Star Trek transporter: Possible?

Discussion in 'Physics & Math' started by Dinosaur, May 14, 2002.

?

Your opinion on Star Trek transporter.

  1. Never thot it was possible & still do not.

    10 vote(s)
    26.3%
  2. Thot is was possible, but have changed my mind.

    2 vote(s)
    5.3%
  3. I believe it is possible, but very unlikely.

    15 vote(s)
    39.5%
  4. I think it is likely to be invented & used.

    3 vote(s)
    7.9%
  5. I expect it to be invented and used in the future.

    8 vote(s)
    21.1%
  1. Pete It's not rocket surgery Moderator

    Messages:
    10,166
    I'm with Nasor. The SciAm argument reminds me of the creationist argument against the evolution of haemoglobin - it seems to deliberately misrepresent the necessary process.

    Mind you, I still think it's pretty impossible. And as other posters have said, there are interesting metaphysical issues involved as well. Perhaps it would be more productive to consider whether the Star Trek replicator is a possible technology?
     
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  3. AvrilFanGZ Registered Member

    Messages:
    1
    What are we using to determine our beliefs?

    Let us first remember that the brains we currently think with arent even fully developed. If we either evlove to make concious use of a larger percentage, or focus our studies on developing control of a larger percentage, then perhaps we'd have a much better judgement of what is or is not believable.

    As of now, my belief is that we are only limited by our imagination. Once we imagine something we can attempt, its just a matter of time before we accomplish it. Right now we can only build with the eliments we have here on earth and what we can synthesize in a lab... and we can only apply what we understand of earth's physics and comprehend things using what senses we currently have. Now, what if we exceed these earthly limitations??

    Note that our species really started to develop when we created a means of recording things. The alphabet allowed for this, and then we could store data in a library of knowledge, and now thats extended to the internet where anyone can access an overwhelming amount of data. Dare I say limitless amounts??

    The key to accomplishing things we think are impossible lies in developing our brains. Just being able to read faster and maintain accurate memory could be a simple first step. If we could pass down this ability through heredity and our species evolved to just do this naturally, then we'll know what we're capable of; Then we'll have enhanced our ability to 'learn.'
     
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  5. Pandaemoni Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    3,631

    We use all of our brains, we just don't use all of it at once. The "10% of your brain" thing is a myth.

    http://faculty.washington.edu/chudler/tenper.html

    It's always possibly that we will evolve into a more intelligent species later on, but there's no dormant special powers or extra intelligence that's somehow "waiting" to be unlocked in the average person.
     
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  7. kmguru Staff Member

    Messages:
    11,757
    I do not think brain will develop by itself based on nature. The natural development depends on natural stresses such as asteroid stike and other disasters. However, the brain can be developed by us through gene manipulation.

    Presently, you can boost your brain capacity using chemicals - turbo charge it so to speak, but to really improve, gene manipulation is necessary and that can be done to the future generations. It is like you have a Pentium II, you can only boost the speed. To get to Xeon or beyond, you need new design.

    Until we get to a 10 or 100 or 1000 times the brain capability, we may not invent certain things, even though we can imagine the result.

    I think, we naturally went from Pentium II to III after the last ice age. But going to a 64bit quad core and beyond will depend on us. If we can not get there, that is, there isa limitation to organic life forms, may be we should start thinking about silicon based life....
     
  8. pencil Banned Banned

    Messages:
    181
    A transporter is possible but highly unlikely for the time-being. You'd have to stabilize space-time form. At the tiniest sub-atomic level, the fabric of space and time becomes so unstable that it starts to behave like a foam (called the quantum state: space-time foam). Within this object, there's wormholes.

    You need to stabilize the space-time foam long enough to make one of the wormholes permanent. The way to do that is to apply enormous amounts of energy (nothing at the moment can apply this amount of energy, in fact you'd have to build a particle accelerator in SPACE to achieve that kind of energy). After you get the wormhole stabilized, you'd have to enlarge it using negative energy.
     
  9. kmguru Staff Member

    Messages:
    11,757
    Since it is already theorized that we live in a multi-dimensional multi-verse, how about jumping through a dimension? Create a space-time bubble around the object and send that object through that dimension.

