# So When Will MAC DIE!!!

Discussion in 'Computer Science & Culture' started by Eggsited, Feb 3, 2004.

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1. ### EggsitedRegistered Senior Member

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Apple Macintosché or what ever they call it

Yearly sales OF near 100,000 make up somthing like 2-5% or PC market if memory serves

with 2 CPU cores and heat sinks that can cool a train engine
and a watt'ige that will make your parents wanna kill you
and only comparable performance

tipicle of mac's

"unlike competing instruction sets, the PowerPC architecture was designed from the beginning to run both 32-bit and 64-bit application code"
AMD 64, FX can do this - a marketing lie

bosting twin 2GHz cores with 1GHz front side bus - sounds good but wait
how do they justifie ATI RADEON 9600 Pro with 64MB DDR SDRAM - witch is sh*t - even better
NVIDIA GeForce FX 5200 Ultra with 64MB DDR SDRAM - these sell for £50
whats the point!

and are not the most powerful computers on the planet - another marketing lie witch caused many sites on the net to halt selling mac hardware

and they are genraly extreemly expensive

credit given to IBM thought

3. ### Wrong RobotRegistered Senior Member

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Does someone care to translate what the hell that post said?

something about computers I think, but with all the spelling errors and gobbledegook It was too much of a bother to read.

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11. ### TiassaLet us not launch the boat ...Staff Member

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We might also remember that the computer industry needs Apple. Where Steve goes, Bill follows. Where Bill follows, open-source adapts. It's part of what makes OSX so damn neat, incidentally, because now open-source, a traditional innovator, has the ability to feed more directly into Apple's worldview.

Imagine an operating system on which a 233 processor can download from the internet while processing large sound files for rock album, and the computer does not have to be rebooted for over a year.

Now imagine that operating system is a beta running on a computer that, it turns out, the OS is not supposed to run cleanly on.

Lastly, imagine a blue first-generation iMac with a tray-loading CD-ROM, lasting nearly six years until a power surge in an ill-wired apartment complex wrecked the monitor, as well as two other computers (PC's, for what it's worth) in the complex; all had surge protectors. So you borrow a friend's computer, hop online, go to Apple's website, and there are simple, pictoral instructions on how to disconnect the integrated monitor and hook up an external. Turns out the video board survived, and the computer is actually still in use somewhere as a file server.

Welcome to OSX. Welcome to Apple.

The Mac will only die if Steve decides it should in order to bring us something that much different, that much better. And while that possibility is one he's aware of, he has awfully high standards, and whatever would replace the Mac is inconceivable to most of us, and perhaps to Steve as well.

12. ### Wrong RobotRegistered Senior Member

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That's a whole other can of worms all together, If it weren't for apple, windows would really be terrible. XP has made leaps and bounds at improving the OS, but it still is pretty damn far behind OS X in many areas, not to mention that longhorn is a good 2-4 years away and by that time apple may very well have reached OS XI.

Apple is the trend setter, and they are constantly evolving, the rest of the market simply mimics(quite poorly too) what apple puts out. Does Apple need MS? yes, does MS need Apple, yes. If MS didn't need Apple, then they wouldn't continue to support Word after their contractual obligations ended 2 years ago.

There are things about Apple computers that are more expensive, but the value of OS X alone is worth far more than they charge. That's not to mention the amazing applications that all their computers come with.

But, if gaming is your thing, go ahead and use windows, that's about all it's good for in my opinion, and even that is starting to change as more devs get their hands on the g5.

