the way to the airport than to die in a horrific air crash. So, why are so many people scared of flying? Because when an air crash does happen (and they are becoming increasingly rare when you take into account the constantly increasing numbers of plane flights) more than a few people tend to be killed. You see it all on the news. You hear all the time about air crashes in other countries. How often do you here about car accidents in other countries? (They are FAR more common.)

    If I had to rank the chances of YOU, personally, being killed by various events, and list them in order of highest probability to lowest, my list might look like this:

    1. Having a heart attack.
    2. Tripping on some stairs and hitting your head.
    3. Falling over and hitting your head on a sharp table edge in your house.
    4. Being involved in a fatal car accident.
    5. Being involved in a plane crash.
    6. Getting hit by lightning.
    7. Dying in a terrorist attack (assuming that you live in the US).
    8. Being hit by an atomic bomb.
    9. Dying because the LHC creates a black hole which swallows the Earth.

    Your chances of death at number 1 are probably millions of times greater than death at number 9 on this list. And looking at the end of the list, consider how many people you know personally who have been killed by lightning. I'm guessing the number is none. But your chances of being killed by a lightning strike are far far greater than being killed by an Al Qaeda attack or by the LHC exploding.

    Does that help at all?
     
  20. spidergoat Valued Senior Member

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    OK, here is something that will help. Think about a particular fear. Is it in the future? Than it doesn't exist. Is it in the past? Also, doesn't exist. Is it in the present? Then you must deal with it rather than worry about it.
     
  21. Chatha big brown was screwed up Registered Senior Member

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    Seriously though Mike, I'd be concerned about some terrorists or burglar guy chasing me with a machette. The experts say there is a low chance of uncontrollable catastrophe so there has to be a low chance. Think about the discoveries from the experiment and you shold feel better. I used to suffer from anxiety too, until I found something to occupy myself with, I think everybody suffers from anxiety(especially around that age) at one point. At least we can blame physicists if anything happens, which I guarantee you, it won't. I'm interested in the high priest's (Billy T's) opinion.
     
  22. sly1 Heartless Registered Senior Member

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    hows that a problem? the very stuff you learned in school and claim to "know" came from people who had this...."problem"
     
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2008
  23. Frud11 Banned Banned

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    I was kidding about the aluminum--it does work, right?
    Well, no-one is sure (about anything), just look at all the "discussion" going on about the weather lately.

    All you need to do is think about something--some words--type them into the required location (use a good web search engine), and press the magic button. Lots of links are displayed, but if you keep adding words, usually the number decreases. Sometimes it don't, or it increases. You need to choose the words with a bit of care. If you see terminology you haven't seen before, try an online dictionary.

    If you can read English, there's more stuff than you can get through in several lifetimes. Not all "good oil", of course. But peer-reviewed is usually reliable or fit for the purpose. I call different combinations of words "googlemes". (see if that pops up).
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2008
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