Spanking Lowers IQ Points

Discussion in 'Science & Society' started by Orleander, Sep 25, 2009.

  1. cluelusshusbund + Public Dilemma + Valued Senior Member

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    Hay RandWolf... do you have any scientifec evidence that slappin a kids face is ever a good thang.???

    A study in suport of both sides has been presented (big surprize... lol)... but the anecdotes from both sides have been quite instructive... an you gave plenty of anecdotal evidence you'rself... includin how you raized Wolfs... LOL.!!!

    Below is snips from the post you refered to earlier... an you have said that you only advocate hittin a child when thers a clear an present danger... well in the story you present below... you hit her after the threat of danger had passed :bugeye:

    http://www.sciforums.com/showpost.php?p=2385015&postcount=99

    Yes it was you who peaked her interest in the hot iron... an when she demonstrated that she didnt fully understan what hot ment... that woud have been the perfect time to esplane to her that thangs dont have to be red to be hot... ther was no clear an present danger... an hittin her an makin her cry was totaly unnecesary.!!!
     
    Last edited: Dec 2, 2009
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  3. Randwolf Ignorance killed the cat Valued Senior Member

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    No. The only possibility that comes to mind would be a child biting and holding on - and it would probably be a mistake in that it was a reflex more than a calculated punishment. Happy?


    Yes - I know - Orly provided one, I provided 8 to refute. I believe someone (Shorty?) mentioned some sort of TV documentation. None of these were followed up, the thread may as well have been opened with "Is it a good thing to spank your kids? Any comments?" You would have gotten the same results...


    Yes, the discussion drifted over to animal behavior mentioned by myself and another poster (sorry, forget who now). This was in a misguided attempt to correlate some facets of animal training with that of young children. I believe you had a bit of a problem with comprehension during that part of the discussion, and Orly made it clear to the other poster that "This thread is not about dogs". It's her thread, so I stayed away from this side of the argument. I still believe there are valid parallels that can be drawn from animal training to young children, but apparently that's a topic for another thread.

    This is an out and out lie, not to mention a cross post from another thread. You really do appear to have some reading comprehension issues. Plus, it would be polite to actually quote my post about which you are making these allegations. Here, read it again carefully.

    http://www.sciforums.com/showpost.php?p=2385015&postcount=99
    Notice that there was "clear and present danger":
    Now realize a couple of things that may have escaped your notice the first time through. In this situation, you have maybe one second to react. She attempted to touch an extremely hot steam iron twice. I tried startling her, which put a momentary stop to her hand motion, but she never lowered her hand, so she is now about 4" from the surface. As her hand began to move again, for whatever reason... I don't even care if you want to say I should have handled the first part of the incident in some other way.

    My question for you, Clueluss, is this:
    Put yourself in this position - your child's hand is 4" from a very hot, very dangerous steam iron. You already know that you can't stop her hand moving by startling her with your voice. What do you do? You now have 1/2 of one second to decide... Aww, time's up while you read those last 9 words - too late...

    Not exactly a time or place for a nice, warm, intelligent conversation with a 4 year old, hmmm, Clueluss?

    So what do you do? Grab the iron out of the way? Maybe you trust your coordination enough to grab the handle without moving the iron forward in the slightest and snag it back out of range - I don't. See, my primary consideration is stopping my daughter from being burned, perhaps seriously! Now this is a feeling you have never experienced, never in your life. Just like you have never seen your (older) child cry out "Help, I'm drowning" or watch her go over the edge of a ski slope. (Thank God for the ledge that was there about four foot down) You have no f8cking idea, and don't start whining about the babysitting again. You just don't know - period.

    Anyway, I chose, in that 1/2 second, to slap her hand out of the way and physically grab her up off the floor while turning away from the iron. Yes, all that commotion made her cry. However, she wasn't crying an hour later because her "hand burned so bad", "daddy, please make it stop". I'm sorry, buddy, but you really are, literally "Clueluss" about this kind of stuff. It's not your fault, you never had kids. Fine, but stop trying to be an authority on something you're not, stop insulting people by implying that you could do a better job of raising their kids than they did and stop telling me that I made a wrong decision in the half second available to me. It's ludicrous that this should have to be broken down like this for anyone, but I guess some people...

    Now, to continue on with the story... I of course turned the iron off, and devoted my attention to my daughter. Rocking her, and telling her "it's OK baby", etc. till she calmed down. You see, Clueless, she wasn't crying from being "abused", or from the pain of her hand being slapped. She was scared. Precisely the reaction that needs to be instilled in everyone, at some level, regarding fire.