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Apple made $60 million in profits this last quarter. OS X fits my needs like a f*cking glove. Solid zsh, Java as a first class citizen, prettiest user interface hands down, Microsoft Office, and did I mention the z shell? . . . no cygwin crap here . . . feels as if I was on a Unix/Linux box, also a solid browser (in my opinion better than both mozilla and IE). The 17 in. Powerbook is the best laptop there is. 1 inch thick, 17 in. of screen real estate, 802.11g, Bluetooth, seriously nice sounding speakers, even the f*cking battery looks awesome, extremely crisp screen, the most quiet laptop there is, 60 GB of hard disk space, 1 GB of RAM, DVD-R, zenon keyboard backlight, . . . I mean dear god. This is just the beginning of why Apple won't disappear. Dell, Gateway, etc. have had plenty of time to build such a laptop. But they haven't. As for Windows OS, it didn't start really improving until Linux came into the picture (I remember the demo Gates gave of Win2k and how proud he was that his copy hasn't crashed for like 90 days or so . . . this improvement would have never happened to Windows if it were not for the stability of linux on the server-side.) As for linux, it's trying too hard to copy Windows (obviously there are differences, but has anyone noticed the scary similarities that are there on purpose?). I mean, why would the linux community say they are better than Windows by copying things like the user interface? And Solaris? If it were that great, why didn't Sun use it instead of linux for their Java Desktop System? Yes, I have heard the reasons, but they all lose its thunder when the fact still remains that Sun passed up its own OS to adopt linux for the desktop. It is a shame because Solaris is king of POSIX. It was doing such a great job on the thread front, and Sun also put great efforts into its TCP/IP stack and stability. And where is IBM with their OS? OS/2???! IBM's attempt to hijack linux and use its price point to compete in the name of innovation is absolutely not inspiring me. Might I mention Sun is doing the same? Apple has done to OS X what the KDE and Gnome communities have wanted to do for linux for way too long. I am going to stop typing because I am going to digress into all there is to rant about in the computing industry. Last edited: Feb 5, 2004 14. ### testifyLook, a puppy!Registered Senior Member Messages: 508 How many top end games (new releases that are among the top 10 on the shelves right now) can be run on a mac? 15. ### CounslerCoffeeRegistered Senior Member Messages: 4,997 You have to admit that it's a good machine. Back when I was in college, as a Graphics Design major, the mac G5 was the only thing that could handle photoshop and .TIFs. The old Window machines couldn't do much and crashed constantly. Also, video editing is done easily on a Mac. And while I personally wouldn't own a Mac G5, I would put down the money for one of their laptops. We're talking top of the line machines right there. Has a Mac war come to Sciforums? 16. ### CuriousGeneSupreme Allied CommanderRegistered Senior Member Messages: 114 LOL. If games are the only thing you've got on OS X, then my case rests. And besides, when game developers use OpenGL along with DirectX, their game is easily portable (think Quake III). I think with the upcoming upgrade to OpenGL, more developers will consider writing in OpenGL so that both linux and OS X are supported. And no flame wars between OpenGL and DirectX because we're not done with Apple vs. all the other crap war yet!!! Hee. 17. ### testifyLook, a puppy!Registered Senior Member Messages: 508 Well all Macs have going for them is the fact that they kick ass for any kind of multimedia editting. According to you they even have to rip off Microsoft's leading office suite (what's the chance that Apple could make heir own? I mean they DID just rake in$60 million in the last quarter

).

You said they use Java as a "first class citizen", even though it there are very few evironments where it should be. Tell me how a Mac can perform so well and yet use such an inefficient language(http://osnews.com/story.php?news_id=5602)?

Isn't it based off of the FreeBSD core? Apparently Apple can sell an OS based on a free product for close to \$130. Why not just go out and download FreeBSD and throw it on your PC? I think it would feel a hell of a lot more like a Unix/Linux box.

About my game comment: I was merely making the point that Macs are not a good all-around system. They still have their flaws. Quake III is definately NOT NEW.

18. ### Wrong RobotRegistered Senior Member

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if you ask me, Mac OS X is the pinnacle all around 'good' system.

the only thing that it's weak with is games, and that's only because there are less of them.

look at the facts:
Doesn't crash all the time
no viruses
comes with all the software you need to do most average computing
all said software works well together and with the system and with the hardware

what else do you need to make it a good all around system?
are games really that important for you? considering there ARE still many great games on mac os X
call of duty, warcraft 3, halo, UT2k3, fallout 1&2...etc.

I don't get how you can say it's not a good all around system, just because you don't use it. Surely the fact that millions others find it to be the perfect system for them speaks volumes that it's a useful platform.

hmm, actually, no, I see where you're coming from, but I wonder what your experience with macs has been?

I mean, for me, windows is pretty much useless, not because you can't do things on it, but because I can do them all on my mac, and generally it works better. I try to stay away from windows if I can, but that doesn't mean I don't use it ever, we have a gaming PC that we built at home, that gets regular use.

I don't HATE windows, but I really don't see how it is so popular when so many non-geek windows users I talk to seem to really dislike their computers.

I really don't get how you can say that the only thing macs have going for them is multimedia, that's just...false. Even if you told me I could do all the same things on a windows machine(which I actually doubt) it's more than just doing those things, it's about how you do them and how convenient it is for you.

My computer works for me, I don't work for my computer.

19. ### buffysRegistered LoserRegistered Senior Member

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:bugeye: Saying mac ripped off Microsoft Office is like saying window's ripped off iTunes. They're simply apps that are available on both platforms, why the hell would apple make a different office suite? they're perfectly good programs. I would be pissed off if they wasted time and money on that, if it ain't broke don't fix it. Windows, for example, is "broke" thus OSX, Windows Media Player is "broke" thus Quicktime, etc., etc. I only want Apple to step in when the alternatives are crap.