    Whatever gizmo is used, I am sure, it will not take too much energy to move matter from Point A to Point B, simply because we will find a way similar to people jumping vs. people moving in height using a helicopter vs. people moving in X-axis at 75 mph using a car. All those movements do require energy more than one human power, but it is within our scientific achievement.

    We are yet to find out what say 100 Tesla or a 1000 Tesla will do to space-time. Who knows, we will find a phase transition and new physics....
     
  10. Arachnakid Linguist-In-Training Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    35
    That was my thought. If the transporter was something like the replicator, it might work, but they would need the material to build people and good already on the ship, and that to me makes it highly unlikely. It could be useful for people, but shipments of goods would probably still have to be physically loaded and unloaded.
     
  11. Saxion Banned Banned

    Messages:
    264
    I doubt it is possible.

    The atom configuration after dissasemblement would be near impossible. We can't even track all the atoms in a dice, never mind some sophisticated device capable of reassembling all the particles of the human body.
     
  12. slider Registered Member

    Messages:
    2
    If I wanted to get into this field of study what degree program should I enter into and which schools could anybody recommened?
     
  13. kmguru Staff Member

    Messages:
    11,757
    Physics, material science, and electrical engineering
     
  14. slider Registered Member

    Messages:
    2
    Hey, Thanks for the info. This is the field of study I want to get into and this will help a lot.
     
  15. MikeO Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    46
    Teleportation, computing power, selfhood, information...

    If anyone is interested in seeing the absolutely ultimate exercise in this kind of extrapolative thinking it is all in Frank Tipler’s 1994 book “The Physics of Immortality.”

    Before dismissing the title of his book, check out who Tipler is. He has taken this kind of thinking into an art form unimaginable until a few hours are actually spent in his book. All I can say is it’s orders of magnitude beyond imagination.
     
  16. jjdon Registered Member

    Messages:
    1
    I was out looking for something, and happened on this - long story short. I'll also point people to physforum.com, where there is or was a similar discussion. I registered just to post this, because it's useful - I won't be back, so don't expect replies.

    20 or more years ago I read an article by a physicist about this very topic. He didn't even get to the things discussed here, or the things on physforum (souls, cloning....) He just said something more fundamental, and also showed much of his proof, which I do not remember - I also might be misremembering it in detail. Anyway: Using today's technology (20 years ago, but we still use the same essential methods), to put each atom of the human body into a single memory address would require all the matter in the known universe. You could argue that he's wrong by half, which means only 1/2 of the known universe. And yes, methods of computer storage will certainly evolve. That means an order of quadrillions cubed and cubed again to get to the point of storing it in the size of the Earth, much less a server the size of a desk. And of course that doesn't include mapping or algorithms for doing the actual process, since we don't know that stuff yet, anyway. Just thought I'd put it out there...... He simply figured the number of atoms in the body, which is roughly known (though I don't know that number) and how much disk it takes to store data, and that's what he came up with, in essence. No real mystery, just arithmatic.
     
  17. daplet Registered Member

    Messages:
    2
    Is transporter on star trek even possible?

    Very simple to answer....Forget about what makes you you (memory/knowledge/personality ,all things without substance) And Lets say computer,s have the speed and memory and the Heisenberg compensater worked,The simple fact is once your body is turned to energy your dead,and what would be at your intended destination at best would be a copy of you body but have no life.
     
  18. Dywyddyr Penguinaciously duckalicious. Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    18,511
    Why?
    Explain this "simple fact" please.
     
  19. chinglu Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,637
    What proof do you have that we live in a > 3 d space model?
     
    Last edited: Oct 6, 2011
  20. daplet Registered Member

    Messages:
    2
    I thought i answered that.
     
  21. Dywyddyr Penguinaciously duckalicious. Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    18,511
    No. You made a claim. That's all.
     
  22. Michael 歌舞伎 Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    20,285
    WoW 2002..... amazing

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    I voted YES, mainly because the future is long and I expect humans to be more machine than man

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    in the coming millennial. A simple download and away we go....
     
  23. hardalee Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    341
    Maybe, I don't think so but, maybe.

    The transporter would require that it be a quantum copier or cloner.

    See the paper at this link for more information: http://ejde.math.txstate.edu/conf-proc/04/h1/hillery.pdf

    If it could be done wiithout distroying the subject in the process, we could duplicate everything and everyone.

    It would lead to a very different world.

    On second thought, I hope it is not possible.
     

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