Should men have a say in abortion ?

Discussion in 'Ethics, Morality, & Justice' started by RainbowSingularity, May 25, 2019.

  1. billvon Valued Senior Member

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    18,686
    Right. I didn't claim it did. I claimed that education reduces the odds of smoking or massive drinking for women - and indeed, for anyone (not just women.)
    Correct! It's just one way to reduce the incidence of those vices. You are catching on! Great!
    DING DING DING! And I support and applaud people who work to educate women (and society at large) to reduce the odds of unwanted pregnancy, the need for abortions, health-damaging amounts of drinking, and smoking. No need to ban smoking, drinking - or abortion. Glad you agree.
     
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  3. parmalee peripatetic artisan Valued Senior Member

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    You're the one pushing the "motherhood as punishment" line; everyone else sees the compelling a person to carry a pregnancy to term, against her wishes, as a punishment. Not surprising, really, as the "motherhood as punishment" notion really stems from the anti-abortion crowd who, say, makes exceptions in cases of rape and incest. The logic: since you engaged in sex willingly, you ought to be punished for it. So much for "sanctity of life" and all that.
     
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  5. Musika Last in Space Valued Senior Member

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    You are not capable of discussing this topic.
     
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  7. Musika Last in Space Valued Senior Member

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    Sorry, my bad.
    I read your comment as saying "It doesn't happen to anyone"

    Of course, education and access to good medical care will reduce the instances of women doing that. (of anyone doing that, actually.)
     
  8. wegs Matter & Pixie Dust Valued Senior Member

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    Not every woman will view an unwanted pregnancy in the same light, but every woman should have reasonable, safe options afforded to her. Would you agree?

    What are your views on the “morning after” pill?
     
  9. Jeeves Valued Senior Member

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    The first sentence is still there, exactly as before. The edit was simply to complete the story of those poor women you want to punish.

    If the mods see fit to suspend me for telling you to walk mile in your victims' shoes, that's fine.
    Your side has state legislators passing laws that do exactly that to women.
     
    Last edited: Jun 3, 2019
  10. Write4U Valued Senior Member

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    For all those pro-lifers who are so determined to save the unborn on the premise of "sanctity of life", let Carlin straighten out your thinking about our moral adherence to the "sanctity of life".
     
  11. Jeeves Valued Senior Member

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    4,702
    That's the actual supporters of bad laws. I have a pretty good idea what moves them.
    I was talking about the tactics of these duplicitous internet advocates for anything-but-social-justice. They don't only twist and churn reproductive rights issues, they do the same with end-of-life decisions, equal marriage, public education, fair employment .... Some of them even advocate for those abhorrent monuments to the valiant defenders of slavery.
     
    Last edited: Jun 3, 2019
  12. parmalee peripatetic artisan Valued Senior Member

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    You are not capable of communicating in English: Extraneous? Odd choice--especially as you stuck with it--but workable; though, within the immediate context of what was being discussed, you actually seemed to be struggling with the concept. Your understanding of the term "motherhood"--the state of "being a mother," but here, specifically, simply the state of being one who has given birth--is by no means incorrect, but you're unlikely to find anyone who uses the term in that manner.

    Then there's your seeming inability to comprehend most of that to which you are responding. And your inability to recognize that most of RainbowSingularity's responses to you are both on topic and relevant to what you have said.

    Ideas of reference, and possibly delusions of reference--and, worse yet, projection (I might be thinking of another thread here). Again, these present a real impediment to effective and meaningful communication.

    Incidentally, I have inhabited two worlds in which persons were inclined to appropriate ordinary, everyday terminology and assign wholly new and very specific meanings to them, though not wholly unrelated to the more commonplace meanings. I'm comfortable with it--in it's appropriate context. But were I to use, say, spurs or traces outside of their usual context, and with their more contemporaneous assignations, I would not be surprised by some backlash and criticism.
     
