Stop!....grammar time.

Discussion in 'Linguistics' started by outlandish, Nov 21, 2006.

  1. outlandish smoki'n....... Registered Senior Member

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    you must have an excellent grasp of grammar, all those formal business letters you write.
     
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  3. one_raven God is a Chinese Whisper Valued Senior Member

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    Who is a subjective pronoun.
    Whom is an objective pronoun.

    Who gave the finger to whom?

    "Who" is the subject of the sentence (the subject is that which is performing the action).
    "Whom" is the object of the sentence (the object is that which the action is directed toward).
    It gets a little more complicated, but that's the jist of it.

    Now my turn for a question.

    "A" or "An".
    "An" is supposed to be used before a vowel sound.
    That is an elephant.
    "A" is supposed to be used before a consonant sound.
    That is a radio.
    Regardless of the first letter, "An" is supposed to be used before a vowel sound.
    It was an honorary degree.

    So, why is "That is an historical fact." correct? While "That is a hippopotamus." also correct?
     
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  5. Absane Rocket Surgeon Valued Senior Member

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  7. outlandish smoki'n....... Registered Senior Member

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    it's satan's tool I'm telling you.

    at least with numbers you know where you stand
     
  8. Sandoz Girl Named Sandoz Registered Senior Member

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    Excellent!
     
  9. tablariddim forexU2 Valued Senior Member

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    It's a song for fuck's sake. Songs aren't meant to be gramatically correct, lyrics are meant to sit confortably in the groove s'all.
     
  10. one_raven God is a Chinese Whisper Valued Senior Member

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    Anytime, man.
    I love language.
     
  11. Kendall ......................... ..... Registered Senior Member

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    She is rich, so she coulden't have meant herself unless she meant in her past. "were" dont sound as good. It is gramatically correct, when in context between what would have been different if she was rich!
     
    Last edited: Nov 21, 2006
  12. SoLiDUS OMGWTFBBQ Registered Senior Member

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    its juss gewd practise,
     
  13. Ghost_007 Registered Senior Member

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    I thought you have to base it on the letter - sound being irrelevant!

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    A honorary degree - sounds funny
    An honorary degree - flows

    So if it sounds right you stick ‘an’ b4 it?
     
  14. outlandish smoki'n....... Registered Senior Member

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    the shirt, or the bimbo in the shirt?
     
  15. Absane Rocket Surgeon Valued Senior Member

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    Both.
     
  16. one_raven God is a Chinese Whisper Valued Senior Member

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    Nope, it is the sound, not the letter.
    "Honorary" starts with the same "o" vowel sound as "on", therefore it is "an honorary".
    This still doesn't explain why "an historical fact" is correct, unless you speak with an English cockneyed accent and pronounce it "istorical", but then "an History lesson" would be correct, but it is not.
    I've been trying to get this question answered for years.
    Even my fiance who holds a degree in English can't give me an answer.

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  17. one_raven God is a Chinese Whisper Valued Senior Member

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    AMEN!!
     
  18. Absane Rocket Surgeon Valued Senior Member

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    If you could ever find an answer, it would solve one of the many things that plague me. I've always felt uncomfortable using "an" for written word that starts out sounding like a vowel. "An honest man" sounds right, but written it seems to make more sense writing it as "a honest man." Maybe it's because I am a visual reader and I don't sound out words in my head when I read.

    However, I suppose it's because language started out spoken and we had rules for that. To remain consistant, we write like we speak.
     
  19. one_raven God is a Chinese Whisper Valued Senior Member

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    It may have something to do with the role of the "H" in olde-middle English, but I think it is simply because "a honorary" is cumbersome sounding

    Still that begs the question why "an historical" and "a history".

    hmmmm....
    According to this grammar guide...

    This site sheds some light onto it...

    So people WOULD pronounce history and istorical?
    That makes more sense, but still...

    Is there no steadfast rule regarding pronouncing the "H" in words which the first syllable is not stressed?
     
  20. Ghost_007 Registered Senior Member

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    Thank youuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu.

    lol @ cockneyed accent - 'istorical'

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  21. Ghost_007 Registered Senior Member

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    actually you should never write 'should of' or 'could of' (though thats how we speak) when writing its always 'should have' or 'could have'.

    And never use the word 'nice' when writing.

    sweet memories, lol.
     
  22. NightFall Lazy Hedonist Valued Senior Member

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    now im confused. i thought the verb had to be opposite the noun...

    ok.. im trying to do french class backwards here...

    I were = future conditional. undefined situation.
    I was = set situation with an end an a beginning.

    for example: I was in the car, now i am not.
    i never saw that car.. but.. if i were in the car then, i wouldnt be now.

    since you were never in the car, and it didnt take place, there is no definate situation.

    there for if gwen really had been rich (which does kinda make the song poitles.. since she is rich)(((((note the "had been" for undefined)))))

    she would say:
    When i WAS rich.. and then i blew it all on coke.
    but since were pretneding she isnt..
    its: If I were rich, i would blow it all on coke.



    =) five years of french, just to learn more about english. heh.
     
  23. redarmy11 Registered Senior Member

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    7,658
    Thanks for explaining why the lyrics as written feel wrong. And that's why grammar is important (he says, starting his sentence with 'And'). It's because, if you have a basic understanding of grammar (mine's average), and a love of language, some constructions just feel out of place. They jump out at you and hit you in the head. The resulting pain is almost physical.

    Besides, I can't stand Gwen Stefani.
     

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