    Anyway, by this time, the iron had cooled. Now I had the opportunity for "show and tell", on top of the conversation we had already had. I turned the iron on very low, explained to her that it would start to warm up very quickly, and let her touch it. Guess what? After about 5 seconds, she yanked her hand back - no burn. Her reaction? A giggle... And we lived happily ever after...

    Bottom line? Faced with the same situation, same circumstances, I would do the exact same thing again! Oh, and then, if it happened again with yet another child, guess what? I would do it again.

    You see, this is why this thread is not going to go anywhere. You have a pretty clear division amongst parents and non-parents, with a few dissenters on both sides of course. The parents are going to keep saying the same thing, as are the armchair philosophers whom have never faced any of this crap. No possibility for consensus, and unless I missed it, no converts either way. For example, I just took the time to spell out in great detail for you the "incident with the hot iron". I have taken more time to explain this to you in multiple threads than the whole issue with my daughter took, and she was only four or five. But you know what? She got it. You won't.

    Now don't bother replying with any more questions, because I have no desire to waste any further time with you over this. I have done my best to explain everything, and I wouldn't have answered this post accept for the out and out lie that you threw in. Stop lying, and go find something else to do. Good day.
     
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  5. jpappl Valued Senior Member

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    Rand,

    Which is why I am done here.
     
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  7. cluelusshusbund + Public Dilemma + Valued Senior Member

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    Origionaly posted by clueluss husbund
    Below is snips from the post you refered to earlier... an you have said that you only advocate hittin a child when thers a clear an present danger... well in the story you present below... you hit her after the threat of danger had passed

    http://www.sciforums.com/showpost.php?p=2385015&postcount=99


    Yes it was you who peaked her interest in the hot iron... an when she demonstrated that she didnt fully understan what hot ment... that woud have been the perfect time to esplane to her that thangs dont have to be red to be hot... ther was no clear an present danger... an hittin her an makin her cry was totaly unnecesary.!!!
    ---------------------

    Below... Randwolf changes his story <snickers>

    LOL at RandWolf... you changed you'r story... heres the esact quote the firs time you tolt it:::

    "I grabbed her wrist, slapped her hand, and yelled "NO!"

    Now you'r clamin you meerly slaped her hand out of the way of the hot iron... in other words... that the "slap" wasnt ment as punishment

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    Thanks for the chuckle... but in answr to you'r queston about what i woud have done... grabbin her wrist was oK... but un-like you... i woudnt have been interested in punishin her by slappin her hand... my focus woud haave been on keepin her from gettin burned.!!!

    Here a tip... in the future... keep a young child out of reach of dangerous thangs such as hot steem irons... or the red-hot stove burner she got burnt on prevously.!!!

    Edit:::

    I clicked on the link i posted an read you'r complete post... an below is the las paart of that post whare you admited you was "spankin" her hand... an in the las line of you'r post... you say "screw you" to those who thank thers never a place for corporal punishment... LOL.!!!

    Yep... the clear an present danger had passed but you still applied "corporal punishment" by slappin her hand

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    I thank if all spankers woud honestly examine the situatons in which they whipped ther children... many of 'em woud be able to see that at leas som of those corporal punishments wasnt necesary.!!!
     
    Last edited: Dec 2, 2009
  8. Randwolf Ignorance killed the cat Valued Senior Member

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    I told you I'm done - you sir are a straight up liar... :bugeye:
     
  9. Orleander OH JOY!!!! Valued Senior Member

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    Liar or loon.

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  10. visceral_instinct Monkey see, monkey denigrate Valued Senior Member

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    Yeah my stepfather did occasionally dole out a slap as opposed to just threatening death/coma/broken skull in a red faced overblown manner.

    I think I was about 8/9.

    The 2 or 3 times he tried that, it didn't incline me to respect him. It inclined me to kick him or attack him with my nails.

    I don't react to things in the usual way, though. I am very ASDlike, and I didn't see a slap as a punishment to avoid. I saw it as a violation of my dignity. I hated anyone touching me in any way, even my mother. I'd recoil if she tried to give me a hug. So, I can't exactly say my reaction was that of a typical kid.

    (I had a HUGE obsession with cats at that age. I talked about them all the time...and cut my nails into elongated points to resemble a cat's claws. If I felt that someone was threatening me, an older kid usually, I'd curl my fingers, pull a fighting stance a la Wolverine, and let fly. I once tore a mole off my stepfather's face with those.)
     
    Last edited: Dec 5, 2009
  11. ripleofdeath Registered Senior Member

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    2,762

    sounds like your parents went a bit off the rails or something did and you never got corrective therapy, probably your parents carried guilt for it and you detected that every time they tried to show hollow affection/pity so you tried to kill it because it was actual abuse.

    very common behaviour actually.
    and

    can have a lasting effect for the childs entire life effecting all relationships
     

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