Last edited: Feb 5, 2004
20. ### testifyLook, a puppy!Registered Senior Member

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Let's just say I havn't had a lot of experience with an Mac OS. I do a lot of things with my computer. I play games, do word processing, database managment, website hosting, programming, audio editting, video editing, photo editing, listen to music, surf the internet etc.. Pretty much I do everything that I can possibly do with my computer, yet for some reason I don't have any problems with it. I run Windows XP, a MS product. It works great. I couldn't hope for a better OS actually. To all of those who complain about how Windows performs...do you actually know how to use it? I would seriously doubt your ability with computers if you can't get XP to work for you. It doesn't exactly require a masters degree. You don't have to sacrifice small animals in order to get it to work properly. I guess what I'm saying is that it might not be a great idea to compare one OS to another when it's possible that you don't have the slightest idea of what you're doing.

I didn't realize MS released a copy of their own itunes. You say windows is broke...look to my rant above.

In response to wrong robots post...the fact that an OS doesn't have viruses doesn't mean it's secure. It simply means that it is unpopular.

I'm assuming all of those games are ports. For all I know they could be using a WineX clone. I just know they aren't widely sold out of box for the mac.

21. ### CuriousGeneSupreme Allied CommanderRegistered Senior Member

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I'm comparing OS's and know a hell of a lot about them. Listen kid, I've used Windows since the days of 3.x. Yeah, that's right, in the days when networking wasn't even on by default and you had to fuck with the winsock shit. I started writing software in DOS 3 in the days of EMM386 extensions and worrying about HIMEM. My love of OS X simply comes from it's beautiful marriage of Unix, a sophisticated and wonderous UI, and it's ability to run main stream software applications such as MS Office.

Of course you can do similar things on a Windows box. I too have seen it

But, I will never forget the day when my 17 in. PowerBook arrived and I fired up OS X. I started chatting on iChat and my god . . . I fell in love with IM all over again! I kept telling my friend that it was so cool to IM via iChat . . . exhilirating. Of course, my friend had no idea what on god's green earth I was talking about because she was on her AOL IM. Shit, even the Metal L&F in Java looked ok in Aqua (and damn Metal is ass ugly, I sincerely hope "Ocean" will be much nicer). The rendezvous feature is extremely cool too. I stream my music to my coworkers everyday and they love me for it. Sure you can do this in Windows (you can even do this in Irix, lol). However, the inspiration I feel when I see my friend's music show up via rendezvous in my iTunes window when she arrives at work is worth it alone.

:m:

22. ### jpsValued Senior Member

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Here's my problem with Macs, they just don't die. I'm typing this on an iBook, my present computer, next to it is a green iMac that I used prior to this thats still in working condition and about 5 or years old I believe. I also have a PowerMac 5600, and even a duo with the dock(circe 1992), an LC III and even a MacSE(anyone remember those?) All of them, in perfect working condition, making me unwilling to throw them out. Thats a lot of wasted space.
Now my father, my girlfriend and my brothers all use PCs, and they die anywhere from a year to three years after you get them, and you can throw them away guilt free and buy a new one, therefore avoiding all the wasted space. Hopefully Apple has rectified this problem with the iBook and this computer will die around the time it becomes too obsolete to use, but I'm not optimistic.

So, to answer the thread title, even if apple goes out of business, mac will never die.

23. ### buffysRegistered LoserRegistered Senior Member

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huh? MS didn't. My point is apple made a version of iTunes for windows and MS made a version of office for apple. I don't see how that's a case of ripping something off. Now windows, the concept of windows (as used in the windows OS), that's an example of something being ripped off. Taking an original idea from someone else and incorporating it into a rival program. So, just to be clear:

Apple having MS software ported to it's OS - not ripped off.
Windows having Apple software ported to it's OS - not ripped off
Windows (again the concept) being used in the windows OS - ripped off

I'm not trying to start an argument about windows though, just trying to illustrate the point (Bill paid Apple in the end so its water under the bridge anyway). You said apple was ripping off office suite, that's just nonsense.

As far as windows not being broke and if people have problems then they don't know how to use their computers well, perhaps that's true. Let me give you an example of one of the majors differences between windows and osx in my experience. a friend of mine (a mechanic) has a car that would have been scrap years ago but he tinkers endlessly and it keeps running. If I had that car it'd be on blocks, I'm not a mechanic and have no desire to become one. My point is you don't need an intimate understanding of software and computers to keep a mac running smoothly, with windows you do. It's the difference between a '76 pinto and a '04 ferrari, both cars will take you where you want to go but I'd rather be in the ferrari.