Should high cholesterol be actually the culprit for heart disease ?

Discussion in 'Chemistry' started by river, Mar 30, 2013.

  1. river Valued Senior Member

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    I have been reading the book by , Jonny Bowden , PH.D., C.N.S

    And Stephen Sinatra , MD., F.A.C.C., F.A.C.N. , C.N.S. , C.B.T.

    Called " The Great Cholesterol Myth "

    In it they are saying that cholesterol is not bad generally


    what you need to know

    * cholesterol is a minor player in heart disease

    * cholesterol levels are a poor predictor of heart attacks

    * half the people with heart disease have normal cholesterol

    * half the people with elevated cholesterol have healthy hearts

    * lowering cholesterol has extremely limited benefits


    The causes of heart attacks seems to be more based on ;

    Stress , sugar , inflammation and oxidation

    Thoughts
     
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2013
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  3. river Valued Senior Member

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  5. Read-Only Valued Senior Member

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    River, evidently you'll fall for anything that comes along. <shrug> Did you even notice that those three sites are ALL trying to SELL you something?? Books, herbal "remedies", etc.

    Meanwhile, the REAL authorities on the subject - organizations that don't try to sell you anything - like the American Heart Association, the CDC and others are in complete disagreement with these SCAM artists.
     
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  7. river Valued Senior Member

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    Read the book

    There is alot more to this subject
     
  8. Read-Only Valued Senior Member

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    Sure - scammers just love to write (and sell garbage).
     
  9. river Valued Senior Member

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    This is about your , mine , our health

    Unless you are a bio-chemist , which you are not , neither am I , inform yourself , so I read

    Why wouldn't you really ? Or do you behind closed doors ? Probably
     
  10. Read-Only Valued Senior Member

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    River, it's all about - and for - gullible people like you who have a pathological distrust of "big pharma." You and your kind who jump on every conspiracy theory that comes along are exactly the targets these scammers are looking for. They are NOT in it for anyone's health, they are just after foolish people's money. End of story.
     
  11. Trippy ALEA IACTA EST Staff Member

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    10,890
    It's been known, or suspected, for some time that inflammation has a role in heart disease, this is old news (at least to me anyway). That doesn't mean that excess cholesterol has no role to play in heart disease, it simply means that the heart is a complicated organ and there are multiple factors that influence heart disease.

    High cholesterol puts you at risk, but not everyone with high cholesterol will have a heart attack.
    High inflammation markers put you at risk, but not everyone with high inflammation markers will have a heart attack.
    Visceral fat (as opposed to subcutaneous fat) will put you at risk, but not everybody with visceral fat will have a heart attack.

    That's just the way statistics, probability and risk work.
     
  12. river Valued Senior Member

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    Your an idiot and I don't don't say this lightly , you are

    I'm going to give a list of qualified people who have read the book , this will take a bit of time ;

    - Joe Graedon, M.S. , and Teresa Graedon , PH.D

    - Mark Houston M.D., M.S., F.S.C.P., F.A.H.A., F.A.S.H., F.A.C.N.

    -Ann Louise Gittleman , PH.D., C.N.S.

    -Peter H.Langsjoen, M.D., F.A.C.C.

    -Stephanie Seneff, B.S., M.S., E.E., PH.D

    -Hywel Davies, M.D., F.R.C.P., F.A.C.P., F.A.C.C.

    -Todd Lepine, M.D.

    -Colette Heimowitz, M.SC.

    -Prudence Hall, M.D.

    - Larry MCCleary, M.D.

    - Jennifer Landa, M.D.

    - Sara Gottfried , M.D.

    - Hyla Cass, M.D.

    - Alan Christianson , N.M.D.

    - Jacob Teitelbaum, M.D.

    - Daniel Amen, M.D.

    - Dean Raffelock , D.C. , DIPL.AC., D.A.A.I.M., D.I.B.A.K., D.A.C.B.N., C.C.N.

    - William Davis , M.D.

    - Mark Hyman, M.D.

    - Christiane Northrup, M.D.


    When this many qualified people have read the book and give it the thumbs up , its time to listen and read
     
  13. river Valued Senior Member

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    9,206
    From what I have read so far it is the type of cholesterol that is important

    For instance , LDL measure is of two basic types , A and B

    B is the one to worry about

    To add so is HDL-3

    So the cholesterol test one should be getting is the Berkeley cholesterol test which is more specific
     
  14. river Valued Senior Member

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    9,206
    From the same book

    WHAT YOU NEED TO KNOW

    * The theory that fat and cholesterol cause heart disease became widely accepted despite evidence to the contrary. This evidence deserves to be reexamined . The case needs to be reopened.

    * Many doctors did not agree with the cholesterol myth and questioned the science on which it was based .

    * The studies upon which the cholesterol myth was based were later found to be problematic.

    * The adoption of the cholesterol myth by mainstream organizations and the government had a strong political component to it.
     
  15. river Valued Senior Member

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    Just to add

    Cholesterol is made by every cell in your body

    And the most amount is found in the brain , 25% and is important in the neuron sheath
     
  16. Trippy ALEA IACTA EST Staff Member

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    10,890
    Yet another factor in the equation, yes.
     
  17. Trippy ALEA IACTA EST Staff Member

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    Most of this is bullshit, to be honest.

    Science evolves, get over it. The evidence fully suupports cholesterol increasing heart disease risk. Most of what you have had to say appears to come from confounding "Increases risk of heart disease" with "causes heart disease".
     
  18. Trippy ALEA IACTA EST Staff Member

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    Carbon dioxide is also produced by every cell in your body. That doesn't mean that inhaling excessive amounts of it won't cause disease.
     
  19. river Valued Senior Member

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    Yes

    It depends on the TYPE of cholesterol one looks at , LDL-B is bad , HDL-3 , is bad , but the rest are benifical

    To generalize cholesterol is the mistake
     
  20. river Valued Senior Member

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    That is just plain ignorant response , the body doesn't NEED carbon monoxide , it is a consequence of respiration

    Cholesterol is integral to the functioning of all cells in the body and more so , as I have said , to the brain function
     
  21. Trippy ALEA IACTA EST Staff Member

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    Yet it seems that everybody except for you understands that.

    I didn't say carbon monoxide, I said carbon dioxide. You understand the difference, right?

    And you've missed the point, there are plenty of things that the body requires to function correctly that are toxic when there is too much present, or they're in the wrong place.
     
  22. river Valued Senior Member

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    The authors of book understand and so do those who have read and gave reviews on the book

    All of which were at least M.D.
     
  23. river Valued Senior Member

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    My mistake to the first statement

    On the second

    As I said before the only cholesterol that is harmful to the heart is LDL-B and HDL-3

    The rest of the cholesterol are not harmful

    Lowering cholesterol to much is a danger zone
     

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