    Last edited: Jun 3, 2019
  13. Beer w/Straw Transcendental Ignorance! Valued Senior Member

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    Who actually said that?
     
  14. Jeeves Valued Senior Member

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    I did. In the context of: You're scared shitless of women; therefore you need to keep them subjugated through procreational bondage, to punish women who have sex by forcing them to carry a baby to term, regardless of how it was engendered, what it does to her life, whether the baby itself is viable, and whether she can take care of it. This was distributed over a number of posts, in whole sentences, with content and grammar and everything, but Musika distilled it down to his usual inappropriate bumper-sticker.
     
  15. Beer w/Straw Transcendental Ignorance! Valued Senior Member

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    I wasn't paying attention to this thread on purpose.

    Hence, I can wait if Musika wants to elaborate on what he meant, I think.
     
  16. billvon Valued Senior Member

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    No, you did not. Here's what you said in that post:

    Should civilians have a say on how military personnel are deployed?
    While i think most civilians wish to be able to have an ability to choose, how many are willing to put their own life, income and career on the line ?
    is the concept of risk equal to a civilian's ability to conceive the reality that they have no personal risk or physical bodily accountability from ?
    a body of their peers, whom decide what is legally just for military deployment ? peers = the armed forces

    Those might well be questions that interest you. They are not an answer to the question "why should you (and men in general) have a say in abortion?"
     
  17. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    30,562
    You instead lie about what others are saying, in order to attack them personally.
    Like this:
    But curiously enough, lying about whether someone did that is protected.
    You and the rest of the fundies being the prime and shining example of that general approach here - sometimes minus the "hatred" bit, which was a lie anyway (so it might as well be about you along with the rest of your projections).
    Or by punitive legislation, or anything else. So that consideration - "solely" - is obviously irrelevant here, and you had no good reason to post it.
    Back to the topic:
    or rather, to the next attempt at avoiding the topic:
    Despite your efforts to avoid the topic, this is not a debate about abortion. It is a debate about how much coercive control and punitive authority men should have over what happens inside a woman's or girl's body, and why.
    And equivalently extraneous factors - no more relevant than sprained ankles - are the content of every single one of your posts here so far.
     
  18. Beer w/Straw Transcendental Ignorance! Valued Senior Member

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    I forgot to mention I'm extremely stupid; a two year old can out wit me!

    So....

    :EDIT:

    Oh, that may be an expression of anger where I don't care about your opinions anyway cause you're a bunch of fucking morons anyway.
     
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2019
  19. Beer w/Straw Transcendental Ignorance! Valued Senior Member

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    5,740
    Come on retards, convince everyone!

    All you are is disgusting....
     
  20. Musika Last in Space Valued Senior Member

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    I'm not sure what you are trying to achieve by unpacking the hyperlink already given in the quote, but it's pretty much identical to why civilians should have a say in how the military is utilized.
    Haven't we been through all this before? Fast tracking silly agendas? Playing Gianna Jessen as the ultimate authority on the subject by playing the same game rules and so forth?
     
  21. Beer w/Straw Transcendental Ignorance! Valued Senior Member

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    5,740
    And this doesn't touch upon abortion, does it?

    Speak up!

    :EDIR:

    Don't be a coward.
     
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2019
  22. Musika Last in Space Valued Senior Member

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    If the whole society is geared up on an unreasonable foundation, then what becomes reasonable is simply sustaining the malady. If the legal, social and biological realities are completely at odds with each other (of which, the subject of abortion is but one example that pales in comparison to others), then it is chaos and a race to the bottom without the "reasonable" safeguards and chaos and a race to the bottom (although arguably, at a slower pace) with them.


    It doesn't essentially change the predicament or the attitudes that give the problem form (but for as long as one remains oblivious to those factors, one could say it is more efficient).
     
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2019
  23. Musika Last in Space Valued Senior Member

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    2,701
    Google Gianna Jessen (if you dare), and prepare yourself for a silly argument.
